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* Music/JoyDivision. Ian Curtis' lyrics and low-key vocals make his [[DrivenToSuicide self-inflicted death]] of little surprise. Martin Hannett's spartan production adds to the effect; even Bernard Sumner says in the "Joy Division" docu-film that ''Unknown Pleasures'' is almost ''too'' dark, and he prefers the more varied arrangements of ''Closer''.

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* Music/JoyDivision. Ian Curtis' lyrics and low-key vocals make his [[DrivenToSuicide self-inflicted death]] of little surprise. Martin Hannett's spartan production adds to the effect; even Bernard Sumner says in the "Joy Division" docu-film that ''Unknown Pleasures'' ''Music/UnknownPleasures'' is almost ''too'' dark, and he prefers the more varied arrangements of ''Closer''.''Music/{{Closer}}''.
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* Gustav Mahler's song cycle ''Kindertotenlieder'', [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Songs on the Death of Children]]. Mahler based those songs on a large series of poems by Friedrich Rückert, who wrote them to cope with the death of two of his children. These poems were never intended for publication.
* The works of Bernd Alois Zimmerman are not often performed, due to their unrelenting nihilism; the brutal atonal sound of the music itself doesn't help either. His opera ''The Soldiers'' largely consists of selfish, manipulative ghouls meting out horrific abuse and gaslighting to a helpless woman, culminating with her becoming a beggar, that not even her own father recognises. ''Requiem for a Young Poet'' centers around three poets who committed suicide, interspersed with Cold War and Nazi audio footage; one movement contains no music at all, merely one of the poets (Konrad Bayer) laying out his reasons for killing himself. Zimmerman himself committed suicide shortly after composing this piece.
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* [[http://comic.halfquake.com/ The Half-Quake: Amen webcomic]], based on the game of the same name, features a whole bunch of extremely cynical and [[JerkAss generally unpleasant]] characters who are either unpleasant throughout the comic's run, or have most of their screentime dedicated to them suffering, the ''Victim of Incredible Pain'' baing a case example of the latter. The viewer is told outright that the main character, ''The Victim'', [[ShootTheShaggyDog will never be able to complete his main goal, and will die.]] Later plots do eventually form, but they're mostly pointless sidequests that serve to inconvenience the protagonist even more. All of the plotlines [[TheBadGuyWins are eventually rendered poinless]] by [[BigBad Somos]], who [[KillEmAll manages to kill off whoever was still living]] near the comic's end in a rather anticlimatic fashion. Top the whole thing off with a almost-complete lack of humuor, or extremely pitch-black and short-lived humour, and you get a comic that gets boring to read through after the first ten-twenty pages.
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simpler fix, less stuffiness and less "let's hide the trope name"


''[[TropesAreTools Meaningful]]'' [[TropesAreTools conflict is the soul of drama.]]

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''[[TropesAreTools Meaningful]]'' [[TropesAreTools ''Meaningful'' conflict is the soul of drama.]]
drama. Because TropesAreTools.
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[[TropesAreTools ''Meaningful'']] [[TropesAreTools conflict is the soul of drama.]]

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[[TropesAreTools ''Meaningful'']] ''[[TropesAreTools Meaningful]]'' [[TropesAreTools conflict is the soul of drama.]]
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No reason, except that I fucking hate " 'cuz " being there at al.


''Meaningful'' conflict is the soul of drama. 'Cuz TropesAreTools.

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''Meaningful'' [[TropesAreTools ''Meaningful'']] [[TropesAreTools conflict is the soul of drama. 'Cuz TropesAreTools.
drama.]]
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Forgot to do an edit I talked about in the reason for my last edit. So, this is what senility is like.


* [[Wiki/SCPFoundation SCP-Verse]]: TheVerse implies there are more than 5000 anomalous objects out there, a good portion of which are lethal, some of them targeting children or babies. Hidden in some of the entries are implications that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, doomed to die, no matter what is done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are. The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?" The existence of NegativeContinuity and UnreliableCanon on the wiki hopes to alleviate most of this, allowing the reader to disregard any portion of the canon they don't particularly like. The SCP-Verse will still be [[NightmareFuel attempting to scare your pants off]].

