Needs to merge with No Plot, No Problem: Porn Without Plot

For a long time, this trope's name was PWP. This was because it was also known as Plot? What Plot? and could mean any work. Recently, it was renamed to focus just on porn, which was apparently this trope was years ago.

I noticed in the description that it says No Plot? No Problem! is the non-pornographic version of this trope. In reality, its the game version. Having a porn version and game version of the same trope and no place to put everything else makes no sence.

This should merge with NPNP and have the name Plot? What Plot? (spelt out, not as an accronym) so it can focus on all mediums.

You know, I was just going to suggest the same thing. The Porn Without Plot page states it is only about porn, and that non-porn examples go on No Plot? No Problem! - and yet, almost every single example on the page is not about porn.

Besides, we usually avoid medium-specific tropes, and "not having much of a plot" is clearly not limited to one specific medium. So +1 for merge from me.

Also, I'm having a hard time seeing the difference between these two, Excuse Plot, and Xtreme Sport Xcuse Plot. Could someone explain what the difference is, please?

edited 18th Jul '11 4:02:32 AM by Spark9

OK, reading the examples I see some stuff that seems to fit, but the rest is messed up.

... why the hell is Finnegans Wake on Porn Without Plot?

Basically, this looks like a bad example of Fan Myopia, as all of these are probably sub-tropes of a more general trope on works which don't have a plot which could include (e.g.) novels like {{Finnegan's Wake}} or Huysmans A Rebours. The problem seems to be people not realising that there are other things than games or porn that don't have a real plot.

That general trope needs writing, and perhaps needs to absorb all of these different articles. And as far as I can see Excuse Plot and No Plot? No Problem! are basically the same, so at the least we should cut one of them.

The primary difference between Excuse Plot and No Plot? No Problem! is that an Excuse Plot is, in fact, a plot.

In theory, I get that. In practice, it's pretty blurry and tends to attract the same kind of examples. For example, "Fight City" is considered to have an Excuse Plot ("it is a city, and they fight"), whereas 4X games as a whole are listed as No Plot? No Problem!, even though for example Civilization 1 has an intro scene of several minutes.

What I'm saying is that I don't think they're different enough to need separate pages.

The description also really, really feels like Fan Myopia to me. I'd say just rename it to Plot? What Plot? again, since many of the examples fit that, and cut the natter about it primarily applying to Lemon and the whole 'nowadays' part — it feels like whoever wrote that is firing off a barrage in an internet argument over what the words mean.

There's nothing particularly unique or special about porn lacking plots, since many, many other genres do the same thing. And there's especially no unique trope for lemon fics in particular that lack plot.

When was this trope renamed to Porn Without Plot, anyway? It seems like such a glaringly bad rename that it's hard to see how it got through.

Hrm. Looking at the history for PWP, and the discussion here, it seems that it was swapped with its redirect with very little discussion and without actually reading it carefully. Previously, it defined itself as Plot? What Plot?, and that's what most of the examples are, so I'd generally say it should be moved to that — if a separate trope really does exist for porn, we can make it later, but this page is pretty clearly Plot? What Plot?.

For what it's worth, Plot? What Plot? also gets three times the google hits of Porn Without Plot.

edited 31st Jul '11 8:54:23 AM by Aquillion

Smut writers like to keep codes short so most Porn Without Plot s would just be PWP everywhere but the sites glossary. The term gets a lot of use

That doesn't solve the problem that PWP also fits Porn With Plot. That sort of ambiguity is one of the reasons that we don't generally allow acronyms as main page titles.

Not to mention that, to those who don't spend time reading smut online or things related to it, it could just as easily mean "pickles with potatoes" or "players want prizes."

edited 31st Jul '11 10:10:44 AM by INUH

One thing that might be wise to do as a part of this effort is to make PWP itself into a disambiguation page, pointing to whatever tropes we decide mean "porn with plot", "porn without plot", and "plot, what plot". Possibly along with a suggestion to repair the link that sent you there.

That definitely should happen.

Bump. Are we gonna do anything here?

Amen. I personally prefer Xtifr's idea, the page into No Plot? No Problem! and leaving behind a redlink/disambiguation page for PWP.

Bump. We were going to merge this, yes?

Bump again. PWP is now a disambiguation page for the two tropes Porn Without Plot and Plot With Porn. Among the wicks were a handful of examples of non-pornographic plotlessness; should we have a separate trope for that?

No Plot? No Problem! is that trope and it should be listed on the disambig with Plot? What Plot? as a redirect.

Added No Plot? No Problem! to the PWP disambiguation page. As it is, Plot? What Plot? redirects to Porn Without Plot; does that take a moderator to change?

Redirect on Plot? What Plot?? switched from Porn Without Plot to No Plot? No Problem!

edited 10th Feb '12 2:33:16 PM by Madrugada

Bump. Plot? What Plot? appears to have been redirected to No Plot? No Problem!. NINJA'D!

Anything left to do here?

edited 10th Feb '12 2:33:46 PM by MarqFJA

Nope. I think we're done. Locking.