History Main / GreyAndGrayMorality

* Myth/NorseMythology: The Norse view of the world was pretty much entirely founded on this trope. While the Gods weren't bad, they could be jerkasses if angered. Similarly, despite their horrific nature, the Gods' enemies could be portrayed as sympathetic, especially in the case of [[TricksterGod Loki]]. He constantly broke rules, but on the logic that too much order would stifle creativity. The real conflict is more one of order versus chaos, although it's clear which side the audience was rooting for.

The result of such a conflict depends on where the story lies on the SlidingScaleOfIdealismVersusCynicism. At the idealistic end, both sides will eventually realize that fighting is futile and end up putting aside their differences to learn from each other and make a new and better world. At the centre, one side usually ends up crushing the other; this brings about peace, [[PyrrhicVictory but of a hollow, depressing kind]], as a faction with noble ideals has been destroyed. At the cynical end, both sides gradually become more extremist and less sympathetic as the war drags on until eventually [[MightMakesRight the stronger side]] utterly defeats the other, leading to harsh oppression (and/or elimination) of anyone who holds the weaker faction's views, which eventually results in the stronger side [[WrittenByTheWinners writing history books painting them as the noble heroes triumphant against the evil dissidents who threatened their ways]]. That, or both parties simply [[KillEmAll end up destroying each other]], [[DownerEnding so no one wins in the end]].

Contrast with BlackAndWhiteMorality. Compare BothSidesHaveAPoint, BlackAndGrayMorality, WhiteAndGreyMorality, ProtagonistCenteredMorality, EvilVersusEvil, GoodVersusGood, MoralityKitchenSink, OrderVersusChaos, TheHorseshoeEffect and ALighterShadeOfGrey. FeudingFamilies and CycleOfRevenge stories tend to fall under this, as do many depictions of historical wars. A MobWar may be this, but may instead fall under BlackAndGrayMorality or EvilVsEvil. See GreyAndGrayInsanity, when this type of thinking is a sign of a character's mental instability. For another Moral Systems including Phylosophys See also {{Morality Tropes}} and {{Philosophy Tropes}}.

Contrast with BlackAndWhiteMorality. Compare BothSidesHaveAPoint, BlackAndGrayMorality, WhiteAndGreyMorality, EvilVersusEvil, GoodVersusGood, MoralityKitchenSink, OrderVersusChaos, TheHorseshoeEffect and ALighterShadeOfGrey. FeudingFamilies and CycleOfRevenge stories tend to fall under this, as do many depictions of historical wars. A MobWar may be this, but may instead fall under BlackAndGrayMorality or EvilVsEvil. See GreyAndGrayInsanity, when this type of thinking is a sign of a character's mental instability. For another Moral Systems including Phylosophys See also {{Morality Tropes}} and {{Philosophy Tropes}}.

* The feud between Las Sicarias (Wrestling/IvelisseVelez and Wrestling/MercedesMartinez in this case) and The Twisted Sisters (Wrestling/{{Holidead}} and Thunder Rosa). The former were [[NobleDemon faces with a heel mission statement]], the latter [[SpiritedCompetitor heels with a face outlook]]. They had many of the same straight heel groups to beat up on such as the Cutie Pie Club and the same hapless friend to tend to ([[Wrestling/BlackRose La Rosa Negra]]). Over time their rivalries over TagTeam title belts became overwhelming, making them forget their enemies (which is fine on paper, winning belts is the job) and their friend(which is less fine, though her [[PragmaticVillainy loyalties would be in conflict]] if they hadn't).

