History Main / RPGsEqualCombat

* ''[[Recettear]]'' completely averts this in the core game aspect of running the store. Your Merchant level increases based on sucessful sales, nothing else. Played straight for the Dungeon-crawling aspect.

* ''Recettear'' completely averts this in the core game aspect of running the store. Your Merchant level increases based on sucessful sales, nothing else. Played straight for the Adventurers you go into Dungeons with.

* ''PlanescapeTorment'', where there are exactly two people that absolutely have to be fought.

** This holds true even for ''New Vegas''. 10 INT and 10 CHR is just as much as a GameBreaker as carrying around 20 Epic weapons.
* Ditto in ''PlanescapeTorment'', where there are exactly two people that absolutely have to be fought.

** Although most of the XP you get comes from mowing down the mooks, and actually advancing through the plot pretty much requires it.

* While the monstrously popular ''[[DungeonsAndDragons D&D]]'' largely plays this straight, many new indie [=RPG=]s have been trying to avert it in claimed contrast with ''Dungeons & Dragons''. In recent years, there's been an RPG described as “reverse ''D&D''” and one where you help people in order to regrow your lost soul. Ironically, ''Dungeons & Dragons'' itself has had experience rewards for non-combative actions since the 1980s, longer than almost all of its competitors have even existed (though they typically only existed through the intervention of [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GameMaster Rule Zero]].)

When a video game is described as having "RPGElements", you generally don't expect that to mean a [[MultipleEndings branching story path]] with lots of opportunities for you to decide how the character acts. That's more like a VisualNovel, a genre that's never really caught on in the United States. No, it usually just means that you kill enemies, take their stuff, and LevelUp.

To be fair, the way that character choice is expressed in rules-heavy [=RPGs=] is through the character you've chosen to play as exerting a direct influence on how you are and aren't able to play the game. Since most computer games are primarily about combat, that character customization naturally boils down to choosing between different ways to kill things.

This is exacerbated if combat is the primary or sole source of ExperiencePoints, money, or other resources, so that ViolenceIsTheOnlyOption. But that's no problem since there are MonstersEverywhere. However, it is possible that it is an actual legitimate RPG; it's just that everyone considers the plot as a WasteOfTimeStory.

** ''TheNamelessMod'' wisely follows this design philosophy. In fact, ''DeusEx'' had ''one'' required kill (that can be avoided but only by exploiting the AI's various pathing issues). ''TheNamelessMod'' has none.

* ''{{Alpha Protocol}}'' gave you a good amount of EXP for sneaking past enemies, and also gave you EXP for hacking, lockpicking, and circuit breaking. There are also many bonuses and allies to be gained by besting a foe in combat but choosing to spare their life.

To be fair, the way that character choice is expressed in rules-heavy [=RPGs=] is through the character you've chosen to play as exherting a direct influence on how you are and aren't able to play the game. Since most computer games are primarily about combat, that character customization naturally boils down to choosing between different ways to kill things.

* In the ''{{Fallout}}'' CRPG series, it is possible to gain a great deal of XP and even complete the game just by talking to people, sneaking around, messing with machines, or stealing stuff.
** This holds true even for ''New Vegas''. 10 INT and 10 CHR is just as much as a GameBreaker as carrying around 20 Epic weapons.
* Ditto in ''PlanescapeTorment'', where there are exactly two people that absolutely have to be fought.

* ''{{Ultima}} VII''; while the early games in the series were essentially the TropeMaker, ''The Black Gate'' focuses so much on dialogue and puzzle-solving that you can play 6-7 hours in before even encountering any combat, and then discover you have no idea how combat works in the game.
* Pen & Paper: While the monstrously popular ''D&D'' largely plays this straight, many new indie [=RPG=]s have been trying to avert it in claimed contrast with ''Dungeons & Dragons''. In recent years, there's been an RPG described as “reverse ''D&D''” and one where you help people in order to regrow your lost soul. Ironically, ''Dungeons & Dragons'' itself has had experience rewards for non-combative actions since the 1980s, longer than almost all of its competitors have even existed (though they typically only existed through the intervention of [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GameMaster Rule Zero]].)
** This GM and some he's played with subverted this trope in D&D thoroughly. Simply rule that XP is awarded for overcoming a challenge, and remember that 'overcome' does not always mean, 'reduce to negative HP.' For example, managing to secure peace with an orc tribe by negotiation can be a lot harder than simply slaughtering a bunch of low HD humanoids and should deserve a commensurate reward. Monetary rewards can come from [=NPCs=] grateful to see a 'better' outcome.
*** The 3.5 rulebook even gives another example - if your goal is to get a minotaur's treasure, then obtaining the treasure means that you have overcome the challenge, regardless of whether you did this by killing the minotaur or by sneaking past it. Either way, you earn the same amount of XP.
*** And in 4th Edition, there are even explicit rules for gaining XP for solving Skill Challenges - roughly speaking, skill tests that are particularly important to progress in an adventure. There are also guidelines for how much XP the GM should award for completed quests.
** Subverted in ''{{Risus}}''. The majority of the rulebook describes the all-important combat rules, and the Risus RPG really does equal combat. However, combat doesn't necessarily equal violence - possible combats described include playing chess, getting an unreliable vending machine to work, beating rush-hour traffic to stop the BigBad…
** ''TheDarkEye'' had experience gains for killing, but most points come from finishing the adventure (Not finishing it alive, but having it). In the 3rd edition, most creatures had no experience rewards anymore, and in the 4th edition, players only get experience for seeing or dealing with a creature for the first time (like it's a new experience). The first edition was released in 1983.