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* [[Wiki/SCPFoundation SCP-Verse]]: TheVerse implies there are more than 5000 anomalous objects out there, a good portion of which are lethal, some of them targeting children or babies. Hidden in some of the entries are implications that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, doomed to die, no matter what is done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are. The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?" The existence of NegativeContinuity and UnreliableCanon on the wiki hopes to alleviate most of this, allowing the reader to disregard any portion of the canon they don't particularly like. The SCP-Verse will still be [[NightmareFuel attempting to scare your pants off]].
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Yes, babies are children. No "or" required. "More than" includes "and counting." Also chopped out some meandering.


* In the [[Wiki/SCPFoundation SCP-Verse,]] the 'verse implies there's more than 5000 (and counting) anomalous objects out there, a good portion of which are lethal, some of them targeting only children and/or babies. There's also implications hidden throughout some of the SCP entries that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, doomed to die regardless of what's done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are, and there's not a lot of leeway for [[TheWoobie the more sympathetic characters]], given how much they've been mistreated on both ends. The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?", most of them belonging to the 001 proposals. The existence of NegativeContinuity and UnreliableCanon on the wiki hopes to alleviate at least most of this, allowing the reader to disregard any portion of the canon if they don't particularly like it, though it's still possible for the SCP-Verse to leave a rather bad taste to some people due to how a lot of the SCP items are dedicated to [[NightmareFuel attempting to scare your pants off]].

to:

* In the [[Wiki/SCPFoundation SCP-Verse,]] the 'verse SCP-Verse]]: TheVerse implies there's there are more than 5000 (and counting) anomalous objects out there, a good portion of which are lethal, some of them targeting only children and/or or babies. There's also Hidden in some of the entries are implications hidden throughout some of the SCP entries that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, doomed to die regardless of what's die, no matter what is done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are, and there's not a lot of leeway for [[TheWoobie the more sympathetic characters]], given how much they've been mistreated on both ends. are. The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?", most of them belonging to the 001 proposals. how?" The existence of NegativeContinuity and UnreliableCanon on the wiki hopes to alleviate at least most of this, allowing the reader to disregard any portion of the canon if they don't particularly like it, though it's still possible for the like. The SCP-Verse to leave a rather bad taste to some people due to how a lot of the SCP items are dedicated to will still be [[NightmareFuel attempting to scare your pants off]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* In the [[Wiki/SCPFoundation SCP-Verse,]] the 'verse implies there's more than 5000 (and counting) anomalous objects out there, a good portion of which are lethal, some of them targeting only children and/or babies. There's also implications hidden throughout some of the SCP entries that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, doomed to die reagardless of what's done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are, and there's not a lot of leeway for [[TheWoobie the more sympathetic characters]], given how much they've been mistreated on both ends. The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?", most of them belonging to the 001 proposals. The existence of NegativeContinuity and UnreliableCanon on the wiki hopes to alleviate at least most of this, allowing the reader to disregard any portion of the canon if they don't particularly like it, though it's still possible for the SCP-Verse to leave a rather bad taste to some people due to how a lot of the SCP items are dedicated to [[NightmateFuel attempting to scare your pants off]].

to:

* In the [[Wiki/SCPFoundation SCP-Verse,]] the 'verse implies there's more than 5000 (and counting) anomalous objects out there, a good portion of which are lethal, some of them targeting only children and/or babies. There's also implications hidden throughout some of the SCP entries that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, doomed to die reagardless regardless of what's done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are, and there's not a lot of leeway for [[TheWoobie the more sympathetic characters]], given how much they've been mistreated on both ends. The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?", most of them belonging to the 001 proposals. The existence of NegativeContinuity and UnreliableCanon on the wiki hopes to alleviate at least most of this, allowing the reader to disregard any portion of the canon if they don't particularly like it, though it's still possible for the SCP-Verse to leave a rather bad taste to some people due to how a lot of the SCP items are dedicated to [[NightmateFuel [[NightmareFuel attempting to scare your pants off]].
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Updated from SCP Foundation


* In the Wiki/SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there, many of which are lethal, some of them targeting only children and/or babies. There is also an implications that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, about which nothing can be done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are, which is enough to cause casual viewers to not care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?". This is part of the reason for the existence of NegativeContinuity and UnreliableCanon on the wiki; if the reader dislikes a particular implication of an SCP object or canon, they are allowed and encouraged to disregard it.

to:

* In the Wiki/SCPFoundation, The wiki [[Wiki/SCPFoundation SCP-Verse,]] the 'verse implies there's more than 5000 (and counting) anomalous objects out there, many a good portion of which are lethal, some of them targeting only children and/or babies. There is There's also an implications hidden throughout some of the SCP entries that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, about which nothing can be doomed to die reagardless of what's done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are, which is enough to cause casual viewers to and there's not care about any a lot of leeway for [[TheWoobie the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter more sympathetic characters]], given how hard they try, what's the point? much they've been mistreated on both ends. The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?". This is part how?", most of them belonging to the reason for the 001 proposals. The existence of NegativeContinuity and UnreliableCanon on the wiki; if wiki hopes to alleviate at least most of this, allowing the reader dislikes a particular implication of an SCP object or canon, they are allowed and encouraged to disregard it.any portion of the canon if they don't particularly like it, though it's still possible for the SCP-Verse to leave a rather bad taste to some people due to how a lot of the SCP items are dedicated to [[NightmateFuel attempting to scare your pants off]].
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


* In the Wiki/SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there, almost every single one of them is lethal, some of them targeting children and babies. There is also an implications that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, about which nothing can be done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are, which is enough to cause casual viewers to not care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?".

to:

* In the Wiki/SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there, almost every single one many of them is which are lethal, some of them targeting only children and and/or babies. There is also an implications that Earth is suffering an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, about which nothing can be done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villains of the SCP-verse can get and how powerful they are, which is enough to cause casual viewers to not care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? The reader can't even feel that the world is at least fine for now, because there are many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?". This is part of the reason for the existence of NegativeContinuity and UnreliableCanon on the wiki; if the reader dislikes a particular implication of an SCP object or canon, they are allowed and encouraged to disregard it.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
removed some Word Cruft


* In the Wiki/SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there (though mostly contained), almost every single one of them is able to kill you easily, and is likely to have done so for quite some time before containment, '''some of them even targeting children and babies''', not to mention there's not only more than 2 cults that are mindbogglingly evil and are dedicated to wiping out the Foundation (who themselves have also done tons of horrible things), and by extension, the entirety of humanity, there's also the implications that Earth is really suffering though an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, with absolutely nothing they can do to change it whatsoever. The very fact that '''there's an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villians of the SCP-verse can get''' and how powerful they are is already enough to cause casual viewers to not really care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? Oh, and this isn't even scratching the surface of the SCP-001 proposals or the Apollyon objects or any of the more powerful and dangerous Keter objects. And you can't entirely take solace in the fact that at least the world is fine for now either, because there are ''quite'' a few articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?", which can be severely offputting if you get too many in a row.

to:

* In the Wiki/SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there (though mostly contained), there, almost every single one of them is able to kill you easily, and is likely to have done so for quite lethal, some time before containment, '''some of them even targeting children and babies''', not to mention there's not only more than 2 cults that are mindbogglingly evil and are dedicated to wiping out the Foundation (who themselves have babies. There is also done tons of horrible things), and by extension, the entirety of humanity, there's also the an implications that Earth is really suffering though an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, with absolutely about which nothing they can do to change it whatsoever. The very fact that '''there's be done. There is an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villians villains of the SCP-verse can get''' get and how powerful they are is already are, which is enough to cause casual viewers to not really care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? Oh, and this isn't even scratching the surface of the SCP-001 proposals or the Apollyon objects or any of the more powerful and dangerous Keter objects. And you The reader can't entirely take solace in the fact even feel that at least the world is at least fine for now either, now, because there are ''quite'' a few many articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?", which can be severely offputting if you get too many in a row.how?".
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* In the Wiki/SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there (though mostly contained), almost every single one of them is able to kill you easily, and is likely to have done so for quite some time before containment, '''some of them even targeting children and babies''', not to mention there's not only more than 2 cults that are mindbogglingly evil and are dedicated to wiping out the Foundation (who themselves have also done tons of horrible things), and by extension, the entirety of humanity, there's also the implications that Earth is really suffering though an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, with absolutely nothing they can do to change it whatsoever. The very fact that '''there's an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villians of the SCP-verse can get''' and how powerful they are is already enough to cause casual viewers to not really care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? Oh, and this isn't even scratching the surface of the SCP-001 proposals or the Apollyon objects or any of the more powerful and dangerous Keter objects.

