The Literate Union Group

courtesy link.

I know what they say about people on Fanfiction.net, and all, but this group has caught my attention.

They seem to me, as a first impression, to be a sort of pretentious group of grammar and spelling police and elitists who have a certain attitude to them that I just dislike.

Did anyone else here have any experiences with this group?

While they are rather good at hunting down plagiarists, quite a few of them seem to be assholes because they can get away with it.

Yeah, a lot of them seem to delight in randomly flaming people whose standards do not meet theirs.

Their favorite targets are really unfair, the probably not mentally prepared Twilight megafans, who are most likely young teen girls, and any badfic writers who are probably likewise not mentally mature enough to deal with it.

I've run into them before. I don't mind giving constructive criticism, but doing it in such a way that it's only there to insult the other person, well, nah, you're just being an ass at that point.

Seems like a standard userbase overreaction to a poor interface that doesn't allow for efficient sorting of stories based on grammatical issues. They're probably doing more harm than good, unfortunately - most of the writers getting flamed are likely just kids who're just learning to stretch their wings. On the other hand, if school taught our kids to write properly in the FIRST PLACE... grumblegrumble....

Also, Usht, that link was hilarious reading.

edited 11th Apr '11 11:10:26 AM by Karkadinn

I tend to find it more obnoxious than funny. I definitely was a pretty terrible writing at one point and I wouldn't have made any progress if I had these sort of people kicking me in the shins for trying.

The internet is not well-known for being a repository for kind-hearted comments. On the other hand, F Fnet, like most sites with comment systems, is exceptional in that most feedback is positive by default. How many positive one liners does it take to even out a single negative rant? Human beings do weigh loss more highly than success, so probably a lot.

Well, I mean, they're meant to spread constructive criticism that will help writers. Many of the members I see are just using it as an excuse to beat up on others and that bugs me to no end.

I agree, but that thin line between constructive criticism and negativity doesn't get much less thin even in the professional industry, and there's a little pessimistic part of me that thinks that maybe it's better to crush someone's hopes and dreams while they're still young. ;)

Now see, that's wrong. No one starts off amazing at what they do and writing is no exception. More so, writing can be a hobby, not necessarily something work related and to post your writing can be fun. To get positive feedback is even more enjoyable, but to get there first, you need some help and just shooting someone in the foot before they can even take three steps is just assholish.

But at the same time, there is no excuse for bad spelling. Every browser has a spell-check function, and even free word processors have spell checkers nowadays. I fully support being nasty to people who are too lazy to check their spelling.

On the other hand though, I can understand bad grammar. Not everybody grew up in an English speaking country, and even in English speaking countries there are dialects that completely throw grammar out the window. A misplaced comma isn't going to detract from readability.

Edit: And after reading through their rules, they do explicitly state that constructive criticism be given, even if you want to flame or troll.

edited 11th Apr '11 2:56:04 PM by DrunkGirlfriend

I read the actual fic the review was attempting to review. Very difficult to follow.

I wonder if the use of scathing reviews is an attempt to rid the world of potential fanfic authors by discouragement.

The point is that it isn't about the quality of the fic or the fic writer, it's about the fact that this group is has a few too many elitists that use other writers as a punching bag. If you don't like the fan fiction in particular, don't read it, but last I checked, the people writing the fan fiction enjoy it and they aren't harming anyone.

Considering how feedback across social media these days has often been minimized into thumbs up/thumbs down responses, or just number of page views, it gets really difficult to encourage improvement in people who already don't have any clue on how to use constructive criticism, let alone the cut-down statistics.

An attempt to build up the harsh truth - from simple corrections of spelling, into what's wrong with the pacing and smaller plot holes - before the page-long analysis is dropped on them achieves better results in my experience. If we're talking about FF.net, given how cluttered some of the review sections end up, something short and sweet has a much higher chance of actually being read anyways. Especially since lots of the people who write longer reviews have no idea what they're talking about either.

Even if the author will listen to a longer review, it's unlikely that someone is going to see a single post's worth of suggestions and suddenly become awakened to the art of narrative prose. It's usually more consistent to encourage the author's entire practice rather than getting on their case about the set of mistakes they made for a single story.

Direction that helps them each time they sit down to write is a steadier means of cultivating that skill over time. If they’re only writing as a fun little diversion, then yeah, maybe spicing up their fic for them is the better option. But a person like that doesn’t really need a full-blown review to have their fun anyway, and outright flaming them accomplishes nothing more than raining on their parade. I guess there are some people who make that into a hobby… Still, flaming that hard seems more likely to get you branded as a hater and a pissant, at the risk of invalidating any real criticisms (or future flames) you might have.

So unless you get your giggles telling people they suck, flaming seems a little futile to me.

Then again, not everyone who opens a comment section will be so wide-eyed and receptive of anything that suggests they're doing a bad job. I guess being so vicious means you'll never look dumb for giving polite, genuine advice to someone who doesn't want it.

Ahh criticism, when ever I get harsh Criticism I think about Margaret Atwood , told by her parents that her spelling and grammar were horrific and that she might never make it as an author. She was published two years later , and in the early 2000's she was named one of the 100 best writers by Writers Digest, she's also won several awards. The moral to the story is some people are just dicks who are jealous of your size.

The fact that a few exceptional authors can succeed despite being told that they can't doesn't prove anything on that front, because for every misunderstood genius, there are thousands who probably won't make it.

They'll never know if they don't try harder.

When I get harsh criticism I read the thing a few times and think it over. I pick away things and try to find something of use. Something to keep in mind. Something to improve.

I have no interest in being a great writer or "making it big" or anything like that. I write for fun. It is done ultimately for my enjoyment and I can get enough enjoyment from what little I do write and what little attention I do get. I may not write sprawling epics that get published, but hey...If I am happy writing my shitty fanfiction and miscellaneous "original" bullshit and the people reading it enjoy it then what do I care? I am getting enough.

That doesn't mean I don't try to improve though. I do try.

edited 12th Apr '11 10:32:13 PM by Aondeug

I don't want to become a big writer either, but I wouldn't mind a small group of dedicated fans I can get to know though. Since i want people to have more of an emotional contention to my characters and writings than anything else.

I don't even really care too much about getting a dedicated group of fans. It'd be nice I guess, but eh.