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** [[spoiler: Kassad's DyingMomentOfAwesome in battle with the Shrike]]

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** [[spoiler: Kassad's DyingMomentOfAwesome in battle with the Shrike]]Shrike.]]

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* {{Sequelitis}}: The 3 other books in the ''Hyperion Cantos'' - ''Fall of Hyperion'', ''Endymion'', and ''The Rise of Endymion'' - are [[BrokenBase divisive]]. Or perhaps it might be more accurate to say the second ''pair'' is divisive - the series is really two two-part stories, with the first dealing with a mystery and a large and diverse cast in a world somewhere between cyberpunk and post-scarcity, and the second dealing with the fairly direct exposition of all the mysteries, a much smaller cast with a single central character, an obsessive focus on a romance (you'll never read the words 'My love' so often) and a setting most readers will probably find regressive from that from the first two novels, albeit with some interesting nightmarish technologies of its own. The two pairs are so different that it's unlikely any given reader will like both equally.


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* {{Sequelitis}}: The 3 other books in the ''Hyperion Cantos'' - ''Fall of Hyperion'', ''Endymion'', and ''The Rise of Endymion'' - are [[BrokenBase divisive]]. Or perhaps it might be more accurate to say the second ''pair'' is divisive - the series is really two two-part stories, with the first dealing with a mystery and a large and diverse cast in a world somewhere between cyberpunk and post-scarcity, and the second dealing with the fairly direct exposition of all the mysteries, a much smaller cast with a single central character, an obsessive focus on a romance (you'll never read the words 'My love' so often) and a setting most readers will probably find regressive from that from the first two novels, albeit with some interesting nightmarish technologies of its own. The two pairs are so different that it's unlikely any given reader will like both equally.
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tropeslashing isn't allowed.


* EvenBetterSequel[=/=]{{Sequelitis}}: The 3 other books in the ''Hyperion Cantos'' - ''Fall of Hyperion'', ''Endymion'', and ''The Rise of Endymion'' - are [[BrokenBase divisive]]. Or perhaps it might be more accurate to say the second ''pair'' is divisive - the series is really two two-part stories, with the first dealing with a mystery and a large and diverse cast in a world somewhere between cyberpunk and post-scarcity, and the second dealing with the fairly direct exposition of all the mysteries, a much smaller cast with a single central character, an obsessive focus on a romance (you'll never read the words 'My love' so often) and a setting most readers will probably find regressive from that from the first two novels, albeit with some interesting nightmarish technologies of its own. The two pairs are so different that it's unlikely any given reader will like both equally.

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* EvenBetterSequel[=/=]{{Sequelitis}}: {{Sequelitis}}: The 3 other books in the ''Hyperion Cantos'' - ''Fall of Hyperion'', ''Endymion'', and ''The Rise of Endymion'' - are [[BrokenBase divisive]]. Or perhaps it might be more accurate to say the second ''pair'' is divisive - the series is really two two-part stories, with the first dealing with a mystery and a large and diverse cast in a world somewhere between cyberpunk and post-scarcity, and the second dealing with the fairly direct exposition of all the mysteries, a much smaller cast with a single central character, an obsessive focus on a romance (you'll never read the words 'My love' so often) and a setting most readers will probably find regressive from that from the first two novels, albeit with some interesting nightmarish technologies of its own. The two pairs are so different that it's unlikely any given reader will like both equally.
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* HilariousInHindsight: Since Moneta is revealed to be [[spoiler:future Rachel, this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had throes-of passion InterplayerOfSexAndViolence type sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]

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* HilariousInHindsight: Since Moneta is revealed to be [[spoiler:future Rachel, this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had throes-of passion throes-of-passion InterplayerOfSexAndViolence type sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]
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* HilariousInHindsight: Since Moneta is revealed to be [[spoiler:future Rachel, this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]

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* HilariousInHindsight: Since Moneta is revealed to be [[spoiler:future Rachel, this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had throes-of passion InterplayerOfSexAndViolence type sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]
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--->Dolphin: ''Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Shark/Shark/Shark'' (It's "miss" as in "pine for", not "madame".)

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--->Dolphin: ''Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Shark/Shark/Shark'' (It's "miss" as in "pine "yearning/pining for", not "madame".)
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** The first book has quite a tender moment between all of the characters near the end. Each of them resolving to face the Shrike together.

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** The first book has quite a tender moment between all of the characters near the end. Each of them resolving to face the Shrike together.together while singing "We're off to see the Wizard [of Oz]" with laughter on their faces.
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** Father Duré had problems at the beginning of his story due to the discovery that he faked the results of an archaeological expedition. The books often compare him to and reference Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, who, along with other things, was among the people who found the Piltdown Man, and caught a lot of flak once it was exposed as fake (not that he was the chief suspect, it's just that all the other serious suspects were dead by then).
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* EvenBetterSequel: The 3 other books in the ''Hyperion'' quadtrilogy - ''Fall of Hyperion'', ''Endymion'', and ''The Rise of Endymion'' are regarded by some readers as even better than the original novel. On the other hand, some consider the second pair to be substantially inferior to the [[FirstInstallmentWins first two]]. The überseries is really two two-part series, with the first dealing with a mystery and a large and diverse cast in a hyperfuture somewhere between cyberpunk and post-scarcity and the second dealing with the fairly direct exposition of that mystery, a much smaller cast, an obsessive focus on a romance (you'll never read the words 'My love' so often) and a setting most readers will probably find regressive from that from the first two novels, albeit with some interesting nightmare fuel technologies of its own. YMMV, but the two series are so different that it's unlikely any given reader will like both equally.

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* EvenBetterSequel: EvenBetterSequel[=/=]{{Sequelitis}}: The 3 other books in the ''Hyperion'' quadtrilogy ''Hyperion Cantos'' - ''Fall of Hyperion'', ''Endymion'', and ''The Rise of Endymion'' - are regarded by some readers as even better than the original novel. On the other hand, some consider [[BrokenBase divisive]]. Or perhaps it might be more accurate to say the second pair to be substantially inferior to ''pair'' is divisive - the [[FirstInstallmentWins first two]]. The überseries series is really two two-part series, stories, with the first dealing with a mystery and a large and diverse cast in a hyperfuture world somewhere between cyberpunk and post-scarcity post-scarcity, and the second dealing with the fairly direct exposition of that mystery, all the mysteries, a much smaller cast, cast with a single central character, an obsessive focus on a romance (you'll never read the words 'My love' so often) and a setting most readers will probably find regressive from that from the first two novels, albeit with some interesting nightmare fuel nightmarish technologies of its own. YMMV, but the The two series pairs are so different that it's unlikely any given reader will like both equally. equally.



** The color of the sky in Hyperion is frequently described as "lapis lazuli." The specific shade of sky blue on Earth is commonly called "azure," which derives from the Latin word for the lapis lazuli mineral.

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** The color colour of the sky in Hyperion is frequently described as "lapis lazuli." The specific shade of sky blue on Earth is commonly called "azure," which derives from the Latin word for the lapis lazuli mineral.
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Not YMMV and ZCE


* FauxlosophicNarration: "The Void which Binds", etc. Aenea's "philosophical" lectures basically amount to this.
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Not YMMV


* DoubleStandardRapeFemaleOnMale: It's portrayed as okay and even romantic because they're "fated lovers", but neither Moneta nor Aenea give their respective partners much of a chance to say "no".
** After Moneta seriously injures Kassad in a violent confrontation, she forces herself on him while he screams "No!" and tries to fight back. She remains a sympathetic character afterwards and he later rationalizes that he must have wanted it.
** In Aenea's case, rather than tell Raul she'd like to start a romantic relationship, she surprises him naked and jumps on him, and ignores his protests. He resists for maybe five seconds and it's stated to be [[NotIfTheyEnjoyedItRationalization the best sex of his life]], but there was an uncomfortable age gap, he'd really only known her as a small child up until then and she was technically his employer - it's hard to imagine this playing nearly as well if the genders were reversed.

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* DoubleStandardRapeFemaleOnMale: It's portrayed as okay and even romantic because they're "fated lovers", but neither Moneta nor Aenea give their respective partners much of a chance to say "no". In Aenea's case, rather than tell Raul she'd like to start a romantic relationship, she surprises him naked and jumps on him, and ignores his protests. He resists for maybe five seconds and it's stated to be [[NotIfTheyEnjoyedItRationalization the best sex of his life]], but there was an uncomfortable age gap, he'd really only known her as a small child up until then and she was technically his employer - it's hard to imagine this playing nearly as well if the genders were reversed.

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* DoubleStandardRapeFemaleOnMale: It's portrayed as okay and even romantic because they're "fated lovers", but neither Moneta nor Aenea give their respective partners much of a chance to say "no". "no".
** After Moneta seriously injures Kassad in a violent confrontation, she forces herself on him while he screams "No!" and tries to fight back. She remains a sympathetic character afterwards and he later rationalizes that he must have wanted it.
**
In Aenea's case, rather than tell Raul she'd like to start a romantic relationship, she surprises him naked and jumps on him, and ignores his protests. He resists for maybe five seconds and it's stated to be [[NotIfTheyEnjoyedItRationalization the best sex of his life]], but there was an uncomfortable age gap, he'd really only known her as a small child up until then and she was technically his employer - it's hard to imagine this playing nearly as well if the genders were reversed.
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** Martin Silenus spent some time with his body remade to look like a Satyr. Silenus was the name of a Satyr who was a companion of the Greek god Dionysus.

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the sci-fi ghetto trope is not for when *you, the editing troper* think something is silly because it's genre fiction.


* SciFiGhetto: The whole series is based on poems by Creator/JohnKeats. It's still genre fiction, though.
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Not a YMMV trope


* SesquipedalianLoquaciousness: Aenea's aforementioned lectures. The author draws heavily on the terminology of several sophisticated real-life philosophies and religions to present simplistic hippie nonsense as deep philosophy.

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* GeniusBonus: The series is littered with literary references, from overt to subtle.
* SugarWiki/HeartwarmingMoments: The first book has quite a tender moment between all of the characters near the end. Each of them resolving to face the Shrike together.

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* GeniusBonus: GeniusBonus:
**
The series is littered with literary references, from overt to subtle.
** The color of the sky in Hyperion is frequently described as "lapis lazuli." The specific shade of sky blue on Earth is commonly called "azure," which derives from the Latin word for the lapis lazuli mineral.
* SugarWiki/HeartwarmingMoments: SugarWiki/HeartwarmingMoments:
**
The first book has quite a tender moment between all of the characters near the end. Each of them resolving to face the Shrike together.



* HilariousInHindsight: Since Moneta is revealed to be [[spoiler:[[FutureBadass future Rachel]], this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]

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* HilariousInHindsight: Since Moneta is revealed to be [[spoiler:[[FutureBadass future Rachel]], [[spoiler:future Rachel, this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]

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* CrowningMomentOfHeartwarming: The first book has quite a tender moment between all of the characters near the end. Each of them resolving to face the Shrike together.
** In the second book, the ending is even more heartwarming. And more than a little bit of a [[TearJerker tear jerker.]]



* SugarWiki/HeartwarmingMoments: The first book has quite a tender moment between all of the characters near the end. Each of them resolving to face the Shrike together.
** In the second book, the ending is even more heartwarming. And more than a little bit of a [[TearJerker tear jerker.]]



** The last 50 pages of ''The Rise of Endymion'' count too, but then the tears are mainly tears of happiness.

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** The last 50 pages of ''The Rise of Endymion'' count too, but then the tears are mainly tears of happiness.happiness.
----
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** Martin [[spoiler: On the Shrikes Tree]] with Sad King Billy.

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** Martin [[spoiler: On [[spoiler:on the Shrikes Tree]] with Sad King Billy.
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* HilariousInHindsight: Since Monte is revealed to be [[spoiler:[[FutureBadass future Rachel]], this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]

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* HilariousInHindsight: Since Monte Moneta is revealed to be [[spoiler:[[FutureBadass future Rachel]], this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]

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*CrowningMomentOfHeartwarming: The first book has quite a tender moment between all of the characters near the end. Each of them resolving to face the Shrike together.
**In the second book, the ending is even more heartwarming. And more than a little bit of a [[TearJerker tear jerker.]]



