Wut?: Female Success Is Family

^^ that raises some concerns for the new name. Are we sure that it won't be as misleading?

This trope doesn't require that the man be her lover or that sex be involved at all. A woman who gets a position of some authority because she's the daughter of her father would still be Female Success is Family, even though it's not sexual favors that got her there.

Hmm. Women Need Family Connections?

That could work. Really well actually

Wait, when and why was the crowner locked?

Uh, according to post 47, you did that?

Huh. Didn't recall doing that.

I'd change my password if I were you.

What to do about the Female Success Is To Have A Family misuse? I mean it's directly related to (but not quite the same as) Christmas Cake and other tropes.

^ Change the bad wicks to whichever trope they really should point to.

^^ No, I did it. I just didn't recall doing it when I saw the crowner locked.

^^ Redirect to Acceptable Feminine Goals, I think. If I remember correctly, they're about the same thing.

Yeah - it seriously doesn't help that I'm sure I've seen this trope used quite wrongly before. But I think the variants of it need to be clarified:

1) Female characters are only considered successful if they raise a family (in addition to, or instead of, other goals or desires they may have) 1a) Female characters who don't have a family - despite whatever other astonishing achievements they may have - are considered or consider themselves to be a tragic failure as a woman. NOT - A female character - any female character - has, or would like to have, a husband and children.

2) All or most female characters within a work exist largely or entirely as satellite characters of more important male characters. 2a) Despite whatever skills or attributes a particular female character may possess, she is nonetheless introduced as and present in the story because she is the love interest or relative of a male character. NOT - An important female character is related in some way to an important male character.

The problem is, they are not variants. The first part isn't meant to be part of the trope, except for when it leads to he main function changing from being "the heroine" to being "the love interrest" or "the mother", it just seems that way from the name of it. As for the second part, I think simply being a relative definately qualifies, because in 90% of the cases being related to an important male character means being constantly referred to as "his sister", "his niece", "his girlfriend", etc.

I think "Man-Made Woman" is the best so far. A character who falls victim to this trope can be an Action Girl, after all, and needn't be a satellite character, but still got where she is by relying on or having a connection to a man — not necessarily one she's even overshadowed by.

Well, we still need to either get the crowner unlocked, or else rename to Never a Self-Made Woman.

How do we rename a Trope? The crowner is now quite clear that Never a Self-Made Woman is the new title for this trope.

You open up the new name article for editing, paste over all the text of the old article, replace all the links from indexes with the new name, ask a mod to move the discussion to the new name, and then turn the old name into a redirect.

edited 11th Sep '11 7:27:28 AM by MetaFour

Meta, we've got a shiny page that explains how now.

Seconded.

bump

Bump again. Since we're clearing out threads, all for the move?

Yep, it's time. If no one objects, I'll do it.

I migrated the old discussion page over to the new name. Anything else need to be done here, or can we lock?

That would be the wicks, I guess. Any way of accessing them now that the page is a redirect?

Use this link, for wicks to the old article.

thank you