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Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question, or even an English Question[[note]]Actually, there is [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Lothian_Question sorth of an English Question]]...[[/note]]. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]].

to:

Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question, or even an English Question[[note]]Actually, there is [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Lothian_Question sorth of an English Question]]...[[/note]].Question]], as well as a [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_independence_referendum,_2014 Scottish question]][[/note]]. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]].
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Hottip cleanup; see thread for details.


The situation was soured by an undeniable streak of anti-Irish feeling in Britain [[hottip:*: Continuing sixteenth-century policies of identifying Catholicism with nasty evil foreigners, during the penal era anti-Catholicism was reflected in government policy, by Catholics forbidden to vote, hold public offices, or participate with civil society in many other ways. It has been argued that the excommunication of Elizabeth in 1570 provided the ideal opportunity for the Cecil administration to implement its abiding achievement: the propagation of the idea it was impossible to be a Catholic and a good Englishman. Against the historical backdrop of the Spanish Armada, Gunpowder Plot, Civil War, the flight of James II, the Jacobite risings of 1715 and 1745, and almost constant war with France, it is easy to see how anti-Catholic, anti-foreign (specifically, Spanish and of course French) feeling was easily sustained in the nation's consciousness. In that context, vehement anti-Catholicism was found in both the mainstream press and satirical journals. Rome was Babylon, and the Pope its Whore: he was the Scarlet Lady, the Antichrist, whose followers were enslaved in his service, and who would cheerfully murder all good Protestants in their beds, given the chance.]]. The Irish were despised (and often feared) for their Catholicism, poverty and perceived recourse to violence. The Irish were regularly mocked in British newspapers and magazines, portrayed as shambling grotesque ape-like thugs in political cartoons - see the picture on this page. Even the better-minded Britons tended to view the Irish as being unfit to govern themselves. This view changed over the course of the 19th century, as anti-Irish rancor faded and by the late 1880s had largely died down.

On the Irish side, hostility was worsened by a truly horrific [[IrishPotatoFamine famine in Ireland]] in the late 1840s, in which over a million people died and many more were forced to emigrate. Many Irish people believed and still do that it was caused by at best stupidity and at worst deliberate malice on the part of the British government, who preferred starvation in Ireland to the chaos in Britain that would result if Ireland stopped exporting food to industrial towns.[[hottip:*:It should be noted that the worst of the famine could have been avoided altogether if there had been even a basic system of crop rotation in Ireland, or the Irish themselves grew more than one variety of potato. Not a case of ScienceMarchesOn as both the importance of crop rotation and crop variety had been a staple of sound agricultural practice for centuries already. This point gets glossed over a lot but is important to know. The reason for this is because at the time of the great Potato famine most were tenant farmers who could not afford to feed their families any other way.]]. A policy often pointed to is the Corn Law forbidding Irish farmers from growing this crop and competing with English ones. They then turned to potatoes, which failed, and the famine struck.

to:

The situation was soured by an undeniable streak of anti-Irish feeling in Britain [[hottip:*: Continuing Britain[[note]]Continuing sixteenth-century policies of identifying Catholicism with nasty evil foreigners, during the penal era anti-Catholicism was reflected in government policy, by Catholics forbidden to vote, hold public offices, or participate with civil society in many other ways. It has been argued that the excommunication of Elizabeth in 1570 provided the ideal opportunity for the Cecil administration to implement its abiding achievement: the propagation of the idea it was impossible to be a Catholic and a good Englishman. Against the historical backdrop of the Spanish Armada, Gunpowder Plot, Civil War, the flight of James II, the Jacobite risings of 1715 and 1745, and almost constant war with France, it is easy to see how anti-Catholic, anti-foreign (specifically, Spanish and of course French) feeling was easily sustained in the nation's consciousness. In that context, vehement anti-Catholicism was found in both the mainstream press and satirical journals. Rome was Babylon, and the Pope its Whore: he was the Scarlet Lady, the Antichrist, whose followers were enslaved in his service, and who would cheerfully murder all good Protestants in their beds, given the chance.]].[[/note]]. The Irish were despised (and often feared) for their Catholicism, poverty and perceived recourse to violence. The Irish were regularly mocked in British newspapers and magazines, portrayed as shambling grotesque ape-like thugs in political cartoons - see the picture on this page. Even the better-minded Britons tended to view the Irish as being unfit to govern themselves. This view changed over the course of the 19th century, as anti-Irish rancor faded and by the late 1880s had largely died down.

On the Irish side, hostility was worsened by a truly horrific [[IrishPotatoFamine famine in Ireland]] in the late 1840s, in which over a million people died and many more were forced to emigrate. Many Irish people believed and still do that it was caused by at best stupidity and at worst deliberate malice on the part of the British government, who preferred starvation in Ireland to the chaos in Britain that would result if Ireland stopped exporting food to industrial towns.[[hottip:*:It [[note]]It should be noted that the worst of the famine could have been avoided altogether if there had been even a basic system of crop rotation in Ireland, or the Irish themselves grew more than one variety of potato. Not a case of ScienceMarchesOn as both the importance of crop rotation and crop variety had been a staple of sound agricultural practice for centuries already. This point gets glossed over a lot but is important to know. The reason for this is because at the time of the great Potato famine most were tenant farmers who could not afford to feed their families any other way.]].[[/note]]. A policy often pointed to is the Corn Law forbidding Irish farmers from growing this crop and competing with English ones. They then turned to potatoes, which failed, and the famine struck.



The conventional, conciliatory view is that British people should [[InnocentlyInsensitive bear in mind the people who were imprisoned or died as a result of repression and neglect/mismanagement by British governments]]. Likewise it is held that Irish people would be much happier, and find dealing with British people much easier, if they could be more forgiving and less bitter/vindictive about what happened to long-dead people they merely share an island with - an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame (all) Irish problems on Britain[[hottip:*: regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and regardless of the obviousness of said actual cause/fault]]. In certain places there are people still holding grievances (and 'grievances'[[hottip:*: sometimes regarding ''individual people'']] dating back ''centuries'').

