I say things.
That trailer wasn't what I expected from a Bay movie.
I'll watch this since I always watch these movies. I've only liked the first, but I keep coming back. 
Is this Prime really any more "kill crazy" than your standard action hero?
I say things.
Not at all. The issue, I think, is 2-fold:
- Optimus, in most of his incarnations, is peace-loving and only resorts to violence as a last resort.
- The brutality in which he dispatches foes. If it was a typical action movie, any of the scenes where Optimus kills people would be too graphic for a PG-13 film.
But I'm okay with Bay's Optimus. He's his own thing. Transformers Prime's Optimus is the best marriage of traditional Optimus and Bay's Optimus, I feel.
edited 6th Dec '16 5:39:06 AM by Cruherrx
"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
The same can be said of this Optimus. He certainly doesn't enjoy fights.
Perpetually Confused
It's harder to argue that Film!Optimus is peace loving when he attacks Decepticons who weren't doing anything, when they flee continues to relentlessly pursue them, and when they are disabled (after running for their lives) he executes them (Which, if a human was doing to another human, would be a war crime). All the while yelling things that'd make the average horror film stalker go "WTF" like "GIVE ME YOUR FACE" and doing the level of overkill that'd make the average grindhouse movie envious.
Like yeah, I believe the writers intend for him to be this peace loving Optimus, but they are so inept at film making they keep bringing it into question.
edited 6th Dec '16 6:22:15 AM by Ghilz
If this is about Demolishor, read up the Revenge of the Fallen tie in comics. Hell, it was stated the Decepticons were still on Earth because they were looking for something which is bad news for humans and Autobots alike.
As for executing him, what was the alternative? The Decepticons have proven prisons cannot hold them and I doubt the government would even want to pour any money into building a prison for them as they barely tolerate even having the Autobots on Earth.
He yells them in the midst of battle against relentless, implacable enemies. It's not like he just blurts these lines out in casual conversation. Also, look at how much damage the cons can take and how much larger they tend to be than your average Autobot. Optimus' attacks aren't him being a sadist, they're about making sure they stay down.
These movies have a lot of issues but Optimus isn't one of them.
Ehhhh... Optimus is kind of one of the issues
. In the first three films anyway. Not specifically for the previously stated reasons.
I say things.
Bay!Optimus killing Decepticons is fine. The issue is the way it's presented makes it seem like Optimus genuinely hates them down to ever fiber of his being. Like he would genocide them if given the option. There's never any hesitation in him when he's facing them. It's just at odds with what Optimus in other continuities typically preaches.
Optimus' ruthlessness works with the movieverse where Transformers are super fragile, so no, he isn't more kill-crazy than any action hero. WAY more kill-crazy than other Optimuses though.
Again, if you want to see an efficient leader Optimus that is also true to how the character most often is (really, I can only think of 2 continuities where Optimus isn't his usual self: Bayverse and the evil alternate universe of Shattered Glass), check out Transformers Prime.
"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
That all you got?
Prime is more like, right now, current world power politics. We prefer diplomacy, for the most part, but if you piss us off we will beat you into the ground until you can no longer stand up.
Plus while Prime was fully willing to co-exist with humanity, that changed with Age of Extinction where humans (even if they were only a small subset of humans led by a psycho) were hunting down his kind, his friends, who he had served with for what was likely centuries, and melting them down to make cheap knock-offs. They'll likely still be doing this in TLK.
And yeah, these movies have so much potential with the lore we get, but...it's a Michael Bay movie. In the hands of a competent director whose main draw wasn't huge set pieces with big explosions and sex appeal these movies could be awesome.
That is the face of a man who just ate a kitten. Raw.
Realize also that in the movies the Decepticons are far more ruthless and violent than other incarnations, they leave a massive body count in just about every encounter. It's a far cry from the often goofy imbeciles who retreat the instant things didn't go their way. And as shown in the Transformers Movie, Optimus has never really been a Thou Shalt Not Kill character, but one who does kill and regrets that is what he has to do in a war. To me it is kind of refreshing that when Bonecrusher splits apart a bus Optimus isn't pussyfooting about ending the threat. In the case of both Demolisher and Sideways, even if you thought they were fleeing combatants they were still causing significant property damage and loss of life in their wake.
Perpetually Confused
IDW Decepticons would like a word about that. Where they've devastated entire planets and juiced organic lifeforms (sentient ones) to make Energon. They've turned POW and some of their own members into suicide bombs where they are mode-locked into a bomb and dropped onto an enemy. They've smelted POW for their metals.
And who decided to engage them in the middle of Shanghai again, knowing very well they were going to flee? Without evacuating any civilians?
edited 6th Dec '16 9:53:27 AM by Ghilz
That all you got?
I think the original plan was "Don't let them get that far" but yeah, it was kind of short-sighted to not wait for them to get farther away.
That is the face of a man who just ate a kitten. Raw.
Perpetually Confused
Then why are the humans armed with weapons incapable of harming Decepticons as opposed to the Sabot rounds from the first movie? Most of them are carrying regular assault rifles. What did they think that was going to do?
Every civilian death is the work of the so called "good guys".
I thought they were expecting a small group. Not that giant they encountered.
(V)(;,,;)(V)
I say things.
I'm okay with movie!Prime being the way he is. This is a different universe, after all.
I'm not okay with the notion that he's a good guy. He's pragmatic, and fucking hates Decepticons.
I've never seen the old transformers cartoons in their entirety. My Transformers life is: TF Ri D (the one made in Japan), TF Armada, TF Energon, TF Cybertron, TF Prime, War for Cybertron, and Fall of Cybertron. I read some of the aligned comics and saw some of animated.
As you can probably see, the Decepticons I've experienced from childhood are pretty villainous and violent. The movie Decepticons are almost a step down. Very much so in terms of visual aesthetic.
"If you weren't so crazy I'd think you were insane."
Movie Optimus is a good guy. He's merely a lot more ruthless (and a lot more competent as a tactician) than most Optimuses are. Throughout all the movies, Optimus is still trying to protect the innocent from annihilation, so he's still a hero.
The difference is while G1 Optimus (in his original form) is more of a Superman type, Movie Optimus is more of a John Mc Clane type.
The circumstances Optimus faces in his the movies are also a lot more grim than they tend to be. In the first film Optimus states Cybertron is dead and Cybertronians are basically extinct barring him and his enemies. In most continuities the Cybertronian race is alive and well, just scattered all over the galaxy, and Cybertron's state tends to be less dire.
By the third film, Optimus has been forced to destroy his homeland alnd his race's hope of survival to save humankind only to then have mankind betray and slaughter his companions. His own brother betrayed him, his own mentor betrayed him, and now mankind did the same. Dude's led a harsh life, and this pushed him to extremes Optimuses don't tend to go.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Raz
Question.
Why does Derrick Wyatt's dislike of the Hot Rod design bear mentioning under "Disowned Adaptation" for the trivia section when he's had absolutely no role in creating Hot Rod, the TF movies, and only worked on one Transformers series?
My name has nothing to do with Psychonauts.
Disowned Adaptation is essentially for anyone connected to a work who expresses displeasure at a derivative work. In theory a Creator Backlash is when someone connected to the work directly expresses displeasure, but the two get mixed up all the time.
The movie series opens up with Blackout annihilating a human military base without hesitation, there is no indication that diplomacy is an option to these factions in any form until DOTM (where they had a Mexican Standoff and Autobots were taken prisoner in the battle of Chicago rather than immediately executed). All animated shows, video games and comics tend to blur the lines more such that there are splinter groups in each faction that are better or worse than the main team, with temporary truces or collaborations relatively common.
The thing about the Demolisher and Sideways fight is that NEST was tracking them, and it was said they evacuated the immediate area under the pretense of a gas leak. A common problem in just about any armed conflict is the realization that enemy combatants will be next to or occupying the same area as innocent civilians. Waiting to engage them in an empty desert is not a valid strategy, especially if the enemy catches on to that. The best option tends to be what they did, smoke them out and take them down with support already mobilized .
Perpetually Confused
Except, ya know, footage clearly shows they did not. There's people everywhere.
That all you got?
They evacuated the factory area, I guess. A busy highway is an entirely different thing.
That is the face of a man who just ate a kitten. Raw.
The irony is that I remember there were complaints about the climactic battle in Revenge of the Fallen taking place in the desert, away from civilians.
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
Revenge of the Fallen was the worst insult to geography ever made.
Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
That all you got?
Like Jordan being able to go to a fight in the Suez.
That is the face of a man who just ate a kitten. Raw.
Coz someone has to make the joke, it's in character for this kill crazy Optimus "GIVE ME YOUR FAAAACE!" Prime. It was just a matter of time before he went off the reservation.
:-P