General Digimon Topic

Well really if you're gonna be like that,then of course things can't be changed. Because there's always something a little different when the main character is removed.

Besides they removed Angemon's Story-Breaker Power for Veemon,that's not manipulating things at all,it's already there that Magna Angemon could've and should've singlehandedly been able to fight the Daemon Corp. and he almost beat BWG.

I'd have to create an new unestablished scenario to really manipulate,but Angemon the uber-powerful is already in effect.

But with Cody's episode,the writers effectively made sure it could only be him since none of the Digimon could work well underwater.

You're the one arguing that the Adventure kids couldn't be changed at all for some magical reason.

You can either change all of them or you can change none of them. No buts about it.

edited 20th Oct '12 9:27:53 PM by Saiga

The writers were very effective at separating the characters in Adventure,all of them played some part it seemed no one could take over. There's nothing "magical" about that at all. And it's not just Adventure it's also Tamers.

No this just wasn't drilled in well to 02,because Davis being the Spotlight-Stealing Squad made it nearly impossible for Cody or Yolei to do much of anything,and then it being in the canon of Adventure with some of the Adventure cast leaves it open to using old solutions to solve stuff.If the writers left TK and Kari out more,then I would've believed it was more up to Davis.

edited 20th Oct '12 9:40:22 PM by terlwyth

But, again, nobody could have filled Davis' role either.

Did someone seriously say Savers was better than Tamers? ...I honestly cannot take a statement like that seriously if only because I am biased and think Savers is the worst season.

That's not true, Takeru could have easily filled Daisuke's role, heck he was already did most of the work anyway from a day to day basis for the team (strategizing, deciding what the team will do next, etc), so could Hikari, or any of the older kids. Really Daisuke never really contributed anything resembling leadership, and the only times Daisuke was pushed forward was to introduce the latest dues ex machina, even if it didn't make any sense or needed the other characters severely to be OOC to make it work.

Also food for thought, considering how his character was created there probably was a time in the planning stages where he wasn't the leader. Ken's Wormmon's evolutionary line was pretty kick ass, shame we couldn't see it because of Daisuke. Actually its a general shame that none of the other characters were allowed to shine or were given any real attention because of him.

Without remorse,just as I cannot take a statement that would somehow overlook the folly that is Adventure 02 in favor of the season with Kurata seriously.

Perhaps because I to am biased towards the Love to Hate Kurata and Savers and thus find it to pretty much be the best season objectively (not subjectively though,Adventure will always win based on the Nostalgia Filter,not to mention it did have a better finale,but that isn't saying much) and very much not impressed with how Chiaki Konaka started off Tamers.

Then I have no choice but to agree to disagree,as to prevent a circular argument that goes nowhere

By the way, did you know Hunters (and not Xros Wars) was nominated for a emmy? On "kids animation" category. And no, I don't get it.

http://www.iemmys.tv/news_item.aspx?id=155

See and now I've lost all respect for the emmys.

Face Palm.

Removing Yolei actually impacts very little to the series. Love and Sincerity/Purity/Whatever would go to TK and Kari, so Gatomon and Patamon can do what Hawkmon did in those episodes. Run Yolei Run never happens, Stingmon defeats Golemon, they find Gatomon's Tail Ring in episode 31, and since the D3s have more power, Angewomon replaces Silphymon, Sora solos Russia, Angewomon defeats Lady Devimon. The ONLY time it's hard to see someone else doing her role is episode 29, where she uses the computer to stop Arukenimons control of Bug Digimon.

Removing Cody impacts very little too, Tylomon or Mantaryamon replace Submarimon, Magna Angemon replaces Shakkoumon, Joe solos Australia, Black War Greymon doesn't die protecting Cody's Grandfather.

Removing Davis also impacts little. We could get Gatomon and Patamon using Courage or Friendship, or Tentomon and Gabumon, since they can use Courage and Friendship, respectively. They don't find out Ken's Secret identity until episode 21, but since them finding out his identity did nothing, it doesn't matter. Garurumon does what Raidramon does to free Metal Greymon, with the other Digimon distracting him. Someon e else uses the Golden Egg. TK/Kari push for destroying Golemon. Since someone else used the Golden Digi-Egg, they posit that Ken's changed instead. The others let Ken head towards his old base to deactivate it, while they distract Okuwunmon. Since they have more time, Ken is able to get the Crest of Kindness out, and is able to use it to get Stingmon to digivolve to Dino Beemon who replaces Paildramon. Dino Beemon digivolves into Imperialdramon. Mimi solos America. They break out of Malo Myotismon's illusions on their own.

