Re:Zero kara Hajimeru Isekai Seikatsu (Re: Life in a Different World from Zero)

Gee, I wonder why that could be?

Why exactly?

I am sincere in this question.

Part of it just seems to be the usual Hype Backlash with any anime that becomes ridiculously popular.

When a series is THAT big it invites a lot more scrutiny from people.

Well, I don't know exactly what's being complained about, but I just watched this and personally I had a pretty big problem with the ending revolving around a relationship that had, halfway through the story, become a "prize" for the main character to earn. And while he made a speech about how he respects her now, he still had to trick her into leaving to safety, so he clearly doesn't respect her that much. Honestly it'd just be a little thing that bugged me about the show if they hadn't tried to base their entire emotional climax on it.

Emilia was a fun character at first and then she just faded into the background.

edited 21st Sep '16 1:33:31 AM by Clarste

My main issue/disappointment with this show, as it stands now, is that it turned out not to be a deconstruction of various wish-fulfillment anime genres (harem / Magical Girlfriend / fantasy world where definitely-not-self-insert-guy can be The Hero). Instead, it was really just trying to legitimize itself, not by making itself fundamentally different from what it appeared to be, but by putting the protagonist through the grinder for 24 episodes so he could "earn" his position as Masculine Fantasy Man. The finale kinda sealed the deal on this... it was a completely straight Damsel in Distress plot.

It worked, too, because the prevailing opinion seems to be that it's okay that it ended in a stereotypical way, because Subaru suffered a bunch to get here, so that means it's still unique. That's not really how this works... in fact, boy becomes man through suffering and hardship and gets the girl in the end is the archetypal heroic journey. This is as un-subversive as it gets. That doesn't make it total garbage or anything, but I guess I was just hoping for something more interesting. It mainly feels like Currently Popular Anime Tropes: The Anime, and while they patched all of them together very well, it... well, let's just say I don't agree with the popularity of some of those tropes.

Yeah, I would also agree with that. I thought what happened in episode 13 was a really interesting place for the story to go (with his love interest letting him know that he was putting her on a pedestal and maybe doing this more for himself than for her), but nothing actually ever came from that? The big breakdown and rebuilding moment in episode 18 basically put him back into the exact position he started the story in: believe that you're the hero of your own story and never stop trying to be the best person you can be.

Which would be fine advice on its own, but that doesn't address what was actually his core failing in the first place: believing that he's the chosen one who's the only person who can fix everything. And, well, the story proves that attitude to be completely correct in that everyone else is useless without him to guide them, and Emilia's attitude towards him in the end doesn't even really make that much sense given how they parted.

edited 21st Sep '16 1:42:00 AM by Clarste

It didn't end on the actual climax of Arc 3, IE, showing where Subaru actually went wrong in this part of the arc. Remember that he was about to say something before the credits rolled. If they had kept gong, it would have ended on the most awful cliffhanger in the show.

The thing about that is, that is actually true in the meta sense. As much as the story tried to say "Subaru shouldn't be trying to be at the center of the spotlight", the fact he is the main character and his actions are what move the story forward.

So its kind of a lose-lose situation; if the story followed through and showed that Subaru just takes a backseat to let someone else work, then there'd be really no reason to follow him as a main character considering his overall lack of impact. If he does actually play The Hero straight, then it subverts the lessons it was trying to teach.

That's why I think when people go into these types of shows expecting a "subversion" of standard genre tropes, they ignore how that would actually affect the series` overall narrative. Its hard to deconstruct these types of shows while still keeping the tropes that make them popular to begin with. Its kind of like the War Is Hell trope; the overall message of it is kind of marred by how much effort goes into make these supposedly "terrible wars" exciting to watch for the viewer.

edited 21st Sep '16 7:29:06 AM by BlackYakuzu94

That would sort of depend on the story they were trying to tell.

With the kind of story they went with (epic fantasy battles/saving the world/entire kingdoms at stake, and wanting to have Subaru at the center of that) then yeah I guess. But if the story was way more character-driven and about Subaru's growth rather than plot-driven, you could easily justify his position as MC if his development was meticulous and interesting. Like there's all this big fantasy stuff going on in the background but it isn't the main focus.

I haven't finished the season yet, granted, but based on what I've seen I think I have to agree with the criticisms being voiced above about how Re:Zero doesn't really end up being a deconstruction at the end.

That's the thing about these genres, its always about the fantasy world and the things going on in it than the characters themselves. Its pretty telling that the readers don't know fuck all about Subaru's life before he came to the world beyond what he told us, and even after that its not particularly dwelled upon, because that's not the point.

But yea, I wouldn't go as far to say that its not a deconstruction but simply a Decon-Recon Switch; it subverts and tears down some tropes, only to play them completely straight in the end. I still think the series was fine, but I will admit that it might've been far more interesting for things to not play out so stereotypically..

Which is why I think having the story be about the characters would have actually been a lot more subversive.

In fact, the stuff about Subaru's life prior to being thrown in the fantasy world is something I was thinking about a lot and was actually gonna post about, but I just forgot.

I feel like it was kind of a missed opportunity to make him a more interesting character in a lot of ways. One might say "it doesn't matter to the story and his life probably wasn't interesting" but I feel like telling us about what kind of person he was before then and what led him to become a NEET in the first place would have made him much more compelling.

