Fate/Zero

What of Miyamoto Musashi? FSN!Assassin implies that normally, a Saber-class Servant would be a Heroic Spirit with a European-style sword, to fit the class's namesake, so I'm not 100% sure if Miyamoto would count as a Saber.

edited 3rd Oct '11 9:09:13 AM by MarqFJA

Wanted to say this.

If Sasaki Koujiro can have sword techniques on par with a noble phantasm and completely undodgable to boot - What the hell does Musashi have, then?

Keep in mind that this "Sasaki Kojiro" never even met Miyamoto Musashi in his life.

Mad sword skills. Musashi is probably a true heroic spirit himself, unlike Kojirou.

That being said, unlike Sasaki, Musashi is not know for a particular powerful technique, is he? He probably has his own noble phantasm but not a particular technique that reach the power of one.

Why you say that? I don't really remember that. Fate!Assassin would probably be able to be summoned as saber as well (each hero is not necessarily restricted to a single class). Not to mention he is a fake servant in the first place.

Recall when FSN!Assassin surprised Saber when he accurately guessed the dimensions and the style of her invisible weapon. "The shape is... Hmmm... like your name, Saber, it is a typical western sword."

As for Musashi... Well, FSN!Berserker had an NP that was technically more of a fighting style. Musashi is famous for his Niten Ichi-ryu, no?

edited 3rd Oct '11 10:37:02 AM by MarqFJA

The fact that this surprised Saber implies that it's not obvious that a Saber class spirit would use a Western sword. He had to figure it out. Musashi would make an obvious Saber.

As for a Noble Phantasm... he's famous for using wooden swords in serious duels, as well as dual-wielding. Supposedly the philosophy of his sword school is that one should be able to win with any weapon, and that the basics of battle and strategy are far more important than particular techniques (he won his duel with Kojiro by waiting for the sun to get in his eyes, for example). One learns just as much about battle from painting or carpentry as one does from studying weaponry. That kind of hero.

edited 3rd Oct '11 10:41:01 AM by Clarste

This doesn't mean all Sabers use a European sword. In fact, the opposite, as I interpret. FSN!Assassin made a comment her sword fit her name because it may have not been the case (he is also incorrect, as Saber don't, in fact, use a saber).

About Musashi, yeah, I was thinking on that too. But this alone is not what made him famous at all. In fact, he didn't used the Niten Ichi-ryū at all against Sasaki Kojirô himself. He basically used dirty trick and an oversized wooden sword in this duel. I think he is even more famous for making strategies to defeat each enemy even more then for his Dual Wielding.

edited 3rd Oct '11 10:47:39 AM by Heatth

Yeah, that's why I said "not 100% sure", not "I don't believe".

And yeah, he's famous for both Dual Wielding skills and his strategic/tactical prowess

I'm not even entirely sure Sabers have to be sword wielders, despite their class being 'the knight of the sword.' When Lancer and Saber fight at the very beginning of FSN, Lancer does not know for sure what her weapon is and she says 'Who knows? Maybe it's an axe or a bow.' Lancer should know that at the very least she obviously can't be Berserker, Caster, Archer, Assassin or Lancer and probably not Rider.

She was probably implying that she could have weapons other than her main sword.

I wonder why the Nasuverse calls these beings Heroic Spirits. It seems that the criteria for being a hero is how mad your killy powers are - if you accomplish great and legendary deeds through entirely peaceful means, you may as well be a nobody in the eyes of the world.

The Type-Moon wiki outright states that... 'If the conditions for the creation of a hero are met for a user of modern armaments, what will ascend to the rank of Heroic Spirit will be the gun instead, under the terms of “the best weapon of its time”.' The goddamn gun becomes the Heroic Spirit despite not even being a being. How is that even possible?

edited 3rd Oct '11 11:43:58 AM by Thrombin

Ignore the Type Moon wiki, they have about five editors and very little fact checking last I knew.

Indeed.

Shouldn't this be on the Natsuverse thread in the Visual Novel forum? I mean, this is only tangentially related with Fate Zero, I believe.

I really hope they use the Return to Zero songs. They're just so freakin awesome. They probably won't though =(.

edited 3rd Oct '11 1:56:57 PM by neobowman

I was just wondering:

I know only a few things about F/SN since I have never watched it before and just have read a summary of events. But the characters in F/Z... Is F/Z the prequel of F/SN?

edited 3rd Oct '11 5:24:30 PM by djmaca

... Ummmm, yes? I thought that would be obvious...

edited 3rd Oct '11 5:30:03 PM by KSPAM

Yes, it is. It happens 10 years prior Fate Stay Night. One of the main characters of Fate Zero is the adoptive father of FSN protagonist, Shirou.

edited 3rd Oct '11 5:31:22 PM by Heatth

Yes it was, I just needed the clarification.

Man, it's those worms again..... they're CG and on a loli.

She likes it.

I am kind of interested in knowing just what the hell they're doing to her after learning those things apparently look like penises. Seriously Nasu, do you and Hideaki Anno share a flat or something?

edited 3rd Oct '11 5:35:56 PM by KSPAM

They are not called penis worm officially, I believe. This is just their Fan Nickname due to their... phallic appearance◊.

They do bad things to her. I could go into details but you probably don't want to hear them KSPAM.

Okay, what the fuck? Anything you could be doing to anyone, especially a little girl, with those things can't possibly be good.

And yet I wish to know. Spoilers ahoy!

edited 3rd Oct '11 5:39:55 PM by KSPAM

Yes. And let your imagination inform you as to why Kariya is so horrified that the Tohsakas gave Sakura to the Matous. The Tohsaka family didn't know what the Matou magic was exactly. Kariya? Kariya knows.

^ Yay for schmuck bait! They infest her body, eat her uterus and several other organs and replace them with themselves, then lodge partially in her heart. If she ever gets anxious, they fill her with lust because semen is a good source of mana, and they eat mana.

edited 3rd Oct '11 5:41:46 PM by Arha

PM to me! You know my nature.

But then, those things killed her in the future right?

edited 3rd Oct '11 5:40:53 PM by djmaca

Yeah. This is kinda the point.

If you are already hating Zouken with all your might, you are doing the expected reaction.

Actually, they did not. But they were still very much there.

edited 3rd Oct '11 5:42:21 PM by Heatth