Ambiguous Name: When She Smiles

This says that it might be a character that rarely smiles but is "in no way limited to them." The title is clearly explained in the first line and a half where it says that smiling makes her go from ordinary to gorgeous. By it's self the title implies a lot of things.

Seeing the real person behind the mask (and she's beautiful and happy) includes quite a few of the currently listed examples and is what my YKTTW Glimpse of Happiness is about. In it we've talked about the difference between, "A serious character is finally made to smile," vs "A plain or unremarkable person's smile makes them lovely." One is "When She Finally Smiles" and the other is "When She Smiles She's (Stated To Be) Beautiful."

It seems to me that it would be better just to tighten up When She Smiles to mean a character who rarely smiles smiles and how that is a beautiful thing that makes the audience and other characters in universe love her.

Which by the way fits with better with the title: "She's looks so sad in photographs, but I absolutely love her, when she smiles."

edited 3rd Oct '13 6:54:18 AM by Sackett

Clock is set.

Let's get a crowner.

For what it's worth, I agree with Sackett's last post completely on how the trope should be.

Agreed. I'd vote for something like that.

Shall we have a crowner then with that as an option?

The proposed change is:

Tighten up When She Smiles to mean "a character who rarely smiles smiles" and how that is "a beautiful thing" that makes the audience and other characters in universe "love her".

So the criteria for examples would be:

1: Character that rarely smiles (Emotionless Girl, Deadpan Snarker, Broken Bird, The Stoic, etc)

2: This character smiles

3: This smile is perceived as beautiful (audience or in universe)

4: Other people (audience or in universe) experience an increase in their affection for this character

edited 7th Dec '13 10:21:24 AM by Sackett

The page specifically says that it's for in universe reactions. We can make a separate page for audience reactions. This isn't supposed to be about how the smile is "a beautiful thing." It's supposed to be about how the smile makes her seen as physically beautiful. That is a specific definition. It's just the title that makes it sound so vague.

That's the point. I'm proposing we shift the definition to match the common usage and so narrow the examples down to something more meaningful.

Entering discussion: I agree with the proposition to shift the definition as stated there. People's smiles making them seem more physically beautiful isn't very fitting of the name. Tightening up/redefining When She Smiles as stated would solve the ambiguous name issue without changing the name itself, and would avoid the need to redirect that really-usable name to a new one.

edited 16th Dec '13 9:40:49 PM by DizzFizz

Eh, no matter what, the name is still extremely vague.

Strange, since whenever I saw When She Smiles I always thought it referred to the definition I gave above. I thought it obvious from the name.

I was actually quite surprised when I read this Trope Repair thread and went to the trope and discovered it referred to simply physical beauty.

I always got that impression too. I can sort of see where other interpretations might come from, but with the phrasing When She Smiles, I assumed it to be a person smiling being a beautiful moment for whatever reason (I.E. they rarely smile).

Maybe the definition tightening as proposed, and a slight name alteration to emphasize that the when is a relevant part of the trope?

edited 17th Dec '13 7:50:15 PM by DizzFizz

Rework this trope. Make new guidelines.

This should be about a time when someone who normally doesn't smile actually smiles, or when one particular smile is accentuated by the camera so the smiler looks better.

I count 6 votes so far favoring us narrowing the definition. I think we ought to have a crowner on it.

I support a name change.

The definition is kind of solid isn't it? But the title isn't.

However I don't support a definition change without a title change.

edited 23rd Jan '14 10:34:15 AM by GenericOscout

Crowner:

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/crowner.php/PageAction/WhenSheSmiles?open=all#q5l0dwny

Shall we holler for a mod to hook it?

It's hooked.

Should we rename it to Beautiful When They Smile, too?

Considering the rename option is in the red, no.

Are we ready to call this?

Been a week, and one option is well ahead

Okay, been a month. I'll go ahead and make the changes consistent with the leading option (by 17 to 3).

edited 17th Feb '14 12:39:29 PM by Sackett

Change made, can I get some help on example cleanup?

The crowner is called.