Of course now I'm just getting into the story I would have written instead....

I don't have a real issue with the anime ending because there's no promise a second season will be made to adapt the 4th arc and beyond.

edited 21st Sep '16 9:03:38 AM by VeryMelon

did you see how popular Re: Zero got? It's getting a second season.

Are things gonna get even more fucked up in the continuing novels?

Well sure it'll happen, just not in the near future. The anime covered the currently released Light Novels. Until those Light Novels adapt more material from the Web Novel, a second season isn't going to happen anytime soon.

This is exactly why LN protags tend to be so plain personality wise; the average reader doesn't care about them as people, they're just there so they have a "link" to the world and live vicariously through them. Its more about living a power fantasy than learning about interesting characters for them.

Its why I think this series in particular is kind of marred down by its target demographic; for as much as it could have been different and potentially something more interesting, it still has to sell to the audience and those Wish-Fulfillment tropes so common in LN's are what sell the most nowadays.

Kinda sad really because yea, I'd read a series like this that focused more on building characterization than being just another power fantasy.

edited 21st Sep '16 9:16:21 AM by BlackYakuzu94

The ending of Arc 3 onwards show that seeing the series as wish fulfillment is not only wrong, it still rips apart the isekai genre to pieces.

This will be more evident when Echidna's spirit shows the alternate timelines in which Subaru dies in and the consequences they have, and how even though he gets stronger, the authorities of the archbishops he absorbs are too weak to use due to his broken mana gate and he trains for a whole year in using a whip and is still a low class warrior in the worlds power hierarchy.

And on that note, I'm off to read some delicious MAL salt.

Felix is best anime trap ever, if not in the top 10

I have no doubt that this isn't really the end, or the start of Subaru being the hero 24/7; putting the screws on Subaru and everyone he cares about is this show's entire shtick, and since it's far from the end of the story it'll surely jump right back into it. But I also have no doubt that the actual final ending will be pretty similar to what we just saw. As with any anime-adaptation ending, they gave it enough closure that it would work as a The Adventure Continues sort of thing, and a thematically appropriate ad for the light novel, just in case it doesn't get renewed (though obviously it will be). And it didn't come out of nowhere, either; they built up to this through the entire season.

I'm gonna be super predictable now and compare this to Madoka, so, spoilers for that, and The Movie: This is like if that show had ended with Homura beating up Walpurgisnacht and saving Madoka. Chucking out all the themes of futility and sacrifice and dissociation and so forth for "oh wait, actually you can just muscle your way through and win. Hooray!" And, what do you know, The Movie actually does let her "save" Madoka, and even Homura herself can see how messed-up it is. (Mainly because she has little respect or understanding of Madoka's wishes, much like how Subaru knows practically nothing about Emilia but wants to be her savior anyway. They flirted with the idea of actually addressing this problem back in the "Julius beats up Subaru" episode, but then it was just sort of dropped.)

edited 21st Sep '16 10:34:42 PM by Kotomikun

Sidestepping the controversy over the use of the word "trap", I think what made Felix work was essentially that no one made a big deal of it. His femininity wasn't a running gag, it was just part of who he is. He wasn't a male character playing a prank on the audience or anyone else, he was just a cute catboy who liked to wear dresses.

edited 21st Sep '16 10:53:01 PM by Clarste

Finally watched the finale. Julius laying down the smackdown was neat, but I preferred Subaru setting Betelspider on fire, then punching him in the face. Screw that Satella stalker.

The ending part was overly sappy and made me cringe the way episode 18 did, but I can deal with it. I also tend to like happy endings, and this one seems earned at least. Emilia does seem like a "prize" right now, but I've been lightly spoiled on future events, so I'm okay with things as they are now. Because otherwise it would have been a cruel, cruel cliffhanger.

On the subject of deconstruction, Re:Zero isn't really one, for reasons Clarste and Kotomikun alreadly elucidated. I would point to Hai To Gensou No Grimgar as a better deconstruction of the "trapped in a fantasy world" story.

That's not to say I didn't enjoy Re:Zero, though. It was a good show; could have been better, but damn if it wasn't a thrilling ride. While I object to the show being called a deconstruction (even on this very wiki!), I think it was a brave move to make the MC so pathetic and polarizing, and the direction, animation, sound design, etc. were often on point.

EDIT: I also appreciated that Emilia didn't fall in love with Subaru then and there.

edited 22nd Sep '16 9:27:27 AM by fillerdude

One could call the few nods to girls saying or voicing that they wouldn't fall for (or feeling indifferent towards) Subaru and meaning it, pandering to those who just want to see something pretend to not be a harem - this if one were a cynical shithead, and also me

I do think that keeping Rem's affections being the only quite overt romantic thing towards Sub Sub is better than outright pushing other girls on him. Yet I must say that the problems regarding the development of other crucial females being implied, and not shown because they are not immediately interacting with him, might just be an oversight from a pure information and narrative sense. The focus on Subaru "Professional Fuccboi" Natsuki is, as with any story, not without consequences in other areas.

I pray for a complete adaptation, I NEED MOAR!

Here is the first translated interlude from after the anime:

https://zeroliveblog.wordpress.com/2016/09/18/rezero-vol-3-interlude-carriage-one-act/