Does Not Illustrate: Angel Unaware

Castiel gives his identity away pretty quickly to Dean after appearing. He is explicitly an angel of the lord. Even though the page image seems to demonstrate the concept, it is in fact, not an example. Later on, he does have his moments, though.

Gandalf the Grey from the Lord of the Rings is an Angel Unaware because he is a Maia, a servant of the Powers that created the world, but is not explicitly stated to be so in any of the LOTR books. The only clue is that 1) He is a Wizard, in a setting where magic is reserved for very powerful spirits 2) He gives Olorin as one of his names and Olorin happens to be the name of a Maia in the Literature/Sillmarillion 3) He matches a Balrog in a fight.

edited 8th Feb '13 1:40:13 PM by blkwhtrbbt

edit:Nevermind

Edit:Thinking about it,this is a difficult trope to show with an image, perhaps images wouldn't do the trope any justice.

edited 8th Feb '13 2:16:26 PM by Ultimatum

I agree that Castiel should be pulled since he isn't an example.

What's your point about Gandalf? Yeah, he's a good example, but unless you find some very specific fan art, we can't exactly use him.

Non-example are allowed sometimes if they illustrate the trope anyway. I think this is a pretty good picture.

Maybe this would work.

that's pretty good, I like it.

Not really feeling it any better than the current.

The current still illustrates the trope even if it's not an example in all cases.

I think 5 is better because it illustrates the idea of the angel being a lowly character as a hospitality test. The current is just an implied angel.

The current is fine, but I think 5 is better for the reasons Telcontar said.

Provided 5 looks good at wiki size, I'm down with it.

At 200 x 440◊

EDIT: And at 250x550◊

edited 9th Feb '13 12:45:35 PM by justanid

Could be wider. :/

Awesome.

edited 9th Feb '13 7:16:19 PM by Noaqiyeum

Either of those versions are good with me.

Bump; should we go ahead and crowner this or wait for some more suggestions?

I don't understand. The proposed image has the angel openly showing her wings, so the person answering the door can't be unaware that she's an angel, right?

I mean, you'd need an image where the audience can see it's an angel but the other characters can't. If she were hiding her wings behind her back or under clothes.

Maybe I'm being too literal, I dunno.

As for Gandalf, you aren't going to find a picture that demonstrates the trope because Maiar in their true "form" are invisible and intangible. There's no visible clue he could use, other than obviously glowing, which would be just as obvious as a pair of green wings.

edited 13th Feb '13 9:18:32 AM by ArcadesSabboth

I'm pretty sure that's the point. The person opening the door can't see the wings, only we can. They're barely leaning out of the door, and the angel's wings are pressed up against the wall. At least that's how I see it.

edited 13th Feb '13 10:38:36 AM by bananasloth

But "implied angel" is the trope, isn't it? The first paragraph says that it's when a work hints at a character being an angel without confirming it. The reference to Sacred Hospitality just means that this trope often coincides with the hospitality test thing. I think.

I'm going to go with, "I don't see the Unaware part of the green/blue/yellow winged angel." I don't think it's stronger than the current one.

If this is from the school of art that I think it is, the wings are a stylistic choice on the part of the artist. They aren't visible to other characters, only to the audience, as an indicator that this is in fact an angel and not some other vagrant.

In other words, 'angel' is explicit and 'unaware' implicit, whereas in the current it's (presumably, but not actually) the other way around.

Now I'm confused, is the trope about the audience or characters being unaware?

The characters have to be. The audience can be but doesn't have be.

If the audience has to be kept unaware, it would become a subjective trope.

Well, you could have examples that are Maybe Magic, Maybe Mundane. But actually I was thinking of situations where the audience is told that the character is an angel immediately compared to when they aren't told until late in the story. (Angel Unaware encompasses situations wherein the characters learn who the angel is eventually, as I understand it.)

OP here. I've read all your discussions, and I think I agree with the person who said that a page image does not have to be an example if it demonstrates the trope properly. Castiel is not an example, but does give the right impression of the trope. That said, here's one image with potential: http://acidraw.deviantart.com/art/Chris-Angel-Wings-Shadow-149167587 It's actually very similar to what we already have, but as it's not from any given media, it can't be a mis-example. What does everyone think?