History YMMV / HarryPotter

7th Dec '17 12:13:38 AM Silverblade2
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** The revelation in book five that James and Sirius were bullies toward Severus Snape is either a great plot twist, or something that made no sense and had no build up. Snape in Book 3 said James was an arrogant show-off but he never said that he was a bully. Some fans note that Severus was conveniently portrayed as a loner and a victim in this scene when previously it had been established that he did have a group of friends and was highly skilled at the dark arts for his age. What doesn't help is that James gets few redeeming flashback scenes after this which often ruins his character for fans. Much like the case with Sirius-Kreacher-Regulus, the twist works via melodramatic false equivalency (i.e. casting Snape as the victim and James as the Draco of his time) without placing emphasis on the political and moral alignments (James fought the Dark Arts, Snape became a Death Eaters), which also goes against the notion of "our choices define us".
* [[AnimationAgeGhetto Book Age Ghetto]]: A rare non-animated zig-zag. While overall an aversion, when the series was relatively new, it wasn't uncommon to find versions with more "Grown up" covers so that adults wouldn't feel ashamed that they are reading a book they found in the children's section.

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** The revelation in book five that James and Sirius were bullies toward Severus Snape is either a great plot twist, or something that made no sense and had no build up. Snape in Book 3 said James was an arrogant show-off but he never said that he was a bully. Some fans note that Severus was conveniently portrayed as a loner and a victim in this scene when previously it had been established that he did have a group of friends and was highly skilled at the dark arts for his age. What doesn't help is that James gets few redeeming flashback scenes after this which often ruins his character for fans. Much like the case with Sirius-Kreacher-Regulus, the twist works via melodramatic false equivalency (i.e. casting Snape as the victim and James as the Draco of his time) without placing emphasis on the political and moral alignments (James fought the Dark Arts, Snape became a Death Eaters), which also goes against the notion of "our choices define us".
* [[AnimationAgeGhetto Book Age Ghetto]]: AnimationAgeGhetto: A rare non-animated zig-zag. While overall an aversion, when the series was relatively new, it wasn't uncommon to find versions with more "Grown up" covers so that adults wouldn't feel ashamed that they are reading a book they found in the children's section.
1st Dec '17 12:51:54 PM JJHIL325
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29th Nov '17 5:19:42 PM JulianLapostat
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** On a related topic, the protagonists' [[ThouShaltNotKill absolute taboo against killing their opponents on purpose]] in the canon books is looked down upon by some fanfiction writers who think it is a naive, childish outlook on the world, and that the war couldn't realistically be wrong if the heroes didn't actually try to mow down the ranks of the enemy rather than simply defending themselves and capturing them whenever possible. However, others share Rowling's morals and think [[IfYouKillHimYouWillBeJustLikeHim becoming cold-blooded murderers, even in state of war, would mean the heroes were going evil themselves]].

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** On a related topic, the protagonists' [[ThouShaltNotKill absolute taboo against killing their opponents on purpose]] in the canon books is looked down upon by some fanfiction writers who think it is a naive, childish outlook on the world, and that the war couldn't realistically be wrong if the heroes didn't actually try to mow down the ranks of the enemy rather than simply defending themselves and capturing them whenever possible. However, others Others share Rowling's morals and think [[IfYouKillHimYouWillBeJustLikeHim becoming cold-blooded murderers, even in state of war, would mean the heroes were going evil themselves]].themselves]] but many feel that said message flies in the face of what TheRealHeroes undergo in the face of reality, and the entire message and intended concept is more or less inapplicable and unrelateable.



** Was Hermione's S.P.E.W. an ill-conceived, but conceptually right attempt at freeing long-abused slaves, which only goes wrong because the Elves, having been born slaves, tragically don't ''want'' the freedom they deserve? Or is it an instance of Hermione trying to force her own muggle values on a different world, and failing to understand that while they shouldn't be mistreated, it is House-Elves' nature to be obedient servants?

