History Main / FascistButInefficient

15th Jan '18 3:51:12 PM Shamrock95
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ThoseWackyNazis. Sure, they might be brutal and genocidal, but at least they can [[NoDelaysForTheWicked make trains run on time]] and all that good stuff... only, the actual Nazis couldn't even do that. With military resources spread across four completely separate services that had to be actively bullied by Hitler into cooperating ([[UsefulNotes/NazisWithGnarlyWeapons Heer, Kriegsmarine, Luftwaffe, SS]])[[note]]Indeed, Hitler once joked that he had an [[UsefulNotes/ImperialGermany Imperial Army]], Nazi Air Force, and [[DirtyCommies Socialist Navy]][[/note]], four economic institutions which competed for limited resources[[note]] Walther Funk's Ministry of Economics, Luftwaffe-head Herman Goering's Four-Year Plan Organisation, Oberkommando der Wehrmacht (OKW) General Georg Thomas' War Economy Office, and Fritz Todt's Ministry of Weapons and Munitions [[/note]], two General Headquarters [[note]] Oberkommando des Heeres (OKH) - 'Ostfront'/USSR. Oberkommando der Wehrmacht (OKW) - 'Westfront'/everything else including all rail-supply/logistics ''even in the areas controlled by the OKH'' [[/note]], two intelligence services (Abwehr, Gestapo) that never shared information and occasionally offed each other's agents, two civil services and two courts (one regular/normal, one political), and ''five'' atomic bomb programs that shared no information or resources with each other [[note]] Most, if not all, of this compartmentalization was due to Hitler's personal intervention, as he feared too much power being concentrated in any organization that wasn't run directly by him. [[/note]]. UsefulNotes/NaziGermany was actually one of the most inefficient states in history -- and that's not even accounting for the gross corruption. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK419Nlp8eU&t=1s Hitler himself made quite a few amateur mistakes]], creating a two-front war, never allowing a retreat, and invading Russia during winter with an army unprepared for cold weather. In RealLife, the only thing efficient about dictatorships is their total control of the media, which they use to portray themselves as being extremely efficient (and [[PeoplesRepublicOfTyranny benevolent]]) despite their crippling factional in-fighting and [[CorruptPolitician endemic corruption]].

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ThoseWackyNazis. Sure, they might be brutal and genocidal, but at least they can [[NoDelaysForTheWicked make trains run on time]] and all that good stuff... only, the actual Nazis couldn't even do that. With military resources spread across four completely separate services that had to be actively bullied by Hitler into cooperating ([[UsefulNotes/NazisWithGnarlyWeapons Heer, Kriegsmarine, Luftwaffe, SS]])[[note]]Indeed, Hitler once joked that he had an [[UsefulNotes/ImperialGermany Imperial Army]], Nazi Air Force, and [[DirtyCommies Socialist Navy]][[/note]], four economic institutions which competed for limited resources[[note]] Walther Funk's Ministry of Economics, Luftwaffe-head Herman Goering's Four-Year Plan Organisation, Oberkommando der Wehrmacht (OKW) General Georg Thomas' War Economy Office, and Fritz Todt's Ministry of Weapons and Munitions [[/note]], two General Headquarters [[note]] Oberkommando des Heeres (OKH) - 'Ostfront'/USSR. Oberkommando der Wehrmacht (OKW) - 'Westfront'/everything else including all rail-supply/logistics ''even in the areas controlled by the OKH'' [[/note]], two intelligence services (Abwehr, Gestapo) that never shared information and occasionally offed each other's agents, two civil services and two courts (one regular/normal, one political), and ''five'' atomic bomb programs that shared no information or resources with each other [[note]] Most, if not all, of this compartmentalization was due to Hitler's personal intervention, as he feared too much power being concentrated in any organization that wasn't run directly by him. [[/note]]. [[/note]], UsefulNotes/NaziGermany was actually one of the most inefficient states in history -- and that's not even accounting for the gross corruption. [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK419Nlp8eU&t=1s Hitler himself made quite a few amateur mistakes]], creating a two-front war, never allowing a retreat, and invading Russia during winter with an army unprepared for cold weather. In RealLife, the only thing efficient about dictatorships is their total control of the media, which they use to portray themselves as being extremely efficient (and [[PeoplesRepublicOfTyranny benevolent]]) despite their crippling factional in-fighting and [[CorruptPolitician endemic corruption]].
4th Jan '18 2:50:19 PM Rebu
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** RuleOfSymbolism: According to DVDCommentary, communicating this "overwhelmingly powerful but inefficient" government is why the Alliance cruisers are shaped the way they are. They are massive ships that resemble several sky-scrapers on the same foundation, with engines thrusting them parallel to that foundation, they are built to look like efficiency-nightmares. Likewise, the resources that go into building one might lead to a ship that is overwhelmingly powerful, capable of launching and supporting dozens of [[SpaceFighter smaller craft]], but is so large and slow it cannot possibly effectively patrol the vast territory of TheVerse without huge gaps.

