Pathfinder

I'm starting to wonder if balance in a system is just a myth... honestly, would it be that bad if the classes were always a little unbalanced against each other? If dealing with Pokémon and various console fighting games have taught me anything, probably not.

The catch is that the unbalancing can't be too radical. The fact that a level 20 wizard has the overall advantage on a level 20 fighter isn't necessarily the end of the world... it's the fact that a 12th level wizard has nearly as much of an advantage over the same level 20 fighter is the problem. That's where balancing effects have to bring things back in line.

This twenty-four-class scheme of yours intrigues me, now I've given it some thought. I can think of how most of the combinations would work, but I'm drawing a blank on what the Str- or Con-based skill monkeys and physical-ability-based casters would be like.

My character has put 3 points into diplomacy for the "I'm not a bad person anymore" approach, and Escape Artist should that fail.

Some combos just shouldn't work.

STR-based skillmonkey: it'd probably have to be STR/DEX, but some kind of athlete?

You could totally make a Con-based caster as a sort of blood mage who casts from hit points.

STR-based casting: HADOUKEN!

So a ki mysticism based monk?

In pathfinder the Scarred Witch Doctor archtype for the Witch does use Con for spellcasting, but its more learning to deal with pain than casting from hitpoints.

@Footsteps: D&D Modern was on that far end of the "unbalanced" scale if I recall right. Like, not as unbalanced as Rifts, but then again nothing can be more unbalanced than Rifts and remain playable (see World of Cinnabar).

A Strength-based skill-monkey would be one who focuses on the various Athletics skills like Climb and Swim. They'd probably be allowed at higher levels to substitute Str for other abilities with other Skills (Disable Device feature would be called Percussive Maintenance).

A Con-based caster would be a Cast from Hit Points type, which would be awesome as I've always liked that style of casting.

A Dex-based caster is something I'm drawing a blank on.

edited 4th Aug '14 6:00:44 AM by Frishman

Dex-based caster...maybe an illusionist? I mean, not a wizard who specializes in illusion spells; like, a stage magician. Someone who does "magic" through sleight of hand and misdirection.

To answer some of the questions of the (admittedly, so radical as to basically prompt a new edition) theory of "one class for each combo of base stat and party role"...

Strength-based skill monkey - I agree, the athletic class idea is what I had in mind for it. Perhaps the brawler from the upcoming Advanced Class Guide would fit, particularly with skill at various in-combat maneuvers.

Constitution-based skill monkey - That's kind of the niche that a ranger fits in best already. Good HP, lots of skill points, gets feats based around being relentless... it might not be the usual way to look at the class, but I feel it fits.

Strength, dexterity, and constitution-based arcane users - Arguably, we already have one class comfortably occupying the dexterity-based arcane users, for some value of "arcane" - the bomber-style alchemist. You might argue that the ones that favor mutagens go towards the strength end instead. And I like the idea of blood mages; the catch is figuring out how to make their powers work without making them the ultimate Glass Cannon (I've thought about a special reserve of energy distinct from hit points, but that starts either dragging us into a magic point system or the dreaded word in fantasy gaming, "psionics").

There's also the possibility of making a magus into a strength-based caster. All of that said, I'd be lying if I said that @832 wasn't an awesome idea.

I did have one other idea for dexterity-based casting - make it work sort of like bending does in Avatar: The Last Airbender, with the development of styles (not necessarily the element-based ones from said show) and different ups and downs. Trendy? Perhaps. But you know how many people we could sell on the hobby if they said, "wait, so, like Aang and Korra?" and we said "yeah, like that"?

A Con based skill-monkey can remake skill check you normally can't remake, out of sheer perseverance.

There are a couple of different ways to use a Blood Mage without making them a Glass Cannon. The first and easiest is just to give them a bigger Hit Die. A d8 or d12 would do a lot to make up for the fact that they're using their own life's blood to fuel their spells.

Another way is to allow them to have a "cost reduction," allowing them to convert a number of lethal hit points lost via spellcasting to nonlethal damage, probably equal to their Constitution modifier. Or allow them to heal "cast" hit points at a rate equal to that of nonlethal damage (1 per level per hour, instead of per 8-hour rest).

Or allowing them to remain conscious past 0 hit points and not die until they reach twice their Con stat in negative damage. The reason they can do this is "magic."

There are ways, is what I'm getting at. The trick is to make them not ballstastically broken like some previous D&D renditions of the Blood Mage.

So, the Advanced Classes Guide is out. It also has a ton of new Archetypes, Spells and Items.