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** Was Hermione's S.P.E.W. an ill-conceived, but conceptually right attempt at freeing long-abused slaves, which only goes wrong because the Elves, having been born slaves, tragically don't ''want'' the freedom they deserve? Or is it an instance of Hermione trying to force her own muggle values on a different world, and failing to understand that while they shouldn't be mistreated, it is House-Elves' nature to be obedient servants?servants? A third faction sees it as a tin-eared FantasyConflictCounterpart that makes a mockery of SlaveLiberation in history and contemporary society, whose payoff in the books is unsatisfying, detrimental to the character arc of one of the most favored supporting characters (Sirius), and which works by violation of ShowDontTell and use of InformedWrongness and ValuesDissonance.
29th Nov '17 5:15:27 PM JulianLapostat
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** The revelation in book five that James and Sirius were bullies toward Severus Snape is either a great plot twist, or something that made no sense and had no build up. Some fans note that Severus was conveniently portrayed as a loner and a victim in this scene when previously it had been established that he did have a group of friends and was highly skilled at the dark arts for his age. What doesn't help is that James gets few redeeming flashback scenes after this which often ruins his character for fans.

to:

** The revelation in book five that James and Sirius were bullies toward Severus Snape is either a great plot twist, or something that made no sense and had no build up. Snape in Book 3 said James was an arrogant show-off but he never said that he was a bully. Some fans note that Severus was conveniently portrayed as a loner and a victim in this scene when previously it had been established that he did have a group of friends and was highly skilled at the dark arts for his age. What doesn't help is that James gets few redeeming flashback scenes after this which often ruins his character for fans. Much like the case with Sirius-Kreacher-Regulus, the twist works via melodramatic false equivalency (i.e. casting Snape as the victim and James as the Draco of his time) without placing emphasis on the political and moral alignments (James fought the Dark Arts, Snape became a Death Eaters), which also goes against the notion of "our choices define us".
29th Nov '17 3:58:59 PM ThorfinnRowle
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Added DiffLines:

** The revelation in book five that James and Sirius were bullies toward Severus Snape is either a great plot twist, or something that made no sense and had no build up. Some fans note that Severus was conveniently portrayed as a loner and a victim in this scene when previously it had been established that he did have a group of friends and was highly skilled at the dark arts for his age. What doesn't help is that James gets few redeeming flashback scenes after this which often ruins his character for fans.


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** Due to the large amount of timeline errors or canon ages of characters that just don't make sense, many fans have taken to ignore any numbers Rowling gives us. It's not uncommon to see fans ignoring the fact that James and Lily were only 21 when they died, or the ages on the Black Family Tree she wrote in 2006 (many of the years on this tree directly contradict canon anyway).
28th Nov '17 11:16:17 AM ClintEastwood
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* CantUnhearIt:
** Creator/AlanRickman's performance as Snape was so memorable even [[Literature/HarryPotter the novels']] author Creator/JKRowling couldn't unhear it eventually.
** Creator/EvannaLynch as Luna Lovegood.
** Creator/JimBroadbent as Horace Slughorn.
** Creator/MaggieSmith as [=McGonagall=] (another choice Rowling personally selected).
** Creator/RalphFiennes as Voldemort.
** Creator/RichardHarris or Creator/MichaelGambon as Dumbeldore.
** Creator/JohnCleese as Nearly-Headless Nick
** Hagrid was written for Creator/RobbieColtrane's voice. Millions have tried, and failed to get ''"Yer a wizard, Harry"'' out of their heads.
24th Nov '17 7:46:59 PM JulianLapostat
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** This article [[http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/18/opinion/harry-potter-market-wiz.html by a French economist]] notes that the underlying theme of Harry Potter is [[UsefulNotes/PoliticalIdeologies neoliberalism]] which creates a climate of competition and whose vocational, pragmatic, and careerist ethos is reflected in the fact that Hogwarts and the Wizarding World paint everything in terms of competition (Quidditch, House Cup, the battle of good and evil), Hogwarts curriculum has no equivalent of the arts, humanities, and the social sciences (History of Magic is deprecated as a subject by the narrative and the students, Muggle Studies, is ADegreeInUseless), the Ministry of Magic is openly caricatured, and most of the narrative concerns independent heroes who routinely violate laws and rules, which we sympathize with and condone because we are invited to identify with the anti-bureaucratic and anti-regulatory theme of the books.