Remove all 3 of them and Matt and Izzy get the Digi-Eggs of Friendship and Courage, respectively, with Kari and TK splitting the others between them. Someone else uses the Digi-Egg of Miracles and thinks Ken can redeem himself. 7 experienced champions, Stingmon and Nefertimon should be able to handle a single Ultimate. They Kill Arukenimon and Muumymon in Episode 29. Azulongmon restores their ability to go above Champion to take on the Daemon Corp. Episodes 30 to 42 don't happen as there is no Arukenimon or Mummymon to get then started. The Oikawa encounters prior to and episodes 46 to 50 don't happen as he has no minions to collect Children, open Gates, intimidate Ken, etc. Since he can't create more Dark Spores, Malo Myotismon never restores himself.

Remove Tai and Shellmon kills the others in episode 2, and Myotismon rulse our world because there's no one to hinder him. Remove Matt, and Piedmon kills all of them. Remove Sora, and Demi Devimon's machinations work. Remove Izzy, and everyone dies because Izzy solved so many problems in Digimon Adventure. Remove Mimi, and everyone stays trapped in Toy Town. Remove Joe, and TK drowns. Remove TK, and Devimon kills all of them. Remove Kari, an Machinedramon kills most of them, and Piedmon kills the rest.

edited 21st Oct '12 10:41:51 AM by Shotguner159

This is a really stupid thread of conversation. If you just remove someone and assume everything else goes somewhere, then yeah, nothing changes. If you remove them and assume everything dependent on their mere presence doesn't happen, then yeah, things could go all Butterfly of Doom.

Though it is nice to think of the original digidestined soloing entire countries. Especially Sora, Joe, Izzy or Mimi.

edited 21st Oct '12 10:36:41 AM by wanderlustwarrior

Most of it is because other Digimon can use the Digi-Eggs that Davis, Yolei and Cody had. If they couldn't, then there is no work around for several situations. Since other Digimon can, they can be replaced.

edited 21st Oct '12 10:47:40 AM by Shotguner159

Who can use what Digi egg became blurred after 02 had been going on at the time. At first, only those six could use the eggs, Agumon and Gabumon getting armor forms was from a gag, Tentomon from a card game and those like Sethmon from video games. It is easy to say "get rid of this one and that one" now...I mean they were probably making it up as they went along but it would have taken much more thought. Digimon is not just a cartoon, it is a toy commercial. If Bandai wants a monster from the V-pets or a new digimon action figure to be in a starring role it has to be done and then you have even more executive meddling from TOEI...

Actually in the case of 02 the meddling came from a single Bandai exec (the producer). Where as they usually just give the writers the digimon, the evolutions, the digivices, and terms to use, in 02 the writers were forced to include other things well after the initial planning stages. They were forced to add in a character (Daisuke), give characters certain personalities (Daisuke, Miyako and Iori), and take out an entire arc. Perhaps the only character that ended up relatively free from the meddling was Ken (and even then he didn't come out completely unscathed as his entire relationship with Daisuke was due to executive meddling).

Removing any of the characters from Adventure will change the story significantly as it won't get rid of the danger that the one character saved the others from. Also frequently another character cannot take their place.

The same can actually be said for Tamers, removing Takato means that Ruki and Jen won't become a team, as it was Takato's personality that brought them together in the first place, kept them together, and helped to get them to open up. Seriously if there was a character with a personality like the average gogglehead here no one except maybe Hirokazu and Kenta would have followed them (cause neither Jen or Ruki would have any patience for them or follow them), plus considering how unforgiving the Tamers universe is he wouldn't get very far.

For Ruki without her then they would be overrun with Digimon.

Without Jen then they don't find out any of the mysteries.

edited 21st Oct '12 4:30:45 PM by TheTropeEater

Well yeah Execs will get in the way as will the Throw It In! s from other writers

Nonetheless the other seasons seemed better planned out (Executive Meddling certainly didn't help) when it came to ensuring all characters develop for good under unique circumstances.

What I was trying to say, except straight to the point. Thank you, Wander.

Although I have no idea where the country thing came from.

From the around the world arc.

Comes from the post above mine. She/he mentioned Sora soloing Russia, and Joe soloing Australia.

I assume (s)he meant they'd beat whoever they encountered during the World Tour with their digimon partners, but instead, I choose to believe (s)he meant the digidestined beating up entire populations if they get looked at funny.

Also, you're welcome.

edited 21st Oct '12 7:41:54 PM by wanderlustwarrior

I like that definition as well.

Do I dare make a In Soviet Union, Sora beats you joke?

Do I?

DO IT.

The sad thing is if they hadn't nerfed Sora in 02 she probably would have been able to handle the situation just fine on her own.

How on Earth was she nerfed?

she couldn't make Biyomon become Garudamon.

Besides that it just came to me.

Renamon is a child level digimon right? as in the digimon equivalent of a child, so doesn't that make the people who draw and enjoy Renamon furry porn pedophiles?

She could though, during the World Tour. I'm pretty sure she was one of the ones who got power from Gennai.

And probably but I think if they're getting off on Renamon porn they don't really care.

edited 21st Oct '12 11:22:24 PM by Saiga