to:

* In the Wiki/SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there (though mostly contained), almost every single one of them is able to kill you easily, and is likely to have done so for quite some time before containment, '''some of them even targeting children and babies''', not to mention there's not only more than 2 cults that are mindbogglingly evil and are dedicated to wiping out the Foundation (who themselves have also done tons of horrible things), and by extension, the entirety of humanity, there's also the implications that Earth is really suffering though an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, with absolutely nothing they can do to change it whatsoever. The very fact that '''there's an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villians of the SCP-verse can get''' and how powerful they are is already enough to cause casual viewers to not really care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? Oh, and this isn't even scratching the surface of the SCP-001 proposals or the Apollyon objects or any of the more powerful and dangerous Keter objects. And you can't entirely take solace in the fact that at least the world is fine for now either, because there are ''quite'' a few articles that amount to "this object already caused the apocalypse, wanna know how?", which can be severely offputting if you get too many in a row.
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* The Music/PinkFloyd albums made after Music/RogerWaters [[IAmTheBand asserted control of the band]], particularly ''Music/{{Animals}}'', ''Music/TheWall'' and ''Music/TheFinalCut'', have been criticized for their relentlessly downbeat tone. ''The Final Cut'' is one of the most divisive in the band's catalog, and also one of its lowest-selling post-''Music/DarkSideOfTheMoon'' releases.
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Linking directly instead of through redirect.


* The story-presented-as-a-actual-television show ''Comeuppance'', by [[https://tellygunge.wordpress.com/archives/story-archive/by-tellygunge/ Tellygunge]] (Scroll down to the bottom of the link due to no separate category for the story themselves) is ''supposed'' to be like a vote-in show to make women in hated occupations go into a disgusting [[CoveredInGunge gunge tank]], and tries to convince you by making the contestants as unlikeable as possible. However, [[UnintentionallyUnsympathetic Sian Welby]] [[RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgement (the one in this story)]] comes off as a SmugSnake towards those that do go in the gunge tank, [[spoiler:for example, Princess Priscilla after the latter created a scathing review of the former]], mocks every occupation on the show (especially if [[StrawmanHasAPoint they have a valid point, like the bouncer or the airline clerk]]), and the contestants either come off as UnintentionallySympathetic in their plight, or those who are supposed to come off as a KarmaHoudini end up [[LaserGuidedKarma punishing Sian]] in the ways that they can towards her.

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* The story-presented-as-a-actual-television show ''Comeuppance'', by [[https://tellygunge.wordpress.com/archives/story-archive/by-tellygunge/ Tellygunge]] (Scroll down to the bottom of the link due to no separate category for the story themselves) is ''supposed'' to be like a vote-in show to make women in hated occupations go into a disgusting [[CoveredInGunge gunge tank]], and tries to convince you by making the contestants as unlikeable as possible. However, [[UnintentionallyUnsympathetic Sian Welby]] [[RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgement [[Administrivia/RuleOfCautiousEditingJudgment (the one in this story)]] comes off as a SmugSnake towards those that do go in the gunge tank, [[spoiler:for example, Princess Priscilla after the latter created a scathing review of the former]], mocks every occupation on the show (especially if [[StrawmanHasAPoint they have a valid point, like the bouncer or the airline clerk]]), and the contestants either come off as UnintentionallySympathetic in their plight, or those who are supposed to come off as a KarmaHoudini end up [[LaserGuidedKarma punishing Sian]] in the ways that they can towards her.
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* ''VisualNovel/AmnesiaMemories'' can feel like this to some players. The game features a total of 26 endings, with 16 of those being bad endings. This means that Bad Endings outweigh the more positive ones at a ratio of 3:1, and some of the routes require the heroine to perform actions that make it appear like she's holding an IdiotBall.
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* Some readers of ''Literature/{{Worm}}'' fall into this state as it becomes obvious just how outmatched humanity is by the evils that assault it. The series is essentially a long chain of really bad things happening that directly result in even worse things happening. Things ''always'' [[FromBadToWorse get worse]]. In the end, though, [[spoiler:[[SurprisinglyHappyEnding humanity does manage to survive the impending apocalypse and even take down the entity responsible for it]]]]. As a general note, newcomers can have a hard time having any ''fun'' reading a series that's full of characters that do horrible and horrifying things on both sides. The protagonist, for example, starts off a bullying victim who experiences AdultsAreUseless, and she feels justified in committing torture, kidnapping, and murder. And she's one of the nicer characters.

