That is, if you're establishing them all on a protagonist basis of course.

edited 3rd Feb '13 11:04:32 PM by KnownUnknown

What do you mean by that?

I mean that cordoning off everyone in groups of focus like Heroes is only really necessary if you want to establish all of the characters in a protagonist sense - or at least establish them more or less in separation from one another.

If you're establishing most of them as secondary characters, it should suffice to have only a few focus characters and have the others' characterizations come through via story - not entirely difficult even with a cast of Sonic's, but also something that the Sonic series kind of goes back and forth in terms of being good at. It seems to kind of... take its secondary characters' roles for granted these days, but it's not always necessary to reimagine characters in order to fix that. The way they looked at Tails' personality a new way during and post Colors, for example - applied to the rest of the characters with healthy roles in the plot? Should work wonders.

Especially since it feels like even though most of the characters have already found their niches, the series doesn't often really use them to their fullest.

edited 3rd Feb '13 11:36:07 PM by KnownUnknown

Team Dark could be Blaze, Shadow and Silver. Blaze and Silver come from a pretty dark reality, with Solaris and Iblis and all that (unless it's been written out of canon or something), and Shadow... Well, it's Shadow. That way, Rouge can join Team Rose.

As for Gamma, don't they all end up dying anyway?

There is no Team Dark other than Shadow, Rouge, and Omega.

Yet, anyway.

Wait, there was Team Dark without Omega in Sonic Free Riders, but I don't accept that at all because they didn't so much as explain his absence and the new Power was just Metal Sonic in disguise.

I just imagined Metal Sonic with a big fake mustache.

I just assumed Blaze and Silver would make their own team with Big. It fits the power/speed/flying dynamic.

Nah, he would be too out of place. They'd probably never bring her back, but Tikal could fit with the mysterious person from the future/past/other dimension thing. And if she's anything like Knuckles, she must be pretty strong.

If her abilities in SA 2 Battle are anything to go by, she is Knuckles , only more enthasis on agility and less on strength.

I'm mixed about Heroes' group dynamic, since while it gave better excuses for the characters to be used, it often downgraded a lot of them to just 'one protagonist plus two generic sidekicks'. Knuckles doesn't really work as a tag along for Sonic, and I feel the likes of Rouge and Omega would work better if developed more as individuals than glued to Shadow's side all the time.

I think this is why a lot of them felt shoehorned in Next Gen. There's no point in adding these characters if they don't belong.

@darkabomination: Satam might hold up standalone, though with the franchise more established it likely sticks out like a sore thumb as a Sonic continuation. In terms of quality, it had a decent setup and was workable in potential, but in terms of execution, it felt a tad pretentious and lacking in proper depth (especially in the second season due to Flanderization). It was also ripe with outdated 90s slang. If you've watched old 80s and 90s action cartoons you pretty much know what to expect.

On a more minor note, you must like Sally to enjoy it.

edited 4th Feb '13 9:04:32 AM by Psi001

Hmm, well I don't know much about her so I don't know if I will or not. Put it this way, I put up with the tons of human focussed crap that was Sonic x to get to the better parts of the show, so I don't think anything aside from Underground can be worse than that.

Just as long as you don't mind Sally always, always, always being right and Sonic always, always, always being wrong.

So, Metal Sonic Kai would have been a good Death Egg boss.

Well she was wrong once.

I like Sally (in Satam at least) though it was kinda a bad idea to make Sonic's polar opposite a Women Are Wiser archetype.

Not that he didn't deserve it a lot of times, the show made Sonic a tad too much of an arrogant dumbass. I can't imagine how more insufferable he would be if he didn't get called out for it.

edited 4th Feb '13 6:16:22 PM by Psi001

I blame Hurst for that. If she was his polar opposite, Sally should probably have been a long-term thinker, but either uptight or with a short temper.

Sally was bad tempered and uptight, it just never hindered her nearly as badly as Sonic's flaws. Even when she was wrong it was mainly because they had a personality switch and she became the opportunistic one. I think a lot of shows go overboard in the whole 'being reckless' moral and fail to pinpoint the difference between taking stupid risks and taking any risks whatsoever. It's just as bad a life lesson to urge people to always stay sheltered and shy from taking potential opportunities, especially in heated situations like a war.

I think it would have worked a lot better if they had went for a compromise of the two's ethics, with each of them taking turns being the instigator and The Straight Man. It seems more realistic to make the two extremes compromise their positive traits for the appropriate situation, rather than making either the reckless show off or the sheltered finicky one ALWAYS right or wrong no matter what.

I stand by my theory that a perfectly developed Sally is basically Twilight Sparkle.

edited 4th Feb '13 6:30:41 PM by Psi001

Some of the fanfics go a long way to showing why she's like that. Personally I find that the SATAM version of Sonic is more of a pain in the neck than Classic Sonic or Modern Sonic.

I liked Satam Sally over Archie Sally since she did at least have some flaws and whimsical qualities, it was just rarely put into depthful execution outside comic relief (eg. her snit fits at Sonic). Archie Sally doesn't have quite as much of a pedestal over Sonic, but she also seems a lot duller.

I agree Satam Sonic just bordered too far into Jerk Jock territory at times, dumb, ridiculously narcissistic and occasionally bullying to his teammates. Oddly Aosth Sonic, despite being practically the same mould, was much more likeable, likely due to more positive foils (Aosth Sonic had a surrogate little brother, Satam Sonic had a 'babysitter' and an Acceptable Target to his bullying tendancies).

I don't mind Modern Sonic, at least in the games (Sonic X Sonic is a bland Ace, while Archie Sonic comes off as odiously self righteous at times). He's not the most three dimentional character, but he's approachable and endearing.

edited 4th Feb '13 7:20:31 PM by Psi001

Modern Sonic is pretty chill and snarky. He even holds back during the Olympics just to have fun :V

True, he'd actually probably make an ideal foil for Sally. Opportunistic and cocky, but very easy going and competent enough to be more her equal.

Sonic doesn't take enough aspects seriously. Sally takes too many seriously.

edited 4th Feb '13 7:29:57 PM by Psi001

Are there any decent SATM fics? I know the show ends on a cliffhanger, so it'd be nice to get some kind of closure, even if fan made.

Also, I actually like AOSTH. It may be silly and have the maturity of a 7 year old on Red Bowl, but it had a wacky charm and Robotnick was just fun.

Would Archie technically count as a continuation of SatAM?

Some of Dan Drazen's fics are pretty good.

I haven't read much of the Archie comic, but I know a fair bit of the plot. It sounds interesting mostly, but I dunno about this Ixis guy.