* ''{{Strife}}'' was one of the first First-person Shooters to include RPGElements, but managed to avert this trope. In addition to being able to enhance the player character's abilities, it also included [=NPCs=] that you could talk to, as well as MultipleEndings. And even then, ability upgrades weren't obtained by killing enemies for ExperiencePoints, but instead were obtained over the course of the story.

* {{Alpha Protocol}} gave you a good amount of EXP for sneaking past enemies, and also gave you EXP for hacking, lockpicking, and circuit breaking. There are also many bonuses and allies to be gained by besting a foe in combat but choosing to spare their life.

* ''Game/ThePrecursors'', unusually for a game that is partly FirstPersonShooter, allows you to complete most missions with diplomacy or stealth. You can even kind of [[NonLethalKO not-kill]] enemies in Space Battles, they usually run away when low on health.

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** ''TheNamelessMod'' wisely follows this design philosophy. In fact, ''DeusEx'' had ''one'' required kill. ''TheNamelessMod'' has none.

*** And in 4th Edition, there are even explicit rules for gaining XP for solving Skill Challenges - roughly speaking, skill tests that are particularly important to progress in an adventure.

*** And then [[WallBanger 4th Edition]] came out and went straight back to "let's just kill everything".

This is exacerbated if combat is the primary or sole source of ExperiencePoints, money, or other resources, so that ViolenceIsTheOnlyOption. But that's no problem since there are MonstersEverywhere. However, it is possible that it is an actual legitimate RPG; its just that everyone considers the plot as a WasteOfTimeStory.

* In the ''{{Fallout}}'' CRPG series it is possible to gain a great deal of XP and even complete the game just by talking to people, sneaking around, messing with machines, or stealing stuff.

** Although most of the XP you get comes from mowing sown the mooks and actually advancing through the plot pretty much requires it.

*** Though this is arguably justified by the fact that the game's protagonist is a seasoned soldier and that the game has a distinctly military sci-fi tone.

* Pen & Paper: While the monstrously popular ''D&D'' largely plays this straight, many new indie [=RPG=]s have been trying to avert it in claimed contrast with ''Dungeons & Dragons''. In recent years there's been an RPG described as “reverse ''D&D''” and one where you help people in order to regrow your lost soul. Ironically, ''Dungeons & Dragons'' itself has had experience rewards for non-combative actions since the 1980s, longer than almost all of its competitors have even existed (though they typically only existed through the intervention of [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GameMaster Rule Zero]].)
** This GM and some he's played with subverted this trope in D&D thoroughly. Simply rule that XP is awarded for overcoming a challenge, and remember that, 'overcome' does not always mean, 'reduce to negative HP.' For example, managing to secure peace with an orc tribe by negotiation can be a lot harder than simply slaughtering a bunch of low HD humanoids and should deserve a commensurate reward. Monetary rewards can come from [=NPCs=] grateful to see a 'better' outcome.

** ''TheDarkEye'' had experience gains for killing, but most points come from finishing the adventure (Not finishing it alive, but having it). In the 3rd edition most creatures had no experience rewards anymore, and in 4th edition players only get experience for seeing or dealing with a creature for the first time (like it's a new experience). First edition was released 1983.

This is [[strike: [[RougeAnglesofSatin exasperated]]]] exacerbated if combat is the primary or sole source of ExperiencePoints, money, or other resources, so that ViolenceIsTheOnlyOption. But that's no problem since there are MonstersEverywhere. However, it is possible that it is an actual legitimate RPG; its just that everyone considers the plot as a WasteOfTimeStory.

* ''VampireTheMasqueradeBloodlines'' ''tried'' to avert this, it really did; experience in particular is gained through plot triggers rather than fighting. However, [[strike: sometimes]] most of the time you've just gotta throw down and kill something.

This is exasperated if combat is the primary or sole source of ExperiencePoints, money, or other resources, so that ViolenceIsTheOnlyOption. But that's no problem since there are MonstersEverywhere. However, it is possible that it is an actual legitimate RPG; its just that everyone considers the plot as a WasteOfTimeStory.

This is exasperated if combat is the primary or sole source of ExperiencePoints, money, or other resources, so that ViolenceIsTheOnlyOption. But that's no problem since there are MonstersEverywhere.