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* Some readers of ''Literature/{{Worm}}'' fall into this state as it becomes obvious just how outmatched humanity is by the evils that assault it. The series is essentially a long chain of really bad things happening that directly result in even worse things happening. Things ''always'' [[FromBadToWorse get worse]]. In the end, though, [[spoiler:[[SurprisinglyHappyEnding humanity does manage to survive the impending apocalypse and even take down the entity responsible for it]]]].it--in large part because of how large-scale the entity is, and how unprepared it is to deal with concepts such as loss or grief]]]]. As a general note, newcomers can have a hard time having any ''fun'' reading a series that's full of characters that do horrible and horrifying things on both sides. The protagonist, for example, starts off a bullying victim who experiences AdultsAreUseless, and she feels justified in accidentally joins a gang, and, before long, finds herself committing torture, kidnapping, and murder.murder without blinking. And she's one of the nicer characters.
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[[folder: Role Playing]]

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[[folder: Role Playing]][[folder:Role-Playing]]
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Fixed red link


* In the SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there (though mostly contained), almost every single one of them is able to kill you easily, and is likely to have done so for quite some time before containment, '''some of them even targeting children and babies''', not to mention there's not only more than 2 cults that are mindbogglingly evil and are dedicated to wiping out the Foundation (who themselves have also done tons of horrible things), and by extension, the entirety of humanity, there's also the implications that Earth is really suffering though an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, with absolutely nothing they can do to change it whatsoever. The very fact that '''there's an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villians of the SCP-verse can get''' and how powerful they are is already enough to cause casual viewers to not really care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? Oh, and this isn't even scratching the surface of the SCP-001 proposals or the Apollyon objects or any of the more powerful and dangerous Keter objects.

to:

* In the SCPFoundation, Wiki/SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there (though mostly contained), almost every single one of them is able to kill you easily, and is likely to have done so for quite some time before containment, '''some of them even targeting children and babies''', not to mention there's not only more than 2 cults that are mindbogglingly evil and are dedicated to wiping out the Foundation (who themselves have also done tons of horrible things), and by extension, the entirety of humanity, there's also the implications that Earth is really suffering though an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, with absolutely nothing they can do to change it whatsoever. The very fact that '''there's an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villians of the SCP-verse can get''' and how powerful they are is already enough to cause casual viewers to not really care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? Oh, and this isn't even scratching the surface of the SCP-001 proposals or the Apollyon objects or any of the more powerful and dangerous Keter objects.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Added the SCP Foundation

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* In the SCPFoundation, The wiki implies there's more than 5000 anomalous objects out there (though mostly contained), almost every single one of them is able to kill you easily, and is likely to have done so for quite some time before containment, '''some of them even targeting children and babies''', not to mention there's not only more than 2 cults that are mindbogglingly evil and are dedicated to wiping out the Foundation (who themselves have also done tons of horrible things), and by extension, the entirety of humanity, there's also the implications that Earth is really suffering though an eternal CosmicHorrorStory, with absolutely nothing they can do to change it whatsoever. The very fact that '''there's an entire page dedicated to showcasing just how evil the villians of the SCP-verse can get''' and how powerful they are is already enough to cause casual viewers to not really care about any of the characters, since if they're gonna die no matter how hard they try, what's the point? Oh, and this isn't even scratching the surface of the SCP-001 proposals or the Apollyon objects or any of the more powerful and dangerous Keter objects.
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** = This is an ''intended feature'' of the works of Bertolt Brecht, which he called the ''Verfremdungseffekt'' ("alienating effect"). By discouraging the audience from relating to any of the characters (which was dismissed as a form of escapism), the goal was to draw attention away from them and towards the socioeconomic system that shaped them, and by extension, that same system which exists in real life.

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** = * This is an ''intended feature'' of the works of Bertolt Brecht, which he called the ''Verfremdungseffekt'' ("alienating effect"). By discouraging the audience from relating to any of the characters (which was dismissed as a form of escapism), the goal was to draw attention away from them and towards the socioeconomic system that shaped them, and by extension, that same system which