History Main / TheBattlestar

27th Sep '16 12:58:27 AM PaulA
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* Creator/CJCherryh's warships in her ''Literature/AllianceUnion'' 'verse do this in some cases, especially the Earth Company Fleet, whose main ships are "carriers", each of which has four "riders", smaller craft without FTL capability. They're not super-small, though, having a flight crew of four and the ability to carry some degree of cargo and passengers. They are atmosphere-capable, high-performance, and armed with powerful missiles and guns in combat. One book, ''Hellburner'', covers events during the testing phase of these craft. The carriers themselves are heavily armed with guns and missiles, and do not rely on the riders for defense. Her earlier-written but much later in chronology Faded Sun trilogy features a carrier that has a single, much larger rider, which is not atmosphere-capable but is effectively an in-system cruiser.

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* Creator/CJCherryh's warships in her ''Literature/AllianceUnion'' 'verse do this in some cases, especially the Earth Company Fleet, whose main ships are "carriers", each of which has four "riders", smaller craft without FTL capability. They're not super-small, though, having a flight crew of four and the ability to carry some degree of cargo and passengers. They are atmosphere-capable, high-performance, and armed with powerful missiles and guns in combat. One book, ''Hellburner'', ''Literature/{{Hellburner}}'', covers events during the testing phase of these craft. The carriers themselves are heavily armed with guns and missiles, and do not rely on the riders for defense. Her earlier-written but much later in chronology Faded Sun ''Literature/TheFadedSun'' trilogy features a carrier that has a single, much larger rider, which is not atmosphere-capable but is effectively an in-system cruiser.
26th Sep '16 6:26:13 AM ScrewySqrl
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** Earlier aircraft carriers did approach a "cruiserstar" configuration - American carriers ''Lexington'' and ''Saratoga'' and the Japanese carriers ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'' were all fitted with heavy cruiser-caliber big guns and could theoretically fight on equal terms with anything smaller than a battleship or battlecruiser. In reality, the guns were often positioned where they were either of little use or actually ''detrimental'' to their aviation facilities [[note]] Firing the cruiser guns to the port side by ''Lexington'' or ''Saratoga'' would have ruined their respective flight decks, and ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'' had their big guns moved to casemates just above the stern where they not only were practically useless but also added the threat of a magazine explosion close to the ship's very vulnerable rudder and propellers[[/note]] and the huge, unarmored flight decks made them vulnerable in a gun fight. The two Japanese carriers went down without any enemy ship getting anywhere near firing distance, while their American counterparts had their big guns removed and replaced with far more useful anti-aircraft or dual-purpose weapons).

to:

** Earlier aircraft carriers did approach a "cruiserstar" configuration - American carriers ''Lexington'' and ''Saratoga'' and the Japanese carriers ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'' (all four were converted from Battlecruisers under construction in the wake of the London Naval Treaty) were all fitted with heavy cruiser-caliber big guns and could theoretically fight on equal terms with anything smaller than a battleship or battlecruiser. In reality, the guns were often positioned where they were either of little use or actually ''detrimental'' to their aviation facilities [[note]] Firing the cruiser guns to the port side by ''Lexington'' or ''Saratoga'' would have ruined their respective flight decks, and ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'' had their big guns moved to casemates just above the stern where they not only were practically useless but also added the threat of a magazine explosion close to the ship's very vulnerable rudder and propellers[[/note]] and the huge, unarmored flight decks made them vulnerable in a gun fight. The two Japanese carriers went down without any enemy ship getting anywhere near firing distance, while their American counterparts had their big guns removed and replaced with far more useful anti-aircraft or dual-purpose weapons).
11th Sep '16 4:13:57 PM UmbrellasWereAwesome
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* At least a few types of ships in the ''Franchise/{{Halo}}'' universe are like this. Most notably, the Covenant assault carrier, a 5.3-kilometer behemoth, as well as the 29km supercarrier revealed in ''[[VideoGame/HaloReach Reach]]''. Most human ships can do both jobs as well - but they are usually called "cruisers" or "frigates", and are tiny in comparison (1,191 and 490 meters, respectively, though actual human carriers are larger at three kilometers.)
** In ''VideoGame/{{Halo 4}}'', the 5.7-kilometer [[http://www.halopedia.org/images/0/0c/Infinity_fud_scale.jpg UNSC Infinity]] is a fully-fledged Battlestar. Armed to the teeth with four mass drivers, twenty-six ''thousand'' missiles and hundreds of fighter escorts, the ship is so big that it could carry ten frigates ''internally''. The ''Infinity'' is essentially a small fleet of its own, capable of smashing a Covenant fleet with laughable ease - in one case, [[RammingAlwaysWorks quite literally]].
** And then there is ''[[http://www.halopedia.org/Mantle%27s_Approach Mantle's Approach]]'', the [[BigBad Didact's]] personal flagship. At its longest, the ''Approach'' is a staggering three hundred seventy-one kilometers, matched only by the Covenant holy city High Charity in scope and grandeur. The {{Word of God}} also insists that ''Mantle's Approach'' is far and away from being the largest warship in the Forerunner's arsenal. The only thing its missing are the space fighters, but this is compensated for by the fact that the ''Approach'' is carrying a Forerunner superweapon ''and has a minimum crew requirement of one Forerunner to fly the damn thing''.

