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Wick Cleanup: Killed Off For Real get usage counts

Maybe do it on a work basis first, since it's the death rules of the particular universe that really controls the trope, then narrow down to specific instances for those universes that have reversible death?

 52 Fighteer, Wed, 6th Mar '13 12:53:28 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
Whatever works. I suspect that most examples will be fairly self-evident. Don't forget to nuke Zero Context Examples.

Just to ask, is there a trope for "deaths that occur in a universe in which death is usually final that viewers may be surprised is not undone or retconned, considering Death Is Cheap in most/all media" (the way it was usually misused)?

 54 Septimus Heap, Wed, 6th Mar '13 2:33:48 PM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
No, because the last part is wrong.

 55 Fighteer, Wed, 6th Mar '13 3:02:23 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
We have all sorts of Death Tropes.

Dragon Writer
@53: Yeah, that proposal just ... does not compute.
Right. That was just the most reasonable explanation I could think of to put this trope for "anyone who's died" (without special circumstances that would put it in most Death Tropes) in, for example, a TV series that take place in "our" world. I was wondering if there was any trope to change those to, or whether it should just be deleted.

edited 8th Mar '13 10:40:00 AM by Leaper

Perhaps this line in the description should be rewritten too, as it implies every normal death qualifies by default. It's counterintuitive, because the clean-up makes it clear that it doesn't apply to real life and works with normal "rules".

This trope originates in real life, where most deaths are generally irreversible.

To

This trope originates in real life, but real life itself and realistic works do not provide examples of it.

The parenthesis in "As a Death Trope (quite likely the biggest one, in fact)" seems to give the wrong message too.

edited 8th Mar '13 12:34:01 PM by TrollBrutal

 59 RJ Savoy, Fri, 8th Mar '13 3:26:34 PM from Edinburgh Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Reymmă
[up] Even the quote seems off. It's about averting Death Is Cheap in the first place.
 60 Septimus Heap, Fri, 8th Mar '13 3:29:02 PM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
Change the description, then ditch the quote.

 61 RJ Savoy, Fri, 8th Mar '13 3:47:19 PM from Edinburgh Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Reymmă
I think "No-one stays dead..." on the Quotes page suits it best.
^^ Done.

 63 Another Duck, Fri, 8th Mar '13 4:14:19 PM from Stockholm Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
I thought the quotation was fitting. As far as I took it, it spoke about really killing characters, and not just weak killings that make them come back later on. Also, the "No one stays dead" quotation is more about not using this trope.
Check out my fanfiction!
Question, does the trope applies to works that indulge in Not Quite Dead and similar kind of twists and tricks? e.g a "houdini" character being actually killed serving as some sort Untwist

I would say no, since the character didn't die so technically there is no comeback, but I was wondering about it...

 65 Fighteer, Fri, 8th Mar '13 4:38:17 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
I feel that it does, because it's about the treatment of death as something that never happens for real, except when it does.

It's about the expectations. "Vegeta got hit with a tactical nuke last episode, but of course he's going to be fine - he always is. WHAT DO YOU MEAN HE'S DEAD?! REALLY DEAD? GOD DANGIT!

edited 8th Mar '13 4:40:02 PM by Fighteer

Ah right, characters Made of Iron being destroyed and deaths in scenarios prone to tricks are covered by the descritpion and fits the "exceptionality feel".

edited 8th Mar '13 4:52:31 PM by TrollBrutal

 67 RJ Savoy, Fri, 8th Mar '13 5:31:38 PM from Edinburgh Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Reymmă
About the quote: yes, it makes a distinction, but it's between works (Transformers Prime vs. the rest of the franchise) rather than characters. This trope applies to the deaths of specific characters within a work where "stay dead" is not expected. If Transformers Prime is not such a work, the trope does not apply.

The saying about comic-book deaths is about specific deaths that for various reasons stuck for a while, in a medium where it wasn't the norm, so it illustrates the trope fine.

edited 8th Mar '13 5:33:03 PM by RJSavoy

 68 Another Duck, Sat, 9th Mar '13 2:58:33 AM from Stockholm Relationship Status: In season
No, the other one.
"For a while."
Check out my fanfiction!
So, just to make absolutely sure, there is no trope that simply means "this character dies"? (There's a certain 2012 movie that takes place in "the real world" has it all over its character page, for example.)

 70 Septimus Heap, Tue, 12th Mar '13 11:56:32 AM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
"Dying" alone is not a trope.

OK. So, for this particular movie, it looks like simple deletion will do? (I'm not familiar enough with the film to go through all the more specific Death Tropes to replace them.)

 72 Fighteer, Tue, 12th Mar '13 1:57:09 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
I'd say so, unless you can come up with something better than "[Character] dies".

 73 RJ Savoy, Thu, 14th Mar '13 10:00:48 AM from Edinburgh Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Reymmă
Cleaning up wicks, I realised that this sinkhole is being used as an emphatic for "dies". Zero-context entries are basically just noting that a named guy dies. I could link it with the linguistic theory about languages moving towards the most marked form of an expression.

Really, it's because of Death Is Cheap; we've all seen shows that cheat and have characters return, so it's not enough to just say "he dies". But it's become a verbal tic, to the point where it's sometimes used for characters who do return. I've been removing it in entries where it is appropriate (others come back from the dead but not these) simply because we need to stop up this sinkhole. In some cases I decided it was better to pothole the others to Death Is Cheap.

Just four thousand more links to check...
Wait, does this mean the pic on the page is Not an Example? Is that worsening the misuse as "this guy is dead" any?

 75 Septimus Heap, Thu, 14th Mar '13 10:23:15 AM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
Not illustrating the example is an issue, yes, as I said in @6.

Yes, it's Image Pickin' job.

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