British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy[[hottip:*: though the latter culture would be an ''excellent'' basis for justifying a 'national' culture of 'Revanchism' in preparation for [[WarOf1812 a War of Irish Liberation/Second Irish Revolution (to seize British/Northern Ireland)]] - or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.

to:

The conventional, conciliatory view is that British people should [[InnocentlyInsensitive bear in mind the people who were imprisoned or died as a result of repression and neglect/mismanagement by British governments]]. Likewise it is held that Irish people would be much happier, and find dealing with British people much easier, if they could be more forgiving and less bitter/vindictive about what happened to long-dead people they merely share an island with - an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame (all) Irish problems on Britain[[hottip:*: regardless Britain[[note]]regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and regardless of the obviousness of said actual cause/fault]]. cause/fault[[/note]]. In certain places there are people still holding grievances (and 'grievances'[[hottip:*: sometimes 'grievances'[[note]]sometimes regarding ''individual people'']] people''[[/note]] dating back ''centuries'').

British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy[[hottip:*: though healthy[[note]]though the latter culture would be an ''excellent'' basis for justifying a 'national' culture of 'Revanchism' in preparation for [[WarOf1812 a War of Irish Liberation/Second Irish Revolution (to seize British/Northern Ireland)]] Ireland)]][[/note]] - or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.
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Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question, or even an English Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]].

to:

Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question, or even an English Question.Question[[note]]Actually, there is [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Lothian_Question sorth of an English Question]]...[[/note]]. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]].
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Depending on how you consider it The Irish Question might cover the whole of Irish-British relations from well before the incomplete Norman Conquest during the TheMiddleAges to the present day. Usually, however, it refers to the period between 1801 and 1922 when Ireland was formally a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Wales had long-since been conquered and pacified by the English when the country was formally integrated into England and and its ruling elite into English society in 1536. England and Scotland later, by mutual agreement, formed the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707 - to the consternation of the Highland Scots Clans who benefited little from the economic boom which followed, such that they staged two failed rebellions to destroy the new country in an attempt to preserve their power. The United Kingdom had had the Kingdom of Ireland well and truly under its own thumb for nearly a century by the time the Irish Parliament voted to join the union and its members went to sit at the National Parliament in Westminster, like everyone else.

to:

Depending on how you consider it The Irish Question might cover the whole of Irish-British relations from well before the incomplete Norman Conquest during the TheMiddleAges to the present day. Usually, however, it refers to the period between 1801 and 1922 when Ireland was formally a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Wales had long-since been conquered and pacified by the English when the country was formally integrated into England and and its ruling elite into English society in 1536. England and Scotland later, by mutual agreement, formed the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707 - to the consternation of the Highland Scots Clans who benefited little from the economic boom which followed, such that they staged two failed rebellions to destroy the new country in an attempt to and preserve their own power. The United Kingdom had had the Kingdom of Ireland well and truly under its own thumb for nearly a century by the time the Irish Parliament voted to join the union and its members went to sit at the National Parliament in Westminster, like everyone else.
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Depending on how you consider it The Irish Question might cover the whole of Irish-British relations from well before the incomplete Norman Conquest during the TheMiddleAges to the present day. Usually, however, it refers to the period between 1801 and 1922 when Ireland was formally a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Wales had long-since been conquered and pacified by the English when the country was formally integrated into England and and its ruling elite into English society in 1536. England and Scotland later, by mutual agreement, formed the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707 - to the consternation of the Highland Scots who benefited little from the economic boom which followed, and would launch to failed rebellions. The United Kingdom had had the Kingdom of Ireland well and truly under its own thumb for nearly a century by the time the Irish Parliament voted to join the union and its members went to sit at the National Parliament in Westminster, like everyone else.

to:

Depending on how you consider it The Irish Question might cover the whole of Irish-British relations from well before the incomplete Norman Conquest during the TheMiddleAges to the present day. Usually, however, it refers to the period between 1801 and 1922 when Ireland was formally a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Wales had long-since been conquered and pacified by the English when the country was formally integrated into England and and its ruling elite into English society in 1536. England and Scotland later, by mutual agreement, formed the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707 - to the consternation of the Highland Scots Clans who benefited little from the economic boom which followed, and would launch to such that they staged two failed rebellions.rebellions to destroy the new country in an attempt to preserve their power. The United Kingdom had had the Kingdom of Ireland well and truly under its own thumb for nearly a century by the time the Irish Parliament voted to join the union and its members went to sit at the National Parliament in Westminster, like everyone else.
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There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, a couple of hundred radicals staged an armed uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin, and were almost all killed by the army. The public took a dim view of the government's heavy-handed treatment of the rebels, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, considering it something of a betrayal, especially as many Irishmen were then serving with the British Army in France. However, there was general shock and outspoken disapproval at the brutal (by British standards) treatment of the dozens of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression to cut down on further would-be-martyrs.

The continued 'revival' of neo-Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness, increased popular support for revolutionary nationalist groups. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when - with the country's manpower reserves exhausted - the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was contemplated by the Cabinet. This was staunchly opposed by many within Ireland, and [[EnemyMine both the Unionist and Nationalist parties condemned the proposal]]. Soon afterwards the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Assassinations of officials and acts of violence against and murders of 'pro-English' citizens increased exponentially, and resulted in increasingly heavy-handed government repression with many dozens of terrorists being beaten, arrested, killed extrajudicially, sentenced to prison and hanged. The decision to recruit WWI veterans to serve as armed policemen (the 'Black and Tans') in particular proved to be a bad move, as the screening process was minimal - many of those who signed up were more often than not suffering from shell-shock or [[LovesTheSoundOfScreaming ''enjoyed'' killing people too much to give up on war.]]

Hundreds died in the cycle of terrorism and (increasingly lethal) repression that followed until the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]] was concluded with the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921. The Irish Free State was made independent, while Northern Ireland remained British. Following this some Free Irish republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there followed a brief and bitter civil war [[{{Irony}} that killed more than The War For Independence]]. The civil war still affects[[UsefulNotes/IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major modern parties, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and Pro-Treaty Sinn Fein factions, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.

to:

There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, a couple of hundred radicals staged an armed uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin, and were almost all killed by the army. The public took a dim view of the government's heavy-handed treatment of the rebels, rising intially, with reactions ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, considering it something of a betrayal, especially as many Irishmen were then serving with the British Army in France. However, there was public opinion then changed to general shock and outspoken disapproval at the brutal (by British standards) treatment of the dozens of captured rebels rebels, the somewhat summary execution of many of the surviving leaders, and a Draconian policy of repression to cut down on further would-be-martyrs.

The continued 'revival' of neo-Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness, increased popular support for revolutionary nationalist groups. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when - with the country's manpower reserves exhausted - the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was contemplated by the Cabinet. This was staunchly opposed by many within Ireland, and [[EnemyMine both the Unionist and Nationalist parties condemned the proposal]]. Soon afterwards the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Assassinations of officials and acts of violence against and murders of 'pro-English' citizens increased exponentially, and resulted in increasingly heavy-handed government repression with many dozens of terrorists being beaten, arrested, killed extrajudicially, sentenced to prison and hanged. The decision to recruit WWI veterans to serve as armed policemen (the 'Black and Tans') Tans' and 'Auxies') in particular proved to be a bad move, as the screening process was minimal - many of those who signed up were more often than not either suffering from shell-shock shell-shock, or [[LovesTheSoundOfScreaming ''enjoyed'' killing people [[SociopathicSoldier had enjoyed the war a bit too much much]] and were [[BloodKnight looking for an excuse to give up on war.]]

cause some more violence]].

Hundreds died in the cycle of terrorism and (increasingly lethal) repression that followed until the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]] was concluded with the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921. The Irish Free State was made independent, while Northern Ireland remained British. Following this some Free Irish republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there followed a brief and bitter civil war [[{{Irony}} that killed more than The War For Independence]]. The civil war still affects[[UsefulNotes/IrishPoliticalSystem affects [[UsefulNotes/IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major modern parties, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and Pro-Treaty Sinn Fein factions, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


Depending on how you consider it The Irish Question might cover the whole of Irish-British relations from ([well] before) the incomplete Norman Conquest during the TheMiddleAges to the present day. Usually, however, it refers to the period between 1801 and 1922 when Ireland was formally a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Wales had long-since been conquered and pacified by the English when the country was formally integrated into England and and its ruling elite into English society in 1536. England and Scotland later, by mutual agreement, formed the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707 - to the consternation of the Highland-Scots who benefitted little from the economic boom which followed. The United Kingdom had had the Kingdom of Ireland well and truly under its own thumb for nearly a century by the time the Irish Parliament voted to join the union and its members went to sit at the National Parliament at Westminster, like everyone else.

to:

Depending on how you consider it The Irish Question might cover the whole of Irish-British relations from ([well] before) well before the incomplete Norman Conquest during the TheMiddleAges to the present day. Usually, however, it refers to the period between 1801 and 1922 when Ireland was formally a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Wales had long-since been conquered and pacified by the English when the country was formally integrated into England and and its ruling elite into English society in 1536. England and Scotland later, by mutual agreement, formed the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707 - to the consternation of the Highland-Scots Highland Scots who benefitted benefited little from the economic boom which followed. followed, and would launch to failed rebellions. The United Kingdom had had the Kingdom of Ireland well and truly under its own thumb for nearly a century by the time the Irish Parliament voted to join the union and its members went to sit at the National Parliament at in Westminster, like everyone else.



As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. That their sympathies would be such was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose; that they happened to live in Ulster was more a question of its proximity to Scotland. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts,[[note]]For instance, JonathanSwift, an Anglican born in Dublin but thoroughly English by ancestry, defended Ireland as early as the 1690s[[/note]] whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.

to:

As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. That their sympathies would be such was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose; that they happened to live in Ulster was more a question of its proximity to Scotland.Scotland[[note]]Ironically, the people who became the Scots migrated there from the Ulster area of Ireland to begin with-centuries later some of them went back[[/note]]. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts,[[note]]For instance, instance JonathanSwift, an Anglican born in Dublin but thoroughly English by ancestry, defended Ireland as early as the 1690s[[/note]] whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.



The situation was soured by an undeniable streak of anti-Irish feeling in Britain [[hottip:*: Continuing sixteenth-century policies of identifying Catholicism with nasty evil foreigners, during the penal era anti-Catholicism was reflected in government policy, by Catholics forbidden to vote, hold public offices, or participate in civil society many other ways. It has been argued that the excommunication of Elizabeth in 1570 provided the ideal opportunity for the Cecil administration to implement its abiding achievement: the propagation of the idea it was impossible to be a Catholic and a good Englishman. Against the historical backdrop of Armada, Gunpowder Plot, Civil War, the flight of James II, Jacobite risings of 1715 and 1745, and almost constant war with France, it is easy to see how anti-Catholic, anti-foreign (specifically, Spanish and of course French) feeling was easily sustained in the nation's consciousness. In that context, vehement anti-Catholicism was found in both the mainstream press and satirical journals. Rome was Babylon, and the Pope its Whore: he was the Scarlet Lady, the Antichrist, whose followers were enslaved in his service, and who would cheerfully murder all good Protestants in their beds, given the chance.]]. The Irish were despised (and often feared) for their Catholicism, poverty and perceived recourse to violence. The Irish were regularly mocked in British newspapers and magazines, portrayed as shambling grotesque ape-like thugs in political cartoons - see the picture on this page. Even the better-minded Britons tended to view the Irish as being unfit to govern themselves. This view changed over the course of the 19th century, as anti-Irish rancour faded and by the late 1880s had largely died down.

to:

The situation was soured by an undeniable streak of anti-Irish feeling in Britain [[hottip:*: Continuing sixteenth-century policies of identifying Catholicism with nasty evil foreigners, during the penal era anti-Catholicism was reflected in government policy, by Catholics forbidden to vote, hold public offices, or participate in with civil society in many other ways. It has been argued that the excommunication of Elizabeth in 1570 provided the ideal opportunity for the Cecil administration to implement its abiding achievement: the propagation of the idea it was impossible to be a Catholic and a good Englishman. Against the historical backdrop of the Spanish Armada, Gunpowder Plot, Civil War, the flight of James II, the Jacobite risings of 1715 and 1745, and almost constant war with France, it is easy to see how anti-Catholic, anti-foreign (specifically, Spanish and of course French) feeling was easily sustained in the nation's consciousness. In that context, vehement anti-Catholicism was found in both the mainstream press and satirical journals. Rome was Babylon, and the Pope its Whore: he was the Scarlet Lady, the Antichrist, whose followers were enslaved in his service, and who would cheerfully murder all good Protestants in their beds, given the chance.]]. The Irish were despised (and often feared) for their Catholicism, poverty and perceived recourse to violence. The Irish were regularly mocked in British newspapers and magazines, portrayed as shambling grotesque ape-like thugs in political cartoons - see the picture on this page. Even the better-minded Britons tended to view the Irish as being unfit to govern themselves. This view changed over the course of the 19th century, as anti-Irish rancour rancor faded and by the late 1880s had largely died down.



There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, a couple of hundred radicals staged an armed uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin, and were almost all killed by the army. The public took a dim view of the government's heavy-handed treatment of the rebels, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, considering it something of a betrayal. However, there was general shock and outspoken disapproval at the brutal (by British standards) treatment of the dozens of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression to cut down on further would-be-martyrs.

The continued 'revival' of neo-Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness, increased popular support for revolutionary nationalist groups. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when - with the country's manpower reserves exhausted - the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was contemplated by the Cabinet. This was staunchly opposed by many within Ireland, and [[EnemyMine both the Unionist and Nationalist parties condemned the proposal]]. Soon afterwards the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Assassinations of officials and acts of violence against and murders of 'pro-English' citizens increased exponentially, and resulted in increasingly heavy-handed government repression with many dozens of terrorists being beaten, arrested, and sentenced to gaol. The decision to recruit WWI veterans to serve as armed policemen (the 'Black and Tans') in particular proved to be a bad move, as the screening process was minimal - many of those who signed up were more often than not suffering from shell-shock or [[LovesTheSoundOfScreaming ''enjoyed'' killing people too much to give up on war.]]

Hundreds died in the cycle of terrorism and (increasingly lethal) repression that followed until the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]] was concluded with the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921. The Irish Free State was made independent, while Northern Ireland remained British. Following this some Free Irish republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there followed a brief and bitter civil war [[{{Irony}} that killed more than The War For Independence]]. The war still [[UsefulNotes/IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major parties of contemporary Irish politics, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and Pro-Treaty Sinn Fein factions, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.

to:

There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, a couple of hundred radicals staged an armed uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin, and were almost all killed by the army. The public took a dim view of the government's heavy-handed treatment of the rebels, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, considering it something of a betrayal.betrayal, especially as many Irishmen were then serving with the British Army in France. However, there was general shock and outspoken disapproval at the brutal (by British standards) treatment of the dozens of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression to cut down on further would-be-martyrs.

The continued 'revival' of neo-Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness, increased popular support for revolutionary nationalist groups. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when - with the country's manpower reserves exhausted - the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was contemplated by the Cabinet. This was staunchly opposed by many within Ireland, and [[EnemyMine both the Unionist and Nationalist parties condemned the proposal]]. Soon afterwards the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Assassinations of officials and acts of violence against and murders of 'pro-English' citizens increased exponentially, and resulted in increasingly heavy-handed government repression with many dozens of terrorists being beaten, arrested, and killed extrajudicially, sentenced to gaol.prison and hanged. The decision to recruit WWI veterans to serve as armed policemen (the 'Black and Tans') in particular proved to be a bad move, as the screening process was minimal - many of those who signed up were more often than not suffering from shell-shock or [[LovesTheSoundOfScreaming ''enjoyed'' killing people too much to give up on war.]]

Hundreds died in the cycle of terrorism and (increasingly lethal) repression that followed until the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]] was concluded with the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921. The Irish Free State was made independent, while Northern Ireland remained British. Following this some Free Irish republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there followed a brief and bitter civil war [[{{Irony}} that killed more than The War For Independence]]. The civil war still [[UsefulNotes/IrishPoliticalSystem affects[[UsefulNotes/IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major parties of contemporary Irish politics, modern parties, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and Pro-Treaty Sinn Fein factions, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.



The conventional, conciliatory view is that British people should [[InnocentlyInsensitive bear in mind the people who were imprisoned or died as a result of repression and neglect/mismanagement by British governments]] - Likewise it is held that Irish people would be much happier, and find dealing with British people much easier, if they could be be more forgiving and less bitter/vindictive about what happened to long-dead people they merely share an island with - an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame (all) Irish problems on Britain[[hottip:*: regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and regardless of the obviousness of said actual cause/fault]]. In certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'][[hottip:*: sometimes regarding ''individual people'']] dating back ''centuries'').

to:

The conventional, conciliatory view is that British people should [[InnocentlyInsensitive bear in mind the people who were imprisoned or died as a result of repression and neglect/mismanagement by British governments]] - governments]]. Likewise it is held that Irish people would be much happier, and find dealing with British people much easier, if they could be be more forgiving and less bitter/vindictive about what happened to long-dead people they merely share an island with - an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame (all) Irish problems on Britain[[hottip:*: regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and regardless of the obviousness of said actual cause/fault]]. In certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'][[hottip:*: (and 'grievances'[[hottip:*: sometimes regarding ''individual people'']] dating back ''centuries'').
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Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]].

to:

Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question, or even an English Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]].

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-->-- '''1066 And All That'''

->''"[[BlackComedy Roasted, baked, or fried?]]"''
-->-- '''[[Literature/AModestProposal Jonathan Swift]]'''

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-->-- '''1066 ''[[Literature/TenSixtySixAndAllThat 1066 And All That'''

->''"[[BlackComedy Roasted, baked, or fried?]]"''
-->-- '''[[Literature/AModestProposal Jonathan Swift]]'''
That]]''
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Removed some subjective opinion


The conventional, conciliatory view is that British people should [[InnocentlyInsensitive bear in mind the people who were imprisoned or died as a result of repression and neglect/mismanagement by British governments]] - an amazing number of Britons seem to think that The UK had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are 'just like that' because their governments encourage anti-British sentiment in its schools to strengthen Irish Nationalism. Likewise it is held that Irish people would be much happier, and find dealing with British people much easier, if they could be be more forgiving and less bitter/vindictive about what happened to long-dead people they merely share an island with - an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame (all) Irish problems on Britain[[hottip:*: regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and regardless of the obviousness of said actual cause/fault]]. In certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'][[hottip:*: sometimes regarding ''individual people'']] dating back ''centuries'').

to:

The conventional, conciliatory view is that British people should [[InnocentlyInsensitive bear in mind the people who were imprisoned or died as a result of repression and neglect/mismanagement by British governments]] - an amazing number of Britons seem to think that The UK had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are 'just like that' because their governments encourage anti-British sentiment in its schools to strengthen Irish Nationalism. - Likewise it is held that Irish people would be much happier, and find dealing with British people much easier, if they could be be more forgiving and less bitter/vindictive about what happened to long-dead people they merely share an island with - an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame (all) Irish problems on Britain[[hottip:*: regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and regardless of the obviousness of said actual cause/fault]]. In certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'][[hottip:*: sometimes regarding ''individual people'']] dating back ''centuries'').
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Hundreds died in the cycle of terrorism and (increasingly lethal) repression that followed until the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]] was concluded with the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921. The Irish Free State was made independent, while Northern Ireland remained British. Following this some Free Irish republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there followed a brief and bitter civil war [[{{Irony}} that killed more than The War For Independence]]. The war still [[IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major parties of contemporary Irish politics, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and Pro-Treaty Sinn Fein factions, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.

to:

Hundreds died in the cycle of terrorism and (increasingly lethal) repression that followed until the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]] was concluded with the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921. The Irish Free State was made independent, while Northern Ireland remained British. Following this some Free Irish republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there followed a brief and bitter civil war [[{{Irony}} that killed more than The War For Independence]]. The war still [[IrishPoliticalSystem [[UsefulNotes/IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major parties of contemporary Irish politics, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and Pro-Treaty Sinn Fein factions, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.
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[[quoteright:250:http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Really_Resized_9038.jpg]]

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[[quoteright:250:http://static.[[quoteright:250:[[Magazine/{{Punch}} http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Really_Resized_9038.jpg]]jpg]]]]
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A significant symbolic step towards reconciliation was made in 2011, with Queen Elizabeth II making a state visit to Ireland -- the first visit from a British monarch since King George V's visit in 1911, and the first ever since Ireland gained independence. Although subject to criticism and protest from numerous quarters, the visit was widely regarded as a success and the Queen widely praised, particularly for a speech delivered at a state dinner in which she both acknowledged the regrettable past between the two nations while asserting the significant developments that had been made since then.
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British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy[[hottip:*: though the latter culture would be an ''excellent'' basis for justifying a 'national' culture of 'Revanchism' in preparation for a War of Irish Liberation/Second Irish Revolution (to seize British/Northern Ireland)]] - or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.

to:

British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy[[hottip:*: though the latter culture would be an ''excellent'' basis for justifying a 'national' culture of 'Revanchism' in preparation for [[WarOf1812 a War of Irish Liberation/Second Irish Revolution (to seize British/Northern Ireland)]] - or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.
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British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy[[hottip:*: though the latter culture would be an ''excellent'' basis for justifying a 'national' culture of 'Revanchism' in preparation for an anti-British war]] - or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.

to:

British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy[[hottip:*: though the latter culture would be an ''excellent'' basis for justifying a 'national' culture of 'Revanchism' in preparation for an anti-British war]] a War of Irish Liberation/Second Irish Revolution (to seize British/Northern Ireland)]] - or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.
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The conventional, conciliatory view is that the British should [[InnocentlyInsensitive bear in mind the people who were imprisoned or died as a result of repression and neglect/mismanagement by British governments]] - an amazing number of Britons seem to think Britain had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are 'just like that'[[hottip:*: i.e. bitter and hostile]] because their government encourages anti-British sentiment in its schools to strengthen and promote Irish Nationalism. Likewise it is held that the Irish would be much happier, and more fun to be around, if they could be be more forgiving and less bitter/vindictive about what happened to people they have virtually nothing to do with - an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame [all] Irish problems on Britain[[hottip:*: regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and regardless of the obviousness of said actual cause/fault]]. In certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'][[hottip:*: sometimes regarding ''individual people'']] dating back ''centuries'').

British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy - or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.

to:

The conventional, conciliatory view is that the British people should [[InnocentlyInsensitive bear in mind the people who were imprisoned or died as a result of repression and neglect/mismanagement by British governments]] - an amazing number of Britons seem to think Britain that The UK had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are 'just like that'[[hottip:*: i.e. bitter and hostile]] that' because their government encourages governments encourage anti-British sentiment in its schools to strengthen and promote Irish Nationalism. Likewise it is held that the Irish people would be much happier, and more fun to be around, find dealing with British people much easier, if they could be be more forgiving and less bitter/vindictive about what happened to long-dead people they have virtually nothing to do merely share an island with - an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame [all] (all) Irish problems on Britain[[hottip:*: regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and regardless of the obviousness of said actual cause/fault]]. In certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'][[hottip:*: sometimes regarding ''individual people'']] dating back ''centuries'').

British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy healthy[[hottip:*: though the latter culture would be an ''excellent'' basis for justifying a 'national' culture of 'Revanchism' in preparation for an anti-British war]] - or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.

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Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]]. As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. That their sympathies would be such was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose; that they happened to live in Ulster was more a question of its proximity to Scotland. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts,[[note]]For instance, JonathanSwift, an Anglican born in Dublin but thoroughly English by ancestry, defended Ireland as early as the 1690s[[/note]] whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.

to:

Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]].

As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. That their sympathies would be such was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose; that they happened to live in Ulster was more a question of its proximity to Scotland. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts,[[note]]For instance, JonathanSwift, an Anglican born in Dublin but thoroughly English by ancestry, defended Ireland as early as the 1690s[[/note]] whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.



There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, there was a minor Irish uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin which was crushed by the British. Initially this received a negative response from the Irish populace, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, especially as it was viewed as a betrayal of Irish soldiers fighting in the war. However, horror at the brutal treatment of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression by the British, the revival of Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness increased the feeling of revolutionary nationalism and support for independence. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was considered by the British government, resulting in national uproar and staunch opposition from [[EnemyMine both Unionists and Nationalists]]. After this the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) fell and was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Bitterness increased on both sides, leading to the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]], the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921 and finally the Irish Free State leaving the UK, while the (mostly Protestant) Northern Ireland remained. (Some republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there was a brief and bitter civil war which still informs [[IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major parties of contemporary Irish politics, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and Pro-Treaty Sinn Fein, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.

to:

There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, there was a minor Irish couple of hundred radicals staged an armed uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin which was crushed Dublin, and were almost all killed by the British. Initially this received army. The public took a negative response from dim view of the Irish populace, government's heavy-handed treatment of the rebels, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, especially as considering it was viewed as a betrayal something of Irish soldiers fighting in the war. a betrayal. However, horror there was general shock and outspoken disapproval at the brutal (by British standards) treatment of the dozens of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression by the British, the revival to cut down on further would-be-martyrs.

The continued 'revival'
of Gaelic neo-Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness war-wariness, increased the feeling of popular support for revolutionary nationalism and support for independence. nationalist groups. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when - with the country's manpower reserves exhausted - the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was considered contemplated by the British government, resulting in national uproar Cabinet. This was staunchly opposed by many within Ireland, and staunch opposition from [[EnemyMine both Unionists the Unionist and Nationalists]]. After this Nationalist parties condemned the proposal]]. Soon afterwards the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) fell and was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Bitterness Assassinations of officials and acts of violence against and murders of 'pro-English' citizens increased exponentially, and resulted in increasingly heavy-handed government repression with many dozens of terrorists being beaten, arrested, and sentenced to gaol. The decision to recruit WWI veterans to serve as armed policemen (the 'Black and Tans') in particular proved to be a bad move, as the screening process was minimal - many of those who signed up were more often than not suffering from shell-shock or [[LovesTheSoundOfScreaming ''enjoyed'' killing people too much to give up on both sides, leading to war.]]

Hundreds died in the cycle of terrorism and (increasingly lethal) repression that followed until
the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]], Independence]] was concluded with the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921 and finally the 1921. The Irish Free State leaving the UK, was made independent, while the (mostly Protestant) Northern Ireland remained. (Some remained British. Following this some Free Irish republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there was followed a brief and bitter civil war which [[{{Irony}} that killed more than The War For Independence]]. The war still informs [[IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major parties of contemporary Irish politics, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and Pro-Treaty Sinn Fein, Fein factions, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.



The conventional moderate view is that the British should [[InnocentlyInsensitive try and remember the unfortunately too-often less-than-positive or benevolent history of British involvement in Ireland more]] (an amazing number of Britons seem to think Britain had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are just 'like that'), and the Irish should try and be more forgiving and less spiteful (an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame Irish problems on the British regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and in certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'] dating back ''centuries''). British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy. Or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.

to:

The conventional moderate conventional, conciliatory view is that the British should [[InnocentlyInsensitive try bear in mind the people who were imprisoned or died as a result of repression and remember the unfortunately too-often less-than-positive or benevolent history of neglect/mismanagement by British involvement in Ireland more]] (an governments]] - an amazing number of Britons seem to think Britain had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are just 'like that'), 'just like that'[[hottip:*: i.e. bitter and hostile]] because their government encourages anti-British sentiment in its schools to strengthen and promote Irish Nationalism. Likewise it is held that the Irish should try would be much happier, and more fun to be around, if they could be be more forgiving and less spiteful (an bitter/vindictive about what happened to people they have virtually nothing to do with - an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame [all] Irish problems on the British Britain[[hottip:*: regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and in regardless of the obviousness of said actual cause/fault]]. In certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'] 'grievances'][[hottip:*: sometimes regarding ''individual people'']] dating back ''centuries''). ''centuries'').

British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy. Or, healthy - or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.
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There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, there was a minor Irish uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin which was crushed by the British. Initially this received a negative response from the Irish populace, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, especially as it was viewed as a betrayal of Irish soldiers fighting in the war. However, horror at the brutal treatment of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression by the British, the revival of Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness increased the feeling of revolutionary nationalism and support for independence. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was considered by the British government, resulting in national uproar and staunch opposition from [[EnemyMine both Unionists and Nationalists]]. After this the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) fell and was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Bitterness increased on both sides, leading to the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]], the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921 and finally the Irish Free State leaving the UK, while the (mostly Protestant) Northern Ireland remained. (Some republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there was a brief and bitter civil war which still informs [[IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major parties of contemporary Irish politics, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and pro-Treaty Sinn Fein, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.

to:

There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, there was a minor Irish uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin which was crushed by the British. Initially this received a negative response from the Irish populace, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, especially as it was viewed as a betrayal of Irish soldiers fighting in the war. However, horror at the brutal treatment of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression by the British, the revival of Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness increased the feeling of revolutionary nationalism and support for independence. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was considered by the British government, resulting in national uproar and staunch opposition from [[EnemyMine both Unionists and Nationalists]]. After this the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) fell and was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Bitterness increased on both sides, leading to the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence]], the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921 and finally the Irish Free State leaving the UK, while the (mostly Protestant) Northern Ireland remained. (Some republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there was a brief and bitter civil war which still informs [[IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day]]--the two major parties of contemporary Irish politics, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and pro-Treaty Pro-Treaty Sinn Fein, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.
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There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, there was a minor Irish uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin which was crushed by the British. Initially this received a negative response from the Irish populace, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, especially as it was viewed as a betrayal of Irish soldiers fighting in the war. However, horror at the brutal treatment of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression by the British, the revival of Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness increased the feeling of revolutionary nationalism and support for independence. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was considered by the British government, resulting in national uproar and staunch opposition from [[EnemyMine both Unionists and Nationalists]]. After this the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) fell and was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Bitterness increased on both sides, leading to the Irish War of Independence, the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921 and finally the Irish Free State leaving the UK, while the (mostly Protestant) Northern Ireland remained. (Some republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there was a brief and bitter civil war which still informs Irish politics to this day. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.

to:

There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, there was a minor Irish uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin which was crushed by the British. Initially this received a negative response from the Irish populace, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, especially as it was viewed as a betrayal of Irish soldiers fighting in the war. However, horror at the brutal treatment of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression by the British, the revival of Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness increased the feeling of revolutionary nationalism and support for independence. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was considered by the British government, resulting in national uproar and staunch opposition from [[EnemyMine both Unionists and Nationalists]]. After this the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) fell and was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Bitterness increased on both sides, leading to the [[TheIrishRevolution Irish War of Independence, Independence]], the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921 and finally the Irish Free State leaving the UK, while the (mostly Protestant) Northern Ireland remained. (Some republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there was a brief and bitter civil war which still informs [[IrishPoliticalSystem Irish politics to this day.day]]--the two major parties of contemporary Irish politics, Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael, are descendants of the Anti- and pro-Treaty Sinn Fein, respectively. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.
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->''"Gladstone spent his declining years trying to guess the answer to the Irish Question; unfortunately, whenever he was getting warm, the Irish secretly changed the Question..."''

to:

->''"Gladstone spent his declining years trying to guess the answer to the Irish Question; unfortunately, whenever he was getting warm, [[MovingTheGoalposts the Irish secretly changed the Question...Question]]..."''
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The conventional moderate view is that the British should [[InnocentlyInsensitive try and remember history more]] (an amazing number of Britons seem to think Britain had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are just 'like that'), and the Irish should try and be more forgiving and less spiteful (an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame Irish problems on the British regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and in certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'] dating back ''centuries''). British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy. Or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.

to:

The conventional moderate view is that the British should [[InnocentlyInsensitive try and remember the unfortunately too-often less-than-positive or benevolent history of British involvement in Ireland more]] (an amazing number of Britons seem to think Britain had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are just 'like that'), and the Irish should try and be more forgiving and less spiteful (an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame Irish problems on the British regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and in certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'] dating back ''centuries''). British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy. Or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.
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The conventional moderate view is that the British should try and remember history more (an amazing number of Britons seem to think Britain had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are just 'like that'), and the Irish should try and forget more (an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame Irish problems on the British regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and in certain places there are people still holding grievances dating back ''centuries'').

to:

The conventional moderate view is that the British should [[InnocentlyInsensitive try and remember history more more]] (an amazing number of Britons seem to think Britain had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are just 'like that'), and the Irish should try and forget be more forgiving and less spiteful (an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame Irish problems on the British regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and in certain places there are people still holding grievances [and 'grievances'] dating back ''centuries'').
''centuries''). British-Irish relations are, after all, important to both countries - and neither a culture of historical ignorance nor one of victimisation and grudge-holding is healthy. Or, incidentally, a recipe for future harmony between two very close geographical, economic, and cultural neighbours.
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Rename.


->''"[[DeadBabyComedy Roasted, baked, or fried?]]"''

to:

->''"[[DeadBabyComedy ->''"[[BlackComedy Roasted, baked, or fried?]]"''
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Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]]. As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. That their sympathies would be such was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose; that they happened to live in Ulster was more a question of its proximity to Scotland. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts,[[note]]For instance, JonathanSwift, born in Dublin but thoroughly English by ancestry, defended Ireland as early as the 1690s[[/note]] whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.

to:

Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]]. As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. That their sympathies would be such was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose; that they happened to live in Ulster was more a question of its proximity to Scotland. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts,[[note]]For instance, JonathanSwift, an Anglican born in Dublin but thoroughly English by ancestry, defended Ireland as early as the 1690s[[/note]] whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]]. As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. That their sympathies would be such was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose; that they happened to live in Ulster was more a question of its proximity to Scotland. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts, whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.

to:

Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]]. As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. That their sympathies would be such was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose; that they happened to live in Ulster was more a question of its proximity to Scotland. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts, counterparts,[[note]]For instance, JonathanSwift, born in Dublin but thoroughly English by ancestry, defended Ireland as early as the 1690s[[/note]] whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]]. As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. This was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts, whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.

to:

Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]]. As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. This That their sympathies would be such was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose.purpose; that they happened to live in Ulster was more a question of its proximity to Scotland. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts, whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.
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None


Depending on how you consider it The Irish Question might cover the whole of Irish-British relations from TheMiddleAges to now. Usually, however, it refers to the period between 1801 and 1922 when Ireland was formally a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Wales had long-since been conquered and pacified by the English when the country was formally integrated into England and and its ruling elite into English society in 1536. England and Scotland later, by mutual agreement, formed the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707 - to the consternation of the Highland-Scots who benefitted little from the economic boom which followed. Irish members of parliament sat at the National Parliament at Westminster, like everyone else.

to:

Depending on how you consider it The Irish Question might cover the whole of Irish-British relations from ([well] before) the incomplete Norman Conquest during the TheMiddleAges to now.the present day. Usually, however, it refers to the period between 1801 and 1922 when Ireland was formally a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Wales had long-since been conquered and pacified by the English when the country was formally integrated into England and and its ruling elite into English society in 1536. England and Scotland later, by mutual agreement, formed the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707 - to the consternation of the Highland-Scots who benefitted little from the economic boom which followed. The United Kingdom had had the Kingdom of Ireland well and truly under its own thumb for nearly a century by the time the Irish Parliament voted to join the union and its members of parliament sat went to sit at the National Parliament at Westminster, like everyone else.
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Do not confuse with the [[ThoseWackyNazis 'Jewish Question']]

to:

Do not confuse with the [[ThoseWackyNazis 'Jewish Question']]"The Jewish Question"]].
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->''Gladstone spent his declining years trying to guess the answer to the Irish Question; unfortunately, whenever he was getting warm, the Irish secretly changed the Question...''

to:

->''Gladstone ->''"Gladstone spent his declining years trying to guess the answer to the Irish Question; unfortunately, whenever he was getting warm, the Irish secretly changed the Question...''"''



->''[[DeadBabyComedy Roasted, baked, or fried?]]''

to:

->''[[DeadBabyComedy ->''"[[DeadBabyComedy Roasted, baked, or fried?]]''fried?]]"''
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Added DiffLines:

->''Gladstone spent his declining years trying to guess the answer to the Irish Question; unfortunately, whenever he was getting warm, the Irish secretly changed the Question...''
-->-- '''1066 And All That'''

->''[[DeadBabyComedy Roasted, baked, or fried?]]''
-->-- '''[[Literature/AModestProposal Jonathan Swift]]'''

[[quoteright:250:http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Really_Resized_9038.jpg]]
[[caption-width-right:250:[[TheSimpsons A Completely Unbiased Comparison.]]]]

Ever-so vaguely: "What do we, 'the British', do about 'Ireland' and 'the Irish'?"

Many modern countries were once British protectorates, or administered by Britain as part of her Empire proper. Ireland is unique in actually having been an integrated ''part'' of the United Kingdom, in the same way Poland was once divided up between and integrated into Prussia, Austria and Russia. Like in Poland, proto-nationalism in Ireland never quite died in spite of this, mostly due to the sentiments of the literate elite who composed the vanguard of nationalism as we know it today in the 18th and 19th centuries.

Depending on how you consider it The Irish Question might cover the whole of Irish-British relations from TheMiddleAges to now. Usually, however, it refers to the period between 1801 and 1922 when Ireland was formally a part of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Wales had long-since been conquered and pacified by the English when the country was formally integrated into England and and its ruling elite into English society in 1536. England and Scotland later, by mutual agreement, formed the Kingdom of Great Britain in 1707 - to the consternation of the Highland-Scots who benefitted little from the economic boom which followed. Irish members of parliament sat at the National Parliament at Westminster, like everyone else.

Given the nature of the 'United Kingdom,' it's natural to ask why there was not a Cornish Question, or a Welsh Question, or a Scottish Question. The answer is simple, really; these peoples had very little sense of nationalism as we know it today and shared a broad non-Catholic allegiance with each other by the time of the Union of England and Scotland in 1707. Scotland was strongly Calvinist, and England (inc. Wales and Cornwall) was broadly Anglican. Most people in Ireland were, on the other hand, Catholic. [[ForWantOfANail This does make one wonder how British and Irish history would have been different had a certain King of England not been so eager for a divorce]]. As senses of national identity developed many Catholics in Ireland became Irish Nationalists -- wanting independence or at least autonomy in running their own local government rather than sitting at Westminster. Scottish Protestant settlers in Ireland formed the core of those people in Ireland who came to identify more with 'Britain' and British nationalism, most of these living in the areas around Ulster. This was deliberate, as they had been sent to settle for this very purpose. Dublin had a long history of English settlement by this time, and was a broadly Anglican area. Over time, the Protestant community in and around Dublin came to integrate more with Irish culture than their Ulster counterparts, whose more stand-offish faith led them along much more firmer religious and eventually nationalist lines.

Broadly, most of those who wished for Irish independence were Catholic, and equally broadly those who supported the union of Ireland with England and Scotland ("unionists") were Protestants. Exceptions abounded.

The situation was soured by an undeniable streak of anti-Irish feeling in Britain [[hottip:*: Continuing sixteenth-century policies of identifying Catholicism with nasty evil foreigners, during the penal era anti-Catholicism was reflected in government policy, by Catholics forbidden to vote, hold public offices, or participate in civil society many other ways. It has been argued that the excommunication of Elizabeth in 1570 provided the ideal opportunity for the Cecil administration to implement its abiding achievement: the propagation of the idea it was impossible to be a Catholic and a good Englishman. Against the historical backdrop of Armada, Gunpowder Plot, Civil War, the flight of James II, Jacobite risings of 1715 and 1745, and almost constant war with France, it is easy to see how anti-Catholic, anti-foreign (specifically, Spanish and of course French) feeling was easily sustained in the nation's consciousness. In that context, vehement anti-Catholicism was found in both the mainstream press and satirical journals. Rome was Babylon, and the Pope its Whore: he was the Scarlet Lady, the Antichrist, whose followers were enslaved in his service, and who would cheerfully murder all good Protestants in their beds, given the chance.]]. The Irish were despised (and often feared) for their Catholicism, poverty and perceived recourse to violence. The Irish were regularly mocked in British newspapers and magazines, portrayed as shambling grotesque ape-like thugs in political cartoons - see the picture on this page. Even the better-minded Britons tended to view the Irish as being unfit to govern themselves. This view changed over the course of the 19th century, as anti-Irish rancour faded and by the late 1880s had largely died down.

On the Irish side, hostility was worsened by a truly horrific [[IrishPotatoFamine famine in Ireland]] in the late 1840s, in which over a million people died and many more were forced to emigrate. Many Irish people believed and still do that it was caused by at best stupidity and at worst deliberate malice on the part of the British government, who preferred starvation in Ireland to the chaos in Britain that would result if Ireland stopped exporting food to industrial towns.[[hottip:*:It should be noted that the worst of the famine could have been avoided altogether if there had been even a basic system of crop rotation in Ireland, or the Irish themselves grew more than one variety of potato. Not a case of ScienceMarchesOn as both the importance of crop rotation and crop variety had been a staple of sound agricultural practice for centuries already. This point gets glossed over a lot but is important to know. The reason for this is because at the time of the great Potato famine most were tenant farmers who could not afford to feed their families any other way.]]. A policy often pointed to is the Corn Law forbidding Irish farmers from growing this crop and competing with English ones. They then turned to potatoes, which failed, and the famine struck.

Note that, until 1916, most Irish nationalists were ''not'' republican; most envisaged even a mostly independent Ireland being ruled by [[BritishRoyalFamily the House of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha]] and Canada was often cited as a model for Ireland. Both [[QueenVicky Queen Victoria]] and [[TheEdwardianAge Edward VII]] were popular and received enthusiastic welcomes on visits to Ireland. Indeed, Victoria had a particular personal fondness for Ireland, often holidaying in Kerry. The full break only came later on when things had gotten worse.

There were many political attempts to reconcile Ireland into a Home Rule arrangement that would (like the current devolution of Scotland and Wales) keep Ireland in the UK. The first attempt was shot down. The second attempt passed through the House of Commons but did not make it through the House of Lords. Finally, the third attempt passed through both Houses and even received Royal Assent, but its implementation was delayed by the onset of WorldWarOne. In 1916, during the war, there was a minor Irish uprising on Easter Monday in Dublin which was crushed by the British. Initially this received a negative response from the Irish populace, ranging from bewilderment to outright contempt, especially as it was viewed as a betrayal of Irish soldiers fighting in the war. However, horror at the brutal treatment of captured rebels and a Draconian policy of repression by the British, the revival of Gaelic culture, and general war-wariness increased the feeling of revolutionary nationalism and support for independence. This was dramatically exacerbated in 1918 when the possibility of extending the 1916 Conscription Act to Ireland was considered by the British government, resulting in national uproar and staunch opposition from [[EnemyMine both Unionists and Nationalists]]. After this the Irish Parliamentary Party (moderate nationalists who supported Home Rule) fell and was replaced by Sinn Fein as the main political force in Ireland. Bitterness increased on both sides, leading to the Irish War of Independence, the Anglo-Irish Treaty of 1921 and finally the Irish Free State leaving the UK, while the (mostly Protestant) Northern Ireland remained. (Some republican nationalists disagreed with the terms of the Treaty, and there was a brief and bitter civil war which still informs Irish politics to this day. The Civil War is the ElephantInTheLivingRoom in Irish culture, and doesn't get mentioned much for fear of causing offence; notable exceptions are Sean O'Casey's play ''Juno and the Paycock'' and the recent Ken Loach Film ''TheWindThatShakesTheBarley''.) The Irish Free State eventually went on to become the current state of Ireland by unilateral declaration in 1949 (but they didn't change the license plates until 1987). For Northern Ireland see TheTroubles.

This area of history has a lot of disagreement; suffice to say ''everyone'' has his or her own view on the subject.

The conventional moderate view is that the British should try and remember history more (an amazing number of Britons seem to think Britain had no input on Irish history at all and that the Irish are just 'like that'), and the Irish should try and forget more (an equally amazing number of Irish people will blame Irish problems on the British regardless of where the actual cause or fault may lie, and in certain places there are people still holding grievances dating back ''centuries'').

Do not confuse with the [[ThoseWackyNazis 'Jewish Question']]
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