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* At least a few types of ships in the ''Franchise/{{Halo}}'' universe are like this. Most notably, there's the Covenant assault carrier, a carrier (a 5.3-kilometer behemoth, behemoth), as well as the 29km supercarrier revealed in ''[[VideoGame/HaloReach Reach]]''. Most human ships can do both jobs as well - but they are usually called "cruisers" or "frigates", and are tiny in comparison (1,191 and 490 meters, meters respectively, though actual human carriers are larger at three kilometers.)
kilometers).
** In ''VideoGame/{{Halo 4}}'', the 5.7-kilometer [[http://www.UNSC ''[[http://www.halopedia.org/images/0/0c/Infinity_fud_scale.jpg UNSC Infinity]] Infinity]]'' is a fully-fledged Battlestar. Armed to the teeth with four mass drivers, twenty-six ''thousand'' missiles and hundreds of fighter escorts, the ship is so big that it could can carry ten frigates ''internally''. The ''Infinity'' is essentially a small fleet of its own, capable of smashing a Covenant fleet with laughable ease - in one case, [[RammingAlwaysWorks quite literally]].
** And then there is ''[[http://www.halopedia.org/Mantle%27s_Approach Mantle's Approach]]'', the [[BigBad Didact's]] personal flagship. At its longest, the ''Approach'' is a staggering three hundred seventy-one kilometers, matched only by the Covenant holy city High Charity in scope and grandeur. The {{Word of God}} also insists that ''Mantle's Approach'' is far and away from nowhere close to being the largest warship in the Forerunner's Forerunners' arsenal. The only thing its it's missing are the space fighters, but this is compensated for by the fact that the ''Approach'' is carrying a Forerunner superweapon ''and has a minimum crew requirement of one Forerunner to fly the damn thing''.
1st Sep '16 8:52:17 AM dy031101
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* The [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ise_class_battleship Ise-class battleships]] ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' were converted into hybrid battleship-carriers (航空戦艦, Kōkū Senkan or Aviation Battleship, USN Classification: BBV) during World War Two, removing two of their rear turrets in exchange for small flight decks and a capacity of 22 seaplanes and divebombers. The small size of the flight deck meant that their utility as carriers are comparable to that of an escort carrier at best, and due to the lack of both planes and flight crews, their operational use ended up rather unsuccessful, to the point where the ships continued to be employed as pure battleships right up until their career as warships effectively ended during the Battle off Cape Engaño, where they as part of the pitiful remnants of Japanese aircraft carrier forces were overwhelmed by swarms of American fighter-bombers, and suffered the indignity of being reduced to floating anti-aircraft batteries for the remainder of their lives. In retrospect, their seaplanes would have been useful as scouts and anti-submarine patrols (both of which the Japanese '''desperately''' needed to make up for the US Navy's superior radar technology and extensive use of submarines), scenarios where the battleships' guns would be tucked away and therefore not interfere with aircraft operations. But then again, by the time the battleship-carriers came on-line, Japan already had trouble building enough of ''any'' plane[[note]]It should be noted Japan's original plans were to convert ''all'' their battleships except ''Yamato'' and ''Musashi'' into full-fledged aircraft carriers, but that a lack of resources forced them to make that conversion instead.[[/note]].

to:

* The [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ise_class_battleship Ise-class battleships]] ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' were converted into hybrid battleship-carriers (航空戦艦, Kōkū Senkan or Aviation Battleship, USN Classification: BBV) during World War Two, removing two of their rear turrets in exchange for small flight decks and a capacity of 22 seaplanes and divebombers. The small size of the flight deck meant that their utility as carriers are comparable to that of an escort carrier at best, and due to the lack of both planes and flight crews, their operational use ended up rather unsuccessful, to the point where the ships continued to be employed as pure battleships right up until their career as warships effectively ended during the Battle off Cape Engaño, where they as part of the pitiful remnants of Japanese aircraft carrier forces were overwhelmed by swarms of American fighter-bombers, and suffered the indignity of being reduced to floating anti-aircraft batteries for the remainder of their lives. In retrospect, their seaplanes would have been useful as scouts and anti-submarine patrols (both of which the Japanese '''desperately''' needed in order to make up for the US Navy's superior radar technology and extensive use of submarines), scenarios where the battleships' guns would be tucked away and therefore not interfere with aircraft operations. But then again, by the time the battleship-carriers came on-line, Japan already had trouble building enough of ''any'' plane[[note]]It should be noted Japan's original plans were to convert ''all'' their battleships except ''Yamato'' and ''Musashi'' into full-fledged aircraft carriers, but that a lack of resources forced them to make that conversion instead.[[/note]].
1st Sep '16 8:51:34 AM dy031101
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* The [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ise_class_battleship Ise-class battleships]] ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' were converted into hybrid battleship-carriers (航空戦艦, Kōkū Senkan or Aviation Battleship, USN Classification: BBV) during World War Two, removing two of their rear turrets in exchange for small flight decks and a capacity of 22 seaplanes and divebombers. The small size of the flight deck meant that their utility as carriers are comparable to that of an escort carrier at best, and due to the lack of both planes and flight crews, their operational use ended up rather unsuccessful, to the point where the ships continued to be employed as pure battleships right up until their career as warships effectively ended during the Battle off Cape Engaño, where they as part of the pitiful remnants of Japanese aircraft carrier forces were overwhelmed by swarms of American fighter-bombers, and suffered the indignity of being reduced to floating anti-aircraft batteries for the remainder of their lives. In retrospect, their seaplanes would have been useful as scouts and anti-submarine patrols (both of which the Japanese ''desperately'' needed due to the US Navy's superior radar technology and extensive use of submarines), scenarios where the battleships' guns would be tucked away and therefore not interfere with aircraft operations. But then again, by the time the battleship-carriers came on-line, Japan already had trouble building enough of ''any'' plane[[note]]It should be noted Japan's original plans were to convert ''all'' their battleships except ''Yamato'' and ''Musashi'' into full-fledged aircraft carriers, but that a lack of resources forced them to make that conversion instead.[[/note]].

to:

* The [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ise_class_battleship Ise-class battleships]] ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' were converted into hybrid battleship-carriers (航空戦艦, Kōkū Senkan or Aviation Battleship, USN Classification: BBV) during World War Two, removing two of their rear turrets in exchange for small flight decks and a capacity of 22 seaplanes and divebombers. The small size of the flight deck meant that their utility as carriers are comparable to that of an escort carrier at best, and due to the lack of both planes and flight crews, their operational use ended up rather unsuccessful, to the point where the ships continued to be employed as pure battleships right up until their career as warships effectively ended during the Battle off Cape Engaño, where they as part of the pitiful remnants of Japanese aircraft carrier forces were overwhelmed by swarms of American fighter-bombers, and suffered the indignity of being reduced to floating anti-aircraft batteries for the remainder of their lives. In retrospect, their seaplanes would have been useful as scouts and anti-submarine patrols (both of which the Japanese ''desperately'' '''desperately''' needed due to make up for the US Navy's superior radar technology and extensive use of submarines), scenarios where the battleships' guns would be tucked away and therefore not interfere with aircraft operations. But then again, by the time the battleship-carriers came on-line, Japan already had trouble building enough of ''any'' plane[[note]]It should be noted Japan's original plans were to convert ''all'' their battleships except ''Yamato'' and ''Musashi'' into full-fledged aircraft carriers, but that a lack of resources forced them to make that conversion instead.[[/note]].
1st Sep '16 8:49:45 AM dy031101
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* The [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ise_class_battleship Ise-class battleships]] ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' were converted into hybrid battleship-carriers (航空戦艦, Kōkū Senkan (Aviation Battleship), USN Classification: BBV) during World War Two, removing two of their rear turrets in exchange for small flight decks and a capacity of 22 seaplanes and divebombers. The small size of the flight deck meant that their utility as carriers are comparable to that of an escort carrier at best, and due to the lack of both planes and flight crews, their operational use ended up rather unsuccessful, to the point where the ships continued to be employed as pure battleships right up until their career as warships effectively ended during the Battle off Cape Engaño, where they as part of the pitiful remnants of Japanese aircraft carrier forces were overwhelmed by swarms of American fighter-bombers, and suffered the indignity of being reduced to floating anti-aircraft batteries for the remainder of their lives. In retrospect, their seaplanes would have been useful as scouts and anti-submarine patrols (both of which the Japanese ''desperately'' needed in face of US Navy's superior radar technology and extensive use of submarines), scenarios where the battleships' guns and airplanes would be out of each others' ways to begin with. But then again, by the time the battleship-carriers came on-line, Japan already had trouble building enough of ''any'' plane[[note]]It should be noted Japan's original plans were to convert ''all'' their battleships except ''Yamato'' and ''Musashi'' into full-fledged aircraft carriers, but that a lack of resources forced them to make that conversion instead.[[/note]].
** The Imperial Japanese Navy operated also two heavy cruisers of the ''[[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tone-class_cruiser Tone]]''-class, that had all their main guns mounted forward while their stern was designed to have facilities for launching seaplanes[[note]]Unlike the other IJN ships, these cruisers were designed from the start for that role using the aircraft for long-range reconnaisance[[/note]]. In 1943 the cruiser ''[[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_cruiser_Mogami_%281934%29#Respite_in_Japan Mogami]]'' was modified for a similar role, removing her aft guns in exchange for a deck with rails to operate floatplanes, and there were even [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ise-class_battleship#Conversion_to_hybrid_carriers plans]] in the IJN to give another old pair of battleships of theirs an ''Ise''-like configuration.
** Earlier aircraft carriers did approach a "cruiserstar" configuration - American carriers ''Lexington'' and ''Saratoga'' and the Japanese carriers ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'' were all fitted with heavy cruiser-caliber big guns and could theoretically fight on equal terms with anything smaller than a battleship or battlecruiser. In reality, the guns were often positioned where they were either of little use or actually ''detrimental'' to their aviation facilities [[note]] Firing the cruiser guns to the port side by ''Lexington'' or ''Saratoga'' would have ruined their respective flight decks, and ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'' had their big guns moved to casemates just above the stern where they were practically useless and added the threat of a magazine explosion close to the ship's very vulnerable rudder and propellers[[/note]] and the huge, unarmored flight decks made them vulnerable in a gun fight. The two Japanese carriers went down without any enemy ship getting anywhere near firing distance, while their American counterparts had their big guns removed and replaced with far more useful anti-aircraft or dual-purpose weapons).
** It is worth noting that defensive armament on late-war aircraft carriers such as the American ''Essex'' class would include a battery of 5 inch guns in so-called "Dual Purpose" mounts - designed to engage either attacking aircraft or any smaller enemy ships that got inside their fighter screen. This is, however, more of a result of unified logistics (the Dual Purpose mounts in question are standardized on all new-constructions and extensive reconstructions of frontline warships in the US) than anything else. In practice, it was almost impossible for enemy surface combatants to get close enough to engage an aircraft carrier, due to their combination of being very fast and having dozens of planes on board to spot enemy ships miles away[[note]]Not to mention their usually heavy escort, that ranged from destroyers to battleships[[/note]], making these guns' anti-ship capability merely academic in nature. Dual purpose mounts were used against surface ships in only one engagement: the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_off_Samar Battle off Samar]], and only because the escort carriers of Taffy 3 were unable to outrun the Center Force.

to:

* The [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ise_class_battleship Ise-class battleships]] ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' were converted into hybrid battleship-carriers (航空戦艦, Kōkū Senkan (Aviation Battleship), or Aviation Battleship, USN Classification: BBV) during World War Two, removing two of their rear turrets in exchange for small flight decks and a capacity of 22 seaplanes and divebombers. The small size of the flight deck meant that their utility as carriers are comparable to that of an escort carrier at best, and due to the lack of both planes and flight crews, their operational use ended up rather unsuccessful, to the point where the ships continued to be employed as pure battleships right up until their career as warships effectively ended during the Battle off Cape Engaño, where they as part of the pitiful remnants of Japanese aircraft carrier forces were overwhelmed by swarms of American fighter-bombers, and suffered the indignity of being reduced to floating anti-aircraft batteries for the remainder of their lives. In retrospect, their seaplanes would have been useful as scouts and anti-submarine patrols (both of which the Japanese ''desperately'' needed in face of due to the US Navy's superior radar technology and extensive use of submarines), scenarios where the battleships' guns and airplanes would be out of each others' ways to begin with.tucked away and therefore not interfere with aircraft operations. But then again, by the time the battleship-carriers came on-line, Japan already had trouble building enough of ''any'' plane[[note]]It should be noted Japan's original plans were to convert ''all'' their battleships except ''Yamato'' and ''Musashi'' into full-fledged aircraft carriers, but that a lack of resources forced them to make that conversion instead.[[/note]].
** The Imperial Japanese Navy operated also two heavy cruisers of the ''[[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tone-class_cruiser Tone]]''-class, that had all their main guns mounted forward while their stern was designed to have facilities for launching seaplanes[[note]]Unlike the other IJN ships, these cruisers were designed from the start for that role using the aircraft for long-range reconnaisance[[/note]].reconnaissance[[/note]]. In 1943 the cruiser ''[[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_cruiser_Mogami_%281934%29#Respite_in_Japan Mogami]]'' was modified for a similar role, removing her aft guns in exchange for a deck with rails to operate floatplanes, and there were even [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ise-class_battleship#Conversion_to_hybrid_carriers plans]] in the IJN to give another old pair of battleships of theirs an ''Ise''-like configuration.
** Earlier aircraft carriers did approach a "cruiserstar" configuration - American carriers ''Lexington'' and ''Saratoga'' and the Japanese carriers ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'' were all fitted with heavy cruiser-caliber big guns and could theoretically fight on equal terms with anything smaller than a battleship or battlecruiser. In reality, the guns were often positioned where they were either of little use or actually ''detrimental'' to their aviation facilities [[note]] Firing the cruiser guns to the port side by ''Lexington'' or ''Saratoga'' would have ruined their respective flight decks, and ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'' had their big guns moved to casemates just above the stern where they not only were practically useless and but also added the threat of a magazine explosion close to the ship's very vulnerable rudder and propellers[[/note]] and the huge, unarmored flight decks made them vulnerable in a gun fight. The two Japanese carriers went down without any enemy ship getting anywhere near firing distance, while their American counterparts had their big guns removed and replaced with far more useful anti-aircraft or dual-purpose weapons).
** It is worth noting that defensive armament on late-war aircraft carriers such as the American ''Essex'' class would include a battery of 5 inch guns in so-called "Dual Purpose" mounts - designed to engage either attacking aircraft or any smaller enemy ships that got inside their fighter screen. This is, however, more of a result of unified logistics (the Dual Purpose mounts in question are standardized on all new-constructions and extensive reconstructions of frontline warships in the US) than anything else. In practice, it was almost impossible for enemy surface combatants to get close enough to engage an aircraft carrier, due to their combination of being very fast and having dozens of planes on board to spot enemy ships miles away[[note]]Not to mention their usually heavy escort, escort that ranged from destroyers to battleships[[/note]], making these guns' anti-ship capability merely academic in nature. Dual purpose mounts were used against surface ships in only one engagement: the [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_off_Samar Battle off Samar]], and only because the escort carriers of Taffy 3 were unable to outrun the Center Force.
15th Aug '16 5:57:17 PM zarpaulus
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Added DiffLines:

* In ''VideoGame/{{Stellaris}}'' [[SpaceFighter Strikecraft]] hangars are huge-sized components that take up the same slots as weapons, so only cruisers and battleships are large enough to carry them. They can be pretty well-armed, and armor and shields take up different slots (point-defense are weapons though), but still not to the same degree as purely weapons-carrying ships.
30th Jul '16 1:01:55 PM nombretomado
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* The various planetoid-class Ships-of-the-Line in DavidWeber's ''Literature/EmpireFromTheAshes'' trilogy count (except for the ''Trosan''-class). [[UpToEleven Massive ships]] [[ThatsNoMoon the size of the Moon]], [[LightningBruiser capable of ridiculous speed]], mounting extensive [[BeamSpam energy]] and [[MacrossMissileMassacre missile]] batteries, and carrying a complement of parasite craft. Said parasite craft consist of separate battleships, cruisers, and two-man fighters. And the Fourth Empire had [[WeHaveReserves almost a million of them]]. [[spoiler: Just 70 of these almost completely annihilate a millions-strong AlienInvasion fleet.]]

to:

* The various planetoid-class Ships-of-the-Line in DavidWeber's Creator/DavidWeber's ''Literature/EmpireFromTheAshes'' trilogy count (except for the ''Trosan''-class). [[UpToEleven Massive ships]] [[ThatsNoMoon the size of the Moon]], [[LightningBruiser capable of ridiculous speed]], mounting extensive [[BeamSpam energy]] and [[MacrossMissileMassacre missile]] batteries, and carrying a complement of parasite craft. Said parasite craft consist of separate battleships, cruisers, and two-man fighters. And the Fourth Empire had [[WeHaveReserves almost a million of them]]. [[spoiler: Just 70 of these almost completely annihilate a millions-strong AlienInvasion fleet.]]
28th Jul '16 11:37:45 AM tkzv
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* Unusually ''averted'' in the granddaddy of all technoporn space operas, ''Literature/{{Lensman}}''. With the exception of some heavy cruisers and very fast scouts, virtually everything is a capital ship. There are no 'fighters' or light bombing craft at all.

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* Unusually ''averted'' in the granddaddy of all technoporn space operas, ''Literature/{{Lensman}}''. With the exception of some heavy cruisers and very fast scouts, virtually everything is a capital ship. There are no 'fighters' or light bombing craft at all. Probably because the series started in the 1930s, when few people realized the potential of carriers.
13th Jul '16 6:48:27 PM ScrewySqrl
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In RealLife wet navies, it does not work. Battleships and carriers require very different paradigms; the former are built for taking and dealing out heavy damage, which demands certain armor and armament characteristics, such as compartmentalization to minimize damage spread but also cut into holding space. Fighter landing strips, hangars and the stores for their fuel and munitions would detract from this role, leaving you with a MasterOfNone that cannot fight or tank as well as a pure combatant or service as many fighters as a pure carrier. This didn't stop some attempts from being made. When initially launched in the late 1920s, the USS ''Lexington'' and ''Saratoga'' had a complement of cruiser-class 8-inch guns. Japan put similar 8-inch guns in casemates on the sides of ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'', but they proved to be generally useless. Japan also created hybrid Battleship/seaplane carriers out of a couple of old battleships, ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' in the wake of losses at Midway. The naysayers turned out to be right: ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' were total failures, and the large guns on the US ships interfered with flight operations if actually used, and they were removed in 1941. Other experiments never got even this far.

to:

In RealLife wet navies, it does not work. Battleships and carriers require very different paradigms; the former are built for taking and dealing out heavy damage, which demands certain armor and armament characteristics, such as compartmentalization to minimize damage spread but also cut into holding space. Fighter landing strips, hangars and the stores for their fuel and munitions would detract from this role, leaving you with a MasterOfNone that cannot fight or tank as well as a pure combatant or service as many fighters as a pure carrier. This didn't stop some attempts from being made. When initially launched in the late 1920s, the USS ''Lexington'' and ''Saratoga'' had a complement of cruiser-class 8-inch guns. Japan put similar 8-inch guns in casemates on the sides of ''Akagi'' and ''Kaga'', ''Kaga''. The reasoning behind the guns was so they could defend themselves if ambushed at night or in bad weather when planes couldn't fly, but they proved to be generally useless.useless - the necessary high speed of carriers was a better defense. Japan also created hybrid Battleship/seaplane carriers out of a couple of old battleships, ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' in the wake of losses at Midway. The naysayers turned out to be right: ''Ise'' and ''Hyuga'' were total failures, and the large guns on the US ships interfered with flight operations if actually used, and they were removed in 1941. The 8-inch casemates were going to be removed from Kaga and Akagi after the Battle of midway, but the ships were sunk first. Other experiments never got even this far.
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