* HilariousInHindsight: Since Moneta is revealed to be [[spoiler:[[FutureBadass future Rachel]], this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]

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* HilariousInHindsight: Since Moneta Monte is revealed to be [[spoiler:[[FutureBadass future Rachel]], this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]



* SesquipedalianLoquaciousness: Aenea's aforementioned lectures. The author draws heavily on the terminology of several sophisticated real-life philosophies and religions to present simplistic hippie nonsense as deep philosophy.

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* SesquipedalianLoquaciousness: Aenea's aforementioned lectures. The author draws heavily on the terminology of several sophisticated real-life philosophies and religions to present simplistic hippie nonsense as deep philosophy.


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** Martin [[spoiler: On the Shrikes Tree]] with Sad King Billy.
--->''"My Lord, I'm sorry."''
** [[spoiler: Kassad's DyingMomentOfAwesome in battle with the Shrike]]
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Nightmare Fuel


* NightmareFuel:
** The Shrike itself
** The Archangel ships
** The tale of Father Hoyt/Father Duré
** The Shrike's Tree of Thorns, with its thousands of impaled humans being kept alive and conscious indefinitely. [[spoiler:The fact that it's just a massive simulation and the victims are being kept under and alive via IV drip somehow makes it ''worse''.]]
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Crowning Moment of Funny


* CrowningMomentOfFunny: Martin Silenus's story.
** Really, anytime the story focuses on him.
*** [[spoiler: Except when he's on the Shrike's tree.]]
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Crowning Moment of Awesome


* CrowningMomentOfAwesome: Colonel Kassad lives and breathes this. [[spoiler: Single combat with the Shrike.]]
** The one Raul Endymion gets in the 4th book. [[spoiler: Single combat with Nemes - a creature nearly as powerful as the Shrike. And he won!]] And Raul didn't even have nifty future armor.

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* TearJerker: Sol Weintraub's story, definitely. [[spoiler: Aenea's death as well.]]
** Merin's conversation with the dolphins
--->Dolphin: [[spoiler:''Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Shark/Shark/Shark'']]

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* TearJerker: Sol Weintraub's story, definitely.
** Merin's conversation with the dolphins.
--->Dolphin: ''Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Shark/Shark/Shark'' (It's "miss" as in "pine for", not "madame".)
**
[[spoiler: Aenea's death as well.]]
** Merin's conversation with the dolphins
--->Dolphin: [[spoiler:''Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Shark/Shark/Shark'']]
]]

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moved in from YMMV.Hyperion


* {{Fauxlosophic Narration}}: "The Void which Binds", etc. Aenea's "philosophical" lectures basically amount to this.
* NightmareFuel: The Shrike's Tree of Thorns, with its thousands of impaled humans being kept alive and conscious indefinitely. [[spoiler:The fact that it's just a massive simulation and the victims are being kept under and alive via IV drip somehow makes it ''worse''.]]
* {{Sesquipedalian Loquaciousness}}: Aenea's aforementioned lectures. The author draws heavily on the terminology of several sophisticated real-life philosophies and religions to present simplistic hippie nonsense as deep philosophy.