* WhatDoYouMeanItsNotPolitical: This article [[http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/18/opinion/harry-potter-market-wiz.html by a French economist]] notes that the underlying theme of Harry Potter is [[UsefulNotes/PoliticalIdeologies neoliberalism]] which creates a climate of competition and whose vocational, pragmatic, and careerist ethos is reflected in the fact that Hogwarts and the Wizarding World paint everything in terms of competition (Quidditch, House Cup, the battle of good and evil), Hogwarts curriculum has no equivalent of the arts, humanities, and the social sciences (History of Magic is deprecated as a subject by the narrative and the students, Muggle Studies, is ADegreeInUseless), the Ministry of Magic is openly caricatured, and most of the narrative concerns independent heroes who routinely violate laws and rules, which we sympathize with and condone because we are invited to identify with the anti-bureaucratic and anti-regulatory theme of the books.
24th Nov '17 7:43:20 PM JulianLapostat
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Added DiffLines:

* WhatDoYouMeanItsNotPolitical: This article [[http://www.nytimes.com/2004/07/18/opinion/harry-potter-market-wiz.html by a French economist]] notes that the underlying theme of Harry Potter is [[UsefulNotes/PoliticalIdeologies neoliberalism]] which creates a climate of competition and whose vocational, pragmatic, and careerist ethos is reflected in the fact that Hogwarts and the Wizarding World paint everything in terms of competition (Quidditch, House Cup, the battle of good and evil), Hogwarts curriculum has no equivalent of the arts, humanities, and the social sciences (History of Magic is deprecated as a subject by the narrative and the students, Muggle Studies, is ADegreeInUseless), the Ministry of Magic is openly caricatured, and most of the narrative concerns independent heroes who routinely violate laws and rules, which we sympathize with and condone because we are invited to identify with the anti-bureaucratic and anti-regulatory theme of the books.
24th Nov '17 4:17:23 AM JulianLapostat
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* WhatMeasureIsANonBadass: Many people bash Molly for being a HouseWife, and [[spoiler: killing Bellatrix "Feminist Role Model" Lestrange.]] And there's the slutshaming and bitchiness that the fangirls apply to Ginny for "not being enough of a rolemodel" and "stealing Harry 'from the more deserving and stronger' Hermione" Because it's sooooo feminist to say Hermione's happiness won't mean anything if she doesn't have Harry as her prize cock!

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* WhatMeasureIsANonBadass: WhatMeasureIsANonBadass:
**
Many people bash Molly for being a HouseWife, and [[spoiler: killing Bellatrix "Feminist Role Model" Lestrange.]] And there's the slutshaming and bitchiness that the fangirls apply to Ginny for "not being enough of a rolemodel" and "stealing Harry 'from the more deserving and stronger' Hermione" Because it's sooooo feminist to say Hermione's happiness won't mean anything if she doesn't have Harry as her prize cock!cock!
** Ron Weasley gets this, thanks mainly to the movies. He's often called "the useless one" of TheTrio since he's more or less Harry without the wealth and PlotArmour, and Hermione without the smarts. The fact that Ron took a figurative bullet in Book 1 by winning the greatest chess game that Hogwarts had seen for many years (as per Dumbledore), and that he managed to scrape by despite having a second-hand wand for his first year, a broken one in the second year, and won two Quidditch Cups (Harry only has one) despite having a cheap broom and little moral support, somehow isn't badass for fans. Leaving aside the fact, that Harry loves Ron precisely because of ThePowerOfFriendship and that he himself doesn't judge people on how useful or useless they are.
14th Nov '17 9:13:53 AM JJHIL325
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** People have always condemned Dumbledore's decision to leave Harry with [[AbusiveParents the Dursleys]], even after the reveal of the protection magic Lily placed on Harry that only works with her blood relatives so he can be protected from the Death Eaters. But with the public now being more aware of the real-life detrimental consequences child abuse has, and teachers now being trained to spot warning signs of abuse and be proactive when, many newcomers have wondered how the heck Harry is still well-adjusted, why none of the other teachers (either at the primary school Harry went to or at Hogwarts) ever spoke up or reported to child services, or why Dumbledore didn't do anythng to personally step in and confront them.

to:

** People have always condemned Dumbledore's decision to leave Harry with [[AbusiveParents the Dursleys]], even after the reveal of the protection magic Lily placed on Harry that only works with her blood relatives so he can be protected from the Death Eaters. But with the public now being more aware of the real-life detrimental consequences child abuse has, and teachers now being trained to spot warning signs of abuse and be proactive when, when investigating it, many newcomers have wondered how the heck Harry is still well-adjusted, why none of the other teachers (either at the primary school Harry went to or at Hogwarts) ever spoke up or reported to child services, or why Dumbledore didn't do anythng to personally step in and confront them.
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