to:

** RuleOfSymbolism: According to DVDCommentary, communicating this "overwhelmingly powerful but inefficient" government is why the Alliance cruisers are shaped the way they are. They are massive ships that resemble several sky-scrapers on the same foundation, with engines thrusting them parallel to that foundation, they are built to look like efficiency-nightmares."horizontally"; in short, efficiency nightmares. Likewise, the resources that go into building one might lead to a ship that is overwhelmingly powerful, capable of launching and supporting dozens of [[SpaceFighter smaller craft]], but is so large and slow it cannot possibly effectively patrol the vast territory of TheVerse without huge gaps.
31st Dec '17 9:20:22 PM TheAmazingBlachman
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In fiction, the administrative incompetence of authoritarian regimes is often taken to comedic extremes. They'll enforce laws in a haphazard manner - extreme draconian punishment for jaywalkers, but anyone with enough sense to wear a PaperThinDisguise slips right under the radar. It appears that in their respective universes, fascism is controlled by a series of {{obstructive bureaucrat}}s, who aren't really interested in things working so much as they are in seriously inconveniencing people.

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In fiction, the administrative incompetence of authoritarian regimes is often taken to comedic extremes. They'll enforce laws in a haphazard manner - -- extreme draconian punishment for jaywalkers, but anyone with enough sense to wear a PaperThinDisguise slips right under the radar. It appears that in their respective universes, fascism is controlled by a series of {{obstructive bureaucrat}}s, who aren't really interested in things working so much as they are in seriously inconveniencing people.
2nd Dec '17 4:36:12 AM HighCrate
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*** The Human Hive is the sole exception to this rule, being immune to inefficiency and thus being the only faction capable of running the Planned Economy/Police State combo. In-story, this is explained as [[GameplayAndStoryIntegration the influence of Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang]], but in reality this was added as a feature to make a totalitarian faction playable, rather than just an extremely creative form of suicide.



** ''VideoGame/{{Stellaris}}'': Zig-zagged. Egalitarian empires have a bonus to [[EnergyEconomy energy credit production]] but Authoritarian empires can have slaves who are better at farming and mining but poor at research or energy production. In addition slaves (especially of differing ethos) will often try to revolt and non-authoritarian empires really won't like you.
** ''VideoGame/RiseOfNations'' gives players who choose Despotism, Monarchy, and Socialism cost reductions in military research and purchasing, versus Republic, Democracy, and Capitalism granting bonuses to [[YouRequireMoreVespeneGas resource gathering]] and general research.
1st Dec '17 7:00:23 PM StarSword
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** ''VideoGame/RiseOfNations'' gives players who choose Despotism, Monarchy, and Socialism cost reductions in military research and purchasing, versus Republic, Democracy, and Capitalism granting bonuses to [[YouRequireMoreVespeneGas resource gathering]] and general research.
17th Nov '17 9:27:37 AM LavonPapillon1
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Added DiffLines:

* The Gem Homeworld from ''WesternAnimation/StevenUniverse'' operates on a FantasticCasteSystem where one's role and position depends on one's gem-type, with the Diamonds acting as the highest of authorities. The Diamonds each have complete unchecked power over their Empire and are willing to enact harsh punishments at the slightest provocation, including instant death. Because of this, certain forms of efficiency are sacrificed in order for some gems to escape the Diamond's wrath, such as Holly Blue Agate not telling Blue Diamond that the Crystal Gems infiltrated the Human Zoo under her nose. They also have a taboo against fusion, fusions between the same gem-types only allowed during combat situations and inter-gem fusions like Garnet and Rhodonite considered criminal punishable by shattering, even though Garnet only first manifested by accident when Ruby save Sapphire, the very thing Ruby was assigned to do.
10th Nov '17 3:21:03 PM FearlessSon
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** ''VideoGame/{{Stellaris}}'': Zig-zagged. Individualist empires have a bonus to [[EnergyEconomy energy credit production]] but Collectivists can have slaves who are better at farming and mining but poor at research or energy production. In addition slaves (especially of differing ethos) will often try to revolt and non-collectivist empires really won't like you.

to:

** ''VideoGame/{{Stellaris}}'': Zig-zagged. Individualist Egalitarian empires have a bonus to [[EnergyEconomy energy credit production]] but Collectivists Authoritarian empires can have slaves who are better at farming and mining but poor at research or energy production. In addition slaves (especially of differing ethos) will often try to revolt and non-collectivist non-authoritarian empires really won't like you.
10th Nov '17 3:17:35 PM FearlessSon
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* ''TabletopGame/{{Warhammer 40000}}'' has His Divine Majesty's Imperium of Mankind, probably the most {{exaggerated|Trope}} in fiction. It's deliberately the most oppressive {{crapsack|World}} government imaginable, but all the different factions that run it ([[ObstructiveBureaucrat Administratum]], [[ChurchMilitant Ecclesiarchy]], [[MachineWorship Mechanicus]], [[RedshirtArmy Imperial Guard,]] [[SpaceNavy Imperial Navy]], [[SuperSoldier Astartes]], [[StateSec Inquisition]], and [[PoliceBrutality Arbites]]) distrust each other at best, regularly hoard information and resources, will often refuse to help another faction unless it can benefit them, and on occasion will outright go to war with each other; more than one Imperial endeavor has been dismantled solely because of infighting. And that's before considering all the sub-factions (and ''sub''-sub-factions) ''and'' all the local departments that run individual planets/systems. Turns out that this is ''better'' than the alternative, as any time someone gains control of multiple departments at once they soon turn the Imperium's brutally up even further (Horus in the Horus Heresy and Goge Vandire in the Age of Apostasy). It doesn't help that the only one who could feasibly remove the "Inefficient" part is the Emperor of Mankind, and he's a barely alive husk trapped in failing life support.

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* ''TabletopGame/{{Warhammer 40000}}'' has His Divine Majesty's Imperium of Mankind, probably the most {{exaggerated|Trope}} in fiction. It's deliberately the most oppressive {{crapsack|World}} government imaginable, but all the different factions that run it ([[ObstructiveBureaucrat ([[VastBureaucracy Administratum]], [[ChurchMilitant Ecclesiarchy]], [[MachineWorship Mechanicus]], [[RedshirtArmy Imperial Guard,]] [[SpaceNavy Imperial Navy]], [[SuperSoldier Astartes]], [[StateSec Inquisition]], and [[PoliceBrutality Arbites]]) distrust each other at best, regularly hoard information and resources, will often refuse to help another faction unless it can benefit them, and on occasion will outright go to war with each other; more than one Imperial endeavor has been dismantled solely because of infighting. And that's before considering all the sub-factions (and ''sub''-sub-factions) ''and'' all the local departments that run individual planets/systems. Turns out that this is ''better'' than the alternative, as any time someone gains control of multiple departments at once they soon turn the Imperium's brutally up even further (Horus in the Horus Heresy and Goge Vandire in the Age of Apostasy). It doesn't help that the only one who could feasibly remove the "Inefficient" part is the Emperor of Mankind, and he's a barely alive husk trapped in failing life support.
10th Nov '17 3:14:20 PM FearlessSon
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* Depending on the gamemaster, Alpha Complex, the setting of ''TabletopGame/{{Paranoia}}'', can range from a well-oiled totalitarian machine to a dysfunctional cesspit of inefficiency, incompetence, and intrigue. The game manual also recommends that when dealing with very high-ranking antagonists, the GM should play them as [[RepressiveBufEfficient fascist and efficient]], and play their efficiency for as much horror value as the rampant inefficiency of the lower levels.

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* Depending on the gamemaster, GameMaster, Alpha Complex, the setting of ''TabletopGame/{{Paranoia}}'', can range from a well-oiled totalitarian machine to a dysfunctional cesspit of inefficiency, incompetence, and intrigue. The game manual also recommends that when dealing with very high-ranking antagonists, the GM should play them as [[RepressiveBufEfficient [[RepressiveButEfficient fascist and efficient]], and play their efficiency for as much horror value as the rampant inefficiency of the lower levels.
10th Nov '17 3:11:53 PM FearlessSon
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Added DiffLines:

** RuleOfSymbolism: According to DVDCommentary, communicating this "overwhelmingly powerful but inefficient" government is why the Alliance cruisers are shaped the way they are. They are massive ships that resemble several sky-scrapers on the same foundation, with engines thrusting them parallel to that foundation, they are built to look like efficiency-nightmares. Likewise, the resources that go into building one might lead to a ship that is overwhelmingly powerful, capable of launching and supporting dozens of [[SpaceFighter smaller craft]], but is so large and slow it cannot possibly effectively patrol the vast territory of TheVerse without huge gaps.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Main.FascistButInefficient