You could also compare Magical Database (which has its own problems.
)
edited 10th Feb '12 10:18:13 AM by Myra
vigilantly taxonomish
Calling the crowner in favour of splitting into two, one for libraries that contain all the knowledge in the world, one for libraries that are explicitly magical.
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What would be food names for those? So far we have
Magic Library
Magical Library
Mystic Library
Arcane Library
Great Big Library of Everything
Library Of Everything
Library That Has Every Book
Loser
I am correct in thinking that The Library Of Babel is going to become the "libraries that contain all the knowledge in the world" trope and still needs a new name?
As for the Magical Library trope, it seems to me that taking it to YKTTW would be a good idea.
edited 13th Feb '12 10:53:23 AM by LouieW
"irhgT nm0w tehre might b ea lotof th1nmgs i dont udarstannd, ubt oim ujst goinjg to keepfollowing this pazth i belieove iN !!!!!1 d
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Yes, I think Library Of Babel is going to become "the library that has everything" (although it was already that in the first place, most of the examples and wicks just thought it was Magical Library) and get renamed. Although the crowner makes it look like it's going to be split into two tropes.
Anyway, I'll make a YKTTW for Magical Library or whatever we are going to call it soon.
edited 25th Feb '12 7:20:16 PM by Oreochan
"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."
Loser
Alright, so there is now an alternative titles crowner for the "library that has everything" trope here. Feel free to add names as you see fit.
I don't think 'Library that has everything' should take on Library Of Babel's current description. It is full of tangents, needs to get to the point and is confusing as to what counts as the trope. The trope isn't that complex. The third paragraph appears to be the only information that is relevant, ignoring the Hot Librarian comment.
edited 1st Mar '12 7:51:13 PM by Oreochan
"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."
Agreed. The current trope definition is terrible.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
... There was no actual rename crowner, incidentally. The "split" crowner did not mention a rename. If one of these tropes is going to have a definition similar to the current Library Of Babel trope, why not just keep the current name by default? If you want to rename it, shouldn't there be an actual rename crowner first? People who voted for a split may have still wanted to keep the original name for one of the split articles. This seems like you've skipped a step, there.
edited 1st Mar '12 6:06:51 PM by girlyboy
Neither of them is going to have a definition similar to the current mess.
The Library Of Babel is probably better off becoming a disambiguation for Literature.The Library Of Babel, Magical Library and Library That Has Everything .
edited 2nd Mar '12 10:57:51 AM by Oreochan
"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."
Agreed. The reason we're splitting is that the current page doesn't have anything like a coherent definition.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
... Then maybe someone who's been in this discussion longer than me can figure out a good way to re-write the part of the crowner that says "the "library of everything" trope which will take on The Library Of Babel's description"..?
edited 1st Mar '12 8:17:58 PM by girlyboy
Tweaked the crowner description. The current description is a rambling mess. No trope deserves that. It's the reason people were just throwing random things at this trope.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
I finally got to making that YKTTW for Magical Library and it's here. I know the description needs more but I really have to go to bed now. Anyone is free to expand or refine it.
Seeing some of the examples and wicks are actually examples of a Techno Library or Cyber Space Library instead of a Magical Library or a Library Of Everything, and it seems to be the one that stands out the most. Maybe that can be it's own trope as well. I think those examples were added because the last paragraph says something about computers and the internet. I may YKTTW that as well, as soon as Magical Library is finished.
Also, are we sending Library Of Everything to the YKTTW as well?
Edit: A'ight, here is a sandbox for The Library Of Babel so the examples can be for the tropes can sorted.
edited 3rd Mar '12 4:25:33 AM by Oreochan
"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."
I wanna point out that the Borges story is actually a subversion of the "library that has everything" trope. The library (which some call the universe) contains every possible arrangement of letters on a page, and it is therefore incredibly hard to find a meaningful book in it.
If it's not a straight portrayal of the trope... . It would be easy to mistake the trope is about libraries that are like the one in the short story.
"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."
Exactly. And the current description is terrible because it just describes that particular library instead of describing a single trope. That's why we need to do all this now.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Yes, a description should not be based on one example, it may end up becoming too specific and restricted.
edited 4th Mar '12 12:28:07 AM by Oreochan
"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."
Personally, I like the title The Library Of Babel: a large collection of knowledge that is also extremely hard to make sense of or acts as a labyrinth. Evoking the Tower of Babel is also IMO part of what makes the title good.
The misuse is likely because there are very few other library tropes.
Ie, I'd like a three-way split: one for the magical/arcane library, one for the library of everything, and one for the library-as-a-labyrinth. Some libraries (like L-Space) will fit all three tropes.
This trope is being split into two, not three. I think the main reason why this trope is getting shoehorned examples for any abnormal library is because of description, although we probably do need more library tropes.
Anyway, are we going to send "Library that has everything" to the YKTTW after we decide what we are going to call it?
"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."
Bump for votes.
"Learning without thinking is labor lost. Thinking without learning is dangerous."
So is this ever going anywhere?
Calling crowner in favour of Great Big Library of Everything with Library Of Everything as a redirect.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick
Crown Description:
Previous crowner
showed consensus support for making "library of everything" and "magical library" tropes. This crowner is for voting on the name of the "library of everything" trope which will take on the concept of a library that contains every work in existence.
Not really a trope. It's what computers do.
edited 10th Feb '12 8:35:22 AM by shimaspawn
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick