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Needs Help (new crowner 9/23/13): America Wins The War get usage counts

Friendly Neighbourhood Psychometrist
The trope description says that this can only be used for World War II, yet I can't really any reason why this shouldn't apply to other conflicts or nations.
Protect the weak, defend your rights
And join in love together:
The Hoof, the Wing and Horn divine
And Elements forever!
 2 Spark 9, Wed, 17th Apr '13 8:07:50 AM from Castle Wulfenbach Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Gentleman Troper!
Yeah, Tropes Are Not Narrow.
Special trousers. Very heroic.
 3 Editor Pall Mall, Wed, 17th Apr '13 8:09:44 AM from United States, East Coast
Don't Fear the Spiders
It is a subtrope of America Saves the Day. We could merge them and I would support this.
Keep it breezy!
 4 Septimus Heap, Wed, 17th Apr '13 8:11:04 AM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
This trope is specific to WW2 as far as I know. America Saves the Day is something far broader. Are there any problems with the current set up?

edited 17th Apr '13 8:11:22 AM by SeptimusHeap

 5 Spark 9, Wed, 17th Apr '13 8:15:19 AM from Castle Wulfenbach Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Gentleman Troper!
I see no reason why these should be separate tropes. Let's merge them.
Special trousers. Very heroic.
 6 Septimus Heap, Wed, 17th Apr '13 8:19:39 AM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
The difference between AWTW is that it's pretty much an artistic license about World War II. ASTD is for any scenario where the US save the day. AWTW would be the subtrope of ASTD.

edited 17th Apr '13 8:28:08 AM by SeptimusHeap

 7 Scouts Girlfriend, Wed, 17th Apr '13 8:23:11 AM from San Romero High School
Zombies taste like chainsaw death!
I support the merging.

 8 Nohbody, Wed, 17th Apr '13 9:41:06 AM from Somewhere in Dixie Relationship Status: Mu
Just zis guy
I would support a merge as well. The Same but More Specific is kinda silly, in general, and in this particular case I don't really see any value for making America doing so in WW2 a subtrope on its own.

edited 17th Apr '13 9:42:54 AM by Nohbody

 9 RJ Savoy, Wed, 17th Apr '13 1:22:04 PM from Edinburgh Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Reymmă
I think having a distinct subtrope for one particular war -that has dominated war fiction since then- is valid, if enough can be said about it on its own. Though it might work better as "America Saves The Day: World War Two".

There might be some value in dividing ASTD between fictional wars and historical fiction.
Friendly Neighbourhood Psychometrist
The Laconic definition of this is a perfect candidate for redefining this:

When someone overstates his own country's role in winning a war while downplaying the contributions of other countries.

edited 18th Apr '13 5:44:34 PM by SantosLHalper

Protect the weak, defend your rights
And join in love together:
The Hoof, the Wing and Horn divine
And Elements forever!
Piffy
[up]Agreed.
Because underscores break everything: Working link to my Troper page
 12 shoboni, Fri, 19th Apr '13 6:18:33 PM from Iowa, USA
I'm kinda seeing it, there no reason this should just apply to America and WWII, it looks like a trope that could apply to any work overglorifying any countries role in a conflict.
"It's not that simple. We are all both, good and evil, we have rage and compassion, we have love and hate...murder and forgiveness."
But only America is arrogant enough to do it. evil grin

 14 Noaqiyeum, Fri, 19th Apr '13 7:11:30 PM from the Shadowlands Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
the it-thingy
Yes, everyone knows that America won the Seven Years' War!
“I don't deserve any credit for turning the other cheek as my tongue is always in it.” ― Flannery O'Connor
 15 shoboni, Fri, 19th Apr '13 7:37:06 PM from Iowa, USA
Or North Korea, I think some of their propaganda uses it.

edited 19th Apr '13 7:37:15 PM by shoboni

"It's not that simple. We are all both, good and evil, we have rage and compassion, we have love and hate...murder and forgiveness."
 16 Editor Pall Mall, Fri, 19th Apr '13 7:57:45 PM from United States, East Coast
Don't Fear the Spiders
[up]The article prohibits real life examples.
Keep it breezy!
 17 shoboni, Fri, 19th Apr '13 8:20:15 PM from Iowa, USA
I know, I was just replying to the guy that said only America is that arrogant.

Wait, doesn't that mean we can't have any examples at all then by that definition of real life?
"It's not that simple. We are all both, good and evil, we have rage and compassion, we have love and hate...murder and forgiveness."
 18 Editor Pall Mall, Fri, 19th Apr '13 8:30:09 PM from United States, East Coast
Don't Fear the Spiders
If it is a work of fiction, including propaganda, it can go in. If it is a propaganda piece such as a poster or an essay but does not tell a story, or disagreement over who did what and how much that helped where, it stays out.

Or at least that is my interpretation.
Keep it breezy!
 19 Septimus Heap, Sat, 20th Apr '13 2:05:15 AM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
More or less accurate, although propaganda that holds 100% true to reality (the only situation in which it would fall under NRLEP) is not something that exists in the real world.

Or, you know, under the very definition of "propaganda".

 21 Noaqiyeum, Sat, 20th Apr '13 12:29:45 PM from the Shadowlands Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
the it-thingy
Ummm... no, you can have propaganda that aims to sway public opinion by stating all the facts in the most favourable light, or by stating only the good facts and not the bad (or vice versa) without making anything up.

(Random fact: Due to circumstantial juxtaposition in TRS I briefly misread this title as America Drops the Keys...)

edited 20th Apr '13 12:30:43 PM by Noaqiyeum

“I don't deserve any credit for turning the other cheek as my tongue is always in it.” ― Flannery O'Connor
 22 Editor Pall Mall, Sat, 20th Apr '13 1:07:21 PM from United States, East Coast
Don't Fear the Spiders
[up]The propaganda is nontheless believed to be true by a significant number of people. Rule of Cautious Editing Judgment, after all. But if there is a work of fiction which doubles as a propaganda piece, put it in.

Alternatively, we could remove the 'no real life' stipulation from this article, though most people will say that would be too controversial.
Keep it breezy!
 23 shoboni, Sat, 20th Apr '13 5:04:50 PM from Iowa, USA
Since this is about stretching the truth, there really would be no Real-Life examples outside propaganda if you could call that real life.
"It's not that simple. We are all both, good and evil, we have rage and compassion, we have love and hate...murder and forgiveness."
 24 StarSword, Mon, 22nd Apr '13 8:26:50 PM from somewhere in deep space Relationship Status: In denial
SF-81A Black Knight
America Drops The Keys is an awesome trope name. Now if only we can find a trope to go with it...tongue

More to the point, I'm inclined to not allow propaganda because like most things having to do with politics it's possible Flame Bait. Also because most of the propaganda I've seen has more to do with maximizing one's role in current conflicts than in previous ones (though as I don't actively go looking for it it's possible I just haven't seen any qualifying examples).
I'd suggest we simply add a propaganda section without necessitating allowing all real life examples.

Alternative Titles: America Wins The War
23rd Sep '13 7:21:24 AM
Vote up names you like, vote down names you don't. Whether or not the name will actually be changed is determined with a different kind of Crowner (the Single Proposition crowner). This one just collects and ranks alternative names.
At issue:
Total posts: 113
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