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* {{Fauxlosophic Narration}}: BadassDecay: [[spoiler:The limits of the Shrike's power are explored in the second duology, where it faces creatures nearly as powerful as itself.]]
* CrowningMomentOfAwesome: Colonel Kassad lives and breathes this. [[spoiler: Single combat with the Shrike.]]
** The one Raul Endymion gets in the 4th book. [[spoiler: Single combat with Nemes - a creature nearly as powerful as the Shrike. And he won!]] And Raul didn't even have nifty future armor.
* CrowningMomentOfFunny: Martin Silenus's story.
** Really, anytime the story focuses on him.
*** [[spoiler: Except when he's on the Shrike's tree.]]
* EvenBetterSequel: The 3 other books in the ''Hyperion'' quadtrilogy - ''Fall of Hyperion'', ''Endymion'', and ''The Rise of Endymion'' are regarded by some readers as even better than the original novel. On the other hand, some consider the second pair to be substantially inferior to the [[FirstInstallmentWins first two]]. The überseries is really two two-part series, with the first dealing with a mystery and a large and diverse cast in a hyperfuture somewhere between cyberpunk and post-scarcity and the second dealing with the fairly direct exposition of that mystery, a much smaller cast, an obsessive focus on a romance (you'll never read the words 'My love' so often) and a setting most readers will probably find regressive from that from the first two novels, albeit with some interesting nightmare fuel technologies of its own. YMMV, but the two series are so different that it's unlikely any given reader will like both equally.
* FauxlosophicNarration:
"The Void which Binds", etc. Aenea's "philosophical" lectures basically amount to this.
* NightmareFuel: GeniusBonus: The series is littered with literary references, from overt to subtle.
* HilariousInHindsight: Since Moneta is revealed to be [[spoiler:[[FutureBadass future Rachel]], this means that Kassad was telling Sol about all the times he ''had sex with Sol's daughter'' in his tale.]]
* NightmareFuel:
** The Shrike itself
** The Archangel ships
** The tale of Father Hoyt/Father Duré
**
The Shrike's Tree of Thorns, with its thousands of impaled humans being kept alive and conscious indefinitely. [[spoiler:The fact that it's just a massive simulation and the victims are being kept under and alive via IV drip somehow makes it ''worse''.]]
* {{Sesquipedalian Loquaciousness}}: SciFiGhetto: The whole series is based on poems by Creator/JohnKeats. It's still genre fiction, though.
* SesquipedalianLoquaciousness:
Aenea's aforementioned lectures. The author draws heavily on the terminology of several sophisticated real-life philosophies and religions to present simplistic hippie nonsense as deep philosophy.philosophy.
* TearJerker: Sol Weintraub's story, definitely. [[spoiler: Aenea's death as well.]]
** Merin's conversation with the dolphins
--->Dolphin: [[spoiler:''Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Miss Shark/Shark/Shark/Shark'']]
** The last 50 pages of ''The Rise of Endymion'' count too, but then the tears are mainly tears of happiness.
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Moved from the main page.

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* NightmareFuel: The Shrike's Tree of Thorns, with its thousands of impaled humans being kept alive and conscious indefinitely. [[spoiler:The fact that it's just a massive simulation and the victims are being kept under and alive via IV drip somehow makes it ''worse''.]]
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* {{Sesquipedalian Loquaciousness}}: Aenea's aforementioned lectures. The author draws heavily on the terminology of several sophisticated real-life philosophers to present simplistic hippie nonsense as deep philosophy.

to:

* {{Sesquipedalian Loquaciousness}}: Aenea's aforementioned lectures. The author draws heavily on the terminology of several sophisticated real-life philosophers philosophies and religions to present simplistic hippie nonsense as deep philosophy.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* {{Fauxlosophic Narration}}: "The Void which Binds", etc. Aenea's "philosophical" lectures basically amount to this.
* {{Sesquipedalian Loquaciousness}}: Aenea's aforementioned lectures. The author draws heavily on the terminology of several sophisticated real-life philosophers to present simplistic hippie nonsense as deep philosophy.

Removed: 611

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YMMV is for YMMV tropes- this is a review- write a review


I would argue that "Rise of Endymion" amounts to little more than an extremely long-winded {{Fauxlosophic Narration}} ("the Void which Binds", etc.). Since many other readers seem to find the book genuinely deep, however, I'll just post this here. Basically, the book is more or less equal parts never-ending descriptions of scenery, inconsequential action and supposedly deep philosophy relying on simplistic hippie nonsense hidden beneath a thick coat of {{Sesquipedalian Loquaciousness}} (which is remarkable, since the philosophy the author ''claimed'' to base Aenea's ideas on is reasonably sophisticated).
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None

Added DiffLines:

I would argue that "Rise of Endymion" amounts to little more than an extremely long-winded {{Fauxlosophic Narration}} ("the Void which Binds", etc.). Since many other readers seem to find the book genuinely deep, however, I'll just post this here. Basically, the book is more or less equal parts never-ending descriptions of scenery, inconsequential action and supposedly deep philosophy relying on simplistic hippie nonsense hidden beneath a thick coat of {{Sesquipedalian Loquaciousness}} (which is remarkable, since the philosophy the author ''claimed'' to base Aenea's ideas on is reasonably sophisticated).

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