I'm partial to Swashbuckler, especially with the Inspired Swashbuckler

Provided this feat:
Slashing Grace (Combat)
You can stab your enemies with your sword or another slashing weapon.
Prerequisites: Dex 13, Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus with chosen weapon.
Benefit: Choose one kind of one-handed slashing weapon (such as the longsword). When wielding your chosen weapon one-handed, you can treat it as a one-handed piercing melee weapon for all feats and class abilities that require such a weapon (such as a swashbuckler’s or a duelist’s precise strike) and you can add your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to that weapon’s damage. The weapon must be one appropriate for your size.

Is allowed by the GM to be used on Rapiers too (which is not too unreasonable have I assume?)

The Inspired Swashbuckler has to use a Rapier (which is not too bad because there are 2 swashbuckler rapiers in the weapon list) but gets his Panache Points from both Int and Cha, instead of only char, and unlike the normal swashbuckler gets Weapon Focus for free together with Weapon Finesse for the Rapier.

So by making a Dex/Cha/Int Inspired Swashbuckler, you could make a mean rapier user with quite useful social skills (at 4+Int Skillpoints).

Though the Picaroon also looks interesting, though I'd need to make some more crunch at it, for that.

Also, since Grit and Panache are stated to be the same Pool I wonder how good a Nameless-Gunslinger/Swashbuckler Multiclass char would work?

Furthermore, the Guide comes with a new Archetype for the Gunslinger, allowing him to use Crossbows in place of firearms, which makes the class suddenly viable in games where the GM doesn't allow them.

edited 14th Aug '14 4:13:46 PM by 3of4

Crossbows instead of Guns? Oooh that could be fun!

Crossbow Training (Ex): Starting at 5th level, a bolt ace can select one specific type of crossbow, such as hand crossbow or heavy crossbow. She gains a bonus on damage rolls equal to her Dexterity modifier with that crossbow. Furthermore, when she scores a critical hit with that type of crossbow, her critical modifier increases by 1 (a �2 becomes a �3, for example).


Every 4 levels thereafter, she can pick a different type of crossbow, gaining the bonus damage and increased critical multiplier with that type of crossbow as well. This ability replaces gun training.

That and some Firearm Deed's get replaced by Crossbow Deeds, like Lightning Reload becomes Inexplicable Reload

I admit, this is on my "want to try" list. Get Rapid Reload, Two Handed Fighting and spec in Hand Crossbows and FUN TIMES :D

Since Hand Crossbones are a bit weak at 1d4 (compared to Bows), Acid Bolts for the extra acidy 1d4. And fired out of a Flaming +1d6 Hand Crossbow and all the rapid fire feats

edited 14th Aug '14 4:59:25 PM by 3of4

Running a game where the players are plain clothe detectives of the city constable. (Most of them rolled lousy for Int, however, so I'll probably have them more strictly utilized as a sort of SWAT Team muscle.)

It's nearing Mid-Fall, and the barrier between the Material and Immaterial is fracturing like it does every year. Thankfully, the cracks aren't so big this time. Unfortunately, they're numerous and the city is now lousy with Outsiders, Aberration, Undead and Fey.

They finally made a version of gunslinger that uses crossbows instead of guns? As if I wasn't itching to get the Advanced Class Guide enough.

That said, I thought you couldn't multiclass any of the new base classes in ACG with the two classes that they were derived from - since swashbuckler was a combo of gunslinger and fighter, I thought you wouldn't be allowed to take either class if you have a level in gunslinger (and vice-versa; anyone with levels of either fighter or gunslinger can't take levels in swashbuckler

EDIT: I'm torn between wanting more details and wanting to hold out until I can get to the nearest game store and get my own copy.

edited 15th Aug '14 8:50:31 AM by 32_Footsteps

There's a bit about multiclassing between one of the hybrid classes and a parent class. It says you can do it but it's probably a dumb idea that'll leave you with the same ability twice, and levels in the ability from different classes won't stack.

And I've halfway convinced they're trying to make multiclassing obsolete, given the stuff like an Arcanist archetype that gives you Witch spells and a familiar to prepare spells with and a Brawler archetype that gives you Alchemist mutagens and a Hunter archetype that gives you Summoner evolution points to use on your animal companion.

Unrelated, but one of the Brawler archetypes lets you do Captain America bullshit with your shield. Someone at Paizo's having fun.

I just think maybe giving a Swashbuckler Amateur Gunslinger Feat (or a Gunslinger Amateur Swashbuckler Feat) as a emergency range/melee option?

Could you use Amateur Gunslinger to get one of the bolt ace archetype's deeds?

I need to get this book tomorrow.

Probably? Don't see a reason why not

The Technology Guide has been put on the PRD. It looks amazingly fun. I especially love the Savage Technologist archetype for Barbarian; cool mechanics, with thought behind them.

huh?

...*reads* I have the feeling this is stuff that math would have never ever allowed me to touch in his campaign.

edited 17th Aug '14 10:44:25 AM by 3of4