* The feud between Las Sicarias(Wrestling/IvelisseVelez and Wrestling/MercedesMartinez in this case) and The Twisted Sisters(Wrestling/{{Holidead}} and Thunder Rosa). The former were [[NobleDemon faces with a heel mission statement]], the latter [[SpiritedCompetitor heels with a face outlook]]. They had many of the same straight heel groups to beat up on such as the Cutie Pie Club and the same hapless friend to tend to([[Wrestling/BlackRose La Rosa Negra]]). Over time their rivalries over TagTeam title belts became overwhelming, making them forget their enemies(which is fine on paper, winning belts is the job) and their friend(which is less fine, though her [[PragmaticVillainy loyalties would be in conflict]] if they hadn't).

* Kyle O'Reilly vs Wrestling/AustinAries in Wrestling/RingOfHonor. Kyle O'Reilly was correct about Aries abandoning the company for not giving him enough money even though he was being paid more to do less work than any other wrestler in ROH. That Aries told a sob story about the ''Film/TheWrestler'' to make people think he was leaving the industry entirely only to turn around and sign with ROH's all but official at the time arch rival Wrestling/{{TNA}}. But he failed to acknowledge that Aries at least admitted he had a problem and was (supposedly)trying to become a better person. For the most part, fans treated O'Reilly as the {{face}} but did have sympathy and respect for Aries.

* ''WesternAnimation/{{Zootopia}}'': Zootopia isn't as unified as it appears on the surface; almost everybody is shown to hold some kind of prejudice and/or stereotype. Everybody is a victim of bias, and everybody is a carrier of it, [[InnocentlyInsensitive even if they don't realize it]] until they get called out. However, there are light and dark ends of the spectrum. Those on the lighter side, like Judy, Nick, or Gideon, who try to move past their biases, acknowledge and apologize for their mistakes are the ones who help Zootopia truly become better. Those, [[spoiler:like Bellwether and the others involved in the anti-predator conspiracy]] who don't care who gets hurt/killed in their campaign, are definitely on the darker end.

[[folder: Myths & Religion]]

* Part of what made ''Theatre/{{Carmen}}'' so controversial in its first run were the morally questionable actions of Carmen and Don Jose. On the one hand, Carmen starts out as an [[ManipulativeBitch emotionally manipulative]] FemmeFatale, whereas Don Jose starts out as a NiceGuy who can’t say “No.” On the other hand, by the end of the opera, Don Jose has become a CrazyJealousGuy, whereas Carmen dies [[HeroicSacrifice defending her freedom from him]].

* Myth/NorseMythology: The Norse view of the world was pretty much entirely founded on this trope. While the Gods weren't bad, they could be jerkasses if angered. Similarly, despite their horrific nature, the Gods' enemies could be portrayed as sympathetic, especially in the case of [[TheTrickster Loki]]. He constantly broke rules, but on the logic that too much order would stifle creativity. The real conflict is more one of order versus chaos, although it's clear which side the audience was rooting for.

In some cases, the story will end with both sides [[EnemyMine teaming up]] against an unambiguously evil [[ConflictKiller third faction]], who may even have been [[LetsYouAndHimFight behind the war]] in the first place. When this villain is defeated, the grey sides almost invariably [[FireForgedFriends decide to live in peace]] (in the harsher version, the casualties from fighting that villain may find that there is actually now enough of whatever they fought over for all the survivors. Ultra-harsh version of this has the realization that the resources have been spent on the war).

A result of the above is that Grey and Gray Morality has one potentially great advantage: It can be easier to maintain suspense regarding the ending. In BlackAndWhiteMorality, BlackAndGrayMorality and even WhiteAndGreyMorality situations, the ending is [[TheBadGuyWins almost]] always a ForegoneConclusion; [[TheGoodGuysAlwaysWin good wins in the end]], it's just a matter of how. In a Grey-and-Gray situation, either side might conceivably win, or both, or neither. Another great advantage of this kind of moral model is that the experience can end up entirely different between two viewers: one viewer may prefer to side with Faction A over Faction B for any number of different reasons, and another viewer may think the opposite for other reasons. Properly written, this can make for some ''very'' interesting story-telling. {{Video Game}}s in particular are a good medium for this, due to their interactive nature.

