Warhammer 40,000

All of the reliable rumor people have been saying this isn't End Times 40K for a while.

Okay, question:

Chaos Havocs, I see that they have a choice of Flamer/Heavy Bolter/Autocannon/Meltagun/Plasma Gun/Missile Launcher/Lascannon for their Heavy Weapons. I was wondering, what are the numbers?

'cause I think I was doing the "Teeth of Khorne" from way back when in 2nd, which were World Eaters Havocs specifically armed with, iirc, Flamer/Heavy Bolter/Autocannon/Plasma Gun/Missile Launcher as their choice of weapons.

Those sound like a good set-up for a squad of Havocs? Especially for a Khorne-themed army?

Also, I can't tell, are Havoc squads 5-man or? The Codex: Chaos Space Marines my FLGS ordered for me hasn't come in yet, so I'm unable to check that in the rules right now.

edited 29th Jan '17 9:40:28 PM by BlackSunNocturne

Havocs are 5 - 10. I like the idea of four plasma guns, but the loadout really depends on what else you're running. Some people really like four lascannons, but the truth is that lascannons don't mathhammer particularly well these days.

I'm not too familiar with marks/icons, so I won't comment on those.

I was more wondering what works best in a Khorne-themed army (mine's gonna be a mish-mash of all different World Eaters Warbands) thematically.

Though yeah, the Plasma Cannons sounds like it'd be interesting

I was talking about plasma guns, not cannons. Probably with a Rhino to cart them around.

Fluffologically, the World Eaters had every form of Astartes weapon represented in their Legion, so you can do anything, really!

.... Wait, I thought Havocs had access to Plasma Cannons?

Plasma Guns is a whole other thing Derp from me.

So probably two squads, one with 5 Plasma Guns, and the other with 5 Rocket Launchers, with the rest being split between Autocannons and Heavy Bolters.

In 40K, you can only get four special/heavy weapons in a Havoc squad (although a squad of six Chosen can bring five).

I don't miss the days of 5th edition where a Chimera would get instagibbed on turn 1, but I do miss missile launchers and lascannons being useful.

Still not embarrassing enough to stan billionaires or tech companies.

To quote Russ

"What the WOLF did you just say?!"

"You can reply to this Message!"

I knew PETA were nuts but that is just stupid.

On a more sane note, what trope do people think a Land Speeder would count as? I have seen it listed a Flying Car but that seems more appropriate for civilian vehicles. Hover Tank is a possibility but would it be a little too light to count for that?

Haha, fur animals have it worse than anything depicted in 40K? That's fucking cute.

PETA is so goddamn stupid.

We need them to come out and defend the tyranids. They're precious animals, right?

edited 30th Jan '17 6:54:33 AM by Rotpar

"But don't give up hope. Everyone is cured sooner or later. In the end we shall shoot you." - O'Brien, 1984

PETA kills more animals in a year than a Space Marine kills in their career.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.

... Shit. Well, that messes with that then.

Honestly, that kind of bugs me now: Most of the pictures on the GW site show the proper configuration for a Space Marine/Chaos Space Marine squad, but the Havoc one shows a single Aspiring champion and the other four having a Lascannon, Heavy Bolter, Missile Launcher and Autocannon.

Unless I'm misreading what you say, that is.

If it's anything like 5-ed loyalists, then the Aspiring Champion isn't supposed to have a heavy weapon.

"And as long as a sack of shit is not a good thing to be, chivalry will never die."

No, I meant that CountDorku makes it sound like a Havoc squad can only have 4 heavy weapons. I was thinking one could make the squad bigger for more points, like most other squads.

Side note: I found an awesome blog last night. Eternal Hunt: A Blog about KrautScientist's wargaming exploits. It's a guy's blog mostly regarding 40k, and Khorne stuff especially.

I loved his Angron conversions, especially the "normal" unarmored Angron made from the Warhammer Slaughterpriest.

If it's anything like 5E loyalists, then it's true that they can only have four heavy weapons. Paying more points just adds more bodies with bolters.

"And as long as a sack of shit is not a good thing to be, chivalry will never die."

Ah. Well, my Codex: Chaos Space Marines will be coming in either today (if it did today, I can't check because my FLGS is closed on Mondays) or tomorrow, so I'll be able to check it out to see.

'cause, I've seen quite a few 10-man Havoc squads with 9 heavy weapons

edited 30th Jan '17 8:01:34 AM by BlackSunNocturne

Well it's not like they follow the Codex Astartes...

Edit: Maybe you can check on 1d4chan's tactics page for Chaos?

edited 30th Jan '17 8:04:29 AM by Medinoc

"And as long as a sack of shit is not a good thing to be, chivalry will never die."

Just did. "You start with a squad of 5, that can take four Specials/Heavy Weapons at any squad size"

Damn it

I thought part of the thing with Chaos Marines was that since they're just warbands, without an actual infrastructure and a manufacturing base behind them, that they actually have to deal with old, repaired or scavenged weaponry, whereas Imperial Marines have all their Chapter serfs and forges and Forge Worlds behind them, and that the Mechanicum and the Astartes basically get along fine, while CSM and the Dark Mechanicum are loosely aligned together, but Chaos factions are naturally divisive, and you never get anything from the Dark Mechanicum for free. So the Dark Mechanicum are not analogous to the Mechanicum in that they regularly supply the Marines, they're somewhat closer to Homunculi if anything. You want something from them, you have to pay the price.

And that was always the distinction between Chaos and Loyalist Marines - loyalists have the Imperium and all it's infrastructure and technological advancements behind it (Land Raider variants and Razorback for example) while Chaos is backed by the ruinous powers. So it makes sense that Astartes are better equipped, while Chaos have their unique units like Plague Marines, Possessed, the Daemon engines, etc...

"...in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach."

The irony is that, according to fluff, some of the the CSM armoury is more advanced and effective than the loyalist stuff.

Well, some of the bigger Legions/Warbands own or have alliances with industrialized worlds, or even heretical forge worlds within the Eye. And if they overrun and hold such worlds in real space, that does wonders for their supply chains.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.

Plus all the Traitors still have a good bit of stuff from the Great Crusade, so of course it'd be more advanced.

Also, why the heck would PETA think animals in the 41st Millennium are persecuted? Fenrisian wolves are like the size of a bus! And to get those fur accents I think they have to kill the wolves themselves!

PETA are, to paraphrase from the first Ice Age movie, doing it for attention, just ignore them.

As for heavy weapons, in 40K, yeah, additional bodies in a Havoc squad beyond the four who can bring big guns are just ablative wounds. If you're seeing squads with nine, those are probably for 30K armies, where the rules are different.

Ah, okay.

So a good choice for Havocs would be like.... three Squads or so? One with Plasma Guns, one with Missile Launchers and one with Heavy Bolters/Autocannons

Also: I'm looking at the Toxicrene/Malaceptor model I have and I'm thinking to myself "I could totally turn this into a Daemon Engine with some Greenstuf"

Ah, alrighty then

edited 30th Jan '17 11:10:23 AM by BlackSunNocturne