When cliche is nothing more than a excuse to complain about the story that the reader don't like.....

In most of fanfic, I sometimes saw many criticism that because it share some tropes with other fiction/fanfiction, it become a cliche and a bad story; despite besides that, the story are very different than the other stories. IMO, because it share some tropes, it doesn't automatically become cliche. How to see if someone that criticize the story like that should be considered or ignored?

edited 25th Jul '16 9:55:48 PM by SeekerSS

Does the cliché add the right entertainment value? Then you're more on the right track and can leave that comment where it is.

Is the cliché distracting and unintentionally affecting the plot? Then you might want to give your comments another look to see if something's gotten out of hand.

Just like there's no such thing as a bad idea, only bad execution, there's no such thing as a cliché, just clunky writing. Every single thing under the sun has been done before and has some kind of example for how it made its author rich. The only reason things suddenly feel like a cliché is because they're not fun to read in the context of the story.

Alternatively, is this a comment from a reader whose opinion you should care about? If yes, rethink what you're writing, because you might be alienating your target audience. If not, then who cares? If you're willing to accept that you lose those people, keep going with what you're doing. Whatever you do, just make sure you're recognize the consequences - good and bad. :)

There're also the discriminatory cliches. Those should be avoided more.

I don't agree that they should be avoided. I think they can serve a plot or character very well, but that because a lot of people aren't aware of the messages they're sending, discriminatory clichés come off as irrelevant, and that's the worst sin in writing of all. It's bad execution.

You can be offensive if you have a reason for it. If you know playing to a certain stereotype will come off one way and you're purposely trying for that kind of reaction, you can get to some fantastic satire or exploration of human nature or general awareness piece or just a well-written asshole. But if you write it badly because you don't understand what you're saying, you come off as the asshole instead and you won't even be able to explain why.

For those guys writing edgy to be edgy, I don't think they count. They have their audience of people who agree - there's an audience for everything - but come on, it's usually pretty obvious when someone's trying to be a dick.

Thanks everyone.

Mind telling me what's "discriminatory cliche" is? When a character made a racist statement or something?

Hellomoto brought up so that's probably who you should ask, but sure - racist, sexist, prejudiced all around. That's how I read it. And it's not necessarily confined to a comment. It could be an ongoing theme or a subplot.

edited 27th Jul '16 9:23:27 AM by Tartra

The way I read it, "discriminatory cliche" is not when a character has discriminatory views, but when the story treats them as true.

That's what I meant, yep. Come to think of it, discriminatory cliches are very useful when portrayed as a character thing that is wrong, because people can recognize the cliche on sight and see immediately that it's wrong.

For example, having a man say "An woman? Shouldn't you be in the kitchen?" is a blatant display of in-universe sexism. More context (e.g. the reactions of the woman, other women and men, as well as how well the woman did outside the 'kitchen') would be required to fully establish that it's not the story or author being sexist, but using a cliche helps to stop readers from taking the character's sexism seriously.

It's another thing when all the female characters are housewives and other stay-at-homers (e.g. Girl Friday), especially when coupled with other sexist beliefs ("Protect the women!", all men are in combat roles but none of the women are, etc) that don't get challenged by the story.

edited 28th Jul '16 12:02:19 AM by hellomoto