A result of the above is that Grey and Gray Morality has one potentially great advantage: It can be easier to maintain suspense regarding the ending. In BlackAndWhiteMorality, BlackAndGrayMorality and even WhiteAndGreyMorality situations, the ending is [[TheBadGuyWins almost]] always a {{foregone conclusion}}; [[TheGoodGuysAlwaysWin good wins in the end]], it's just a matter of how. In a Grey-and-Gray situation, either side might conceivably win, or both, or neither. Another great advantage of this kind of moral model is that the experience can end up entirely different between two viewers: one viewer may prefer to side with Faction A over Faction B for any number of different reasons, and another viewer may think the opposite for other reasons. Properly written, this can make for some ''very'' interesting story-telling. {{Video Game}}s in particular are a good medium for this, due to their interactive nature.

[[folder: Mythology, Religion & Folklore]]
* The Norse view of the world was pretty much entirely founded on this trope. While the Gods weren't all that bad, Odin could be an unreliable {{jerkass}} and tended to decide men's fates on a whim. Similarly, despite their horrific nature, the Gods' enemies could be portrayed as sympathetic, especially in the case of [[TheTrickster Loki]]. He constantly broke rules, but on the logic that too much order would stifle creativity. The real conflict is more one of order versus chaos, although it's clear which side the audience was rooting for.
* Reynard the Fox fables evoke this. Reynard is a trickster, and frequently the bane of other characters, but all characters are flawed. They are all animals (just like we are) and act according to their instincts. Reynard is the folk hero, but is not "good" or "bad", he is just as flawed as all the other characters.
** Similarly, Wolf and/or Coyote, depending on the region and tribe (and even storyteller). Sometimes, he's a Prometheus-like creature who stole fire from the Gods to give birth to or help humanity. Sometimes he's just looking for a meal, and isn't any more harmful than WesternAnimation/BugsBunny. Sometimes, he's a rapist coward who murders men, women, and children by tricking them into deadly games. One rape of a woman leads him into pitying her and helping her give birth, while other tales have him return food and protect those he stole from. He's a complicated case.

* Karel Čapek, a moral relativist, intended this with ''Theatre/{{RUR}}'', writing in a commentary on the play, "General director Domin tries to prove that technical developments liberate man from heavy physical labor, and he is right. Alquist believes on the contrary that technical developments demoralize man, and I think that he is right too. Busman thinks that only industrialism is capable of meeting modern needs; he is right. Helena instinctively fears all this human machinery, and she is quite right. And finally, the Robots themselves revolt against all these idealisms, and it seems that they are right as well."

Contrast with BlackAndWhiteMorality. Compare BothSidesHaveAPoint, BlackAndGrayMorality, WhiteAndGreyMorality, EvilVersusEvil, GoodVersusGood, MoralityKitchenSink, OrderVersusChaos, TheHorseshoeEffect and ALighterShadeOfGrey. FeudingFamilies and CycleOfRevenge stories tend to fall under this, as do many depictions of historical wars. A MobWar may be this, or may fall under BlackAndGrayMorality. See GreyAndGrayInsanity, when this type of thinking is a sign of a character's mental instability. For another Moral Systems including Phylosophys See also {{Morality Tropes}} and {{Philosophy Tropes}}.

* Nobody in ''WesternAnimation/ParaNorman'' is outright evil. [[spoiler: The evil witch who's cursed the town and all of its inhabitants is lashing out in anger after [[TragicMonster she was unjustly branded a witch and murdered by a]] KangarooCourt of [[KnightTemplar Puritan extremists.]]]] The zombies, [[spoiler: AKA those same Puritan extremists, [[MoralEventHorizon murdered an innocent child just for claiming she could see ghosts]], but the zombie curse has meant they've spent [[FateWorseThanDeath the last few centuries in ceaseless agony]], have had a lot of time to realize [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone how horribly they screwed up]], and are actively trying to [[TheAtoner help Norman and his friends undo the curse.]]]] The closest thing to a genuinely evil and dangerous force in the movie [[spoiler: are the ''living'' townspeople, who are [[HumansAreBastards far more violent]] [[HumansAreTheRealMonsters and dangerous than the zombies]], and like the Puritan zombies [[HistoryRepeats back when they were alive]], try to lynch Norman and his friends for claiming to see ghosts.]]

* GreyAndGrayMorality/WebComics

Contrast with BlackAndWhiteMorality. Compare BothSidesHaveAPoint, BlackAndGrayMorality, WhiteAndGreyMorality, EvilVersusEvil, GoodVersusGood, MoralityKitchenSink, OrderVersusChaos, TheHorseshoeEffect and ALighterShadeOfGrey. FeudingFamilies and CycleOfRevenge stories tend to fall under this, as do many depictions of historical wars. A MobWar may be this, or may fall under BlackAndGrayMorality. See GreyAndGrayInsanity, when this type of thinking is a sign of a character's mental instability.For another Moral Systems including Phylosophys See also {{Morality Tropes}} and {{Philosophy Tropes}}.

* The Revolution vs Palaestra conflict in Super World Of Sports, a {{homage}} to the various [[RivalDojos dojo wars]] of sumo wrestling and another form of the Wrestling/{{All Japan|ProWrestling}}\Wrestling/{{New Japan|ProWrestling}} rivalry. It crossed over into Grey and Black morality when Geki Dojo entered the picture though, as their manager KY Wakamatsu was transparently evil.

* Part of what made ''Theatre/{{Carmen}}'' so controversial in its first run were the morally questionable actions of Carmen and Don Jose. On the one hand, Carmen starts out as an [[ManipulativeBitch emotionally manipulative]] FemmeFatale, whereas Don Jose starts out as a NiceGuy who can’t say “No.” On the other hand, by the end of the opera, Don Jose has become a CrazyJealousGuy, whereas Carmen dies [[HeroicSacrifice defending her freedom from him]].

* Creator/WilliamShakespeare's historical plays sometimes work this way. In others he rewrites history to upgrade [[HistoricalHeroUpgrade heroes]] and [[HistoricalVillainUpgrade villains]] to create a BlackAndWhiteMorality that appeases the reigning dynasty.

* Nobody in ''WesternAnimation/ParaNorman'' is outright evil. [[spoiler: The evil witch who's cursed the town and all of its inhabitants is lashing out in anger after [[TragicMonster she was unjustly branded a witch and murdered by a]] KangarooCourt of [[KnightTemplar Puritan extremists.]]]] The zombies, [[spoiler: AKA those same Puritan extremists, [[MoralEventHorizon murdered an innocent child just for claiming she could see ghosts]], but the zombie curse has meant they've spent [[FateWorseThanDeath the last few centuries in ceaseless agony]], have had a lot of time to realize [[MyGodWhatHaveIDone how horribly they screwed up]], and are actively trying to [[TheAtoner help Norman and his friends undo the curse.]]]] The closest thing to a genuinely evil and dangerous force in the movie [[spoiler: are the ''living'' townspeople, who are [[HumansAreBastards far more violent]] [[HumansAreTheRealMonsters and dangerous than the zombies]], and like the Puritan zombies [[HistoryRepeats back when they were alive]], try to lynch Norman and his friends for claiming to see ghosts.]]

In some cases, the story will end with both sides [[EnemyMine teaming up]] against an [[AlwaysChaoticEvil unambiguously evil]] third faction, who may even have been [[LetsYouAndHimFight behind the war]] in the first place. When this villain is defeated, the grey sides almost invariably [[FireForgedFriends decide to live in peace]] (in the harsher version, the casualties from fighting that villain may find that there is actually now enough of whatever they fought over for all the survivors. Ultra-harsh version of this has the realization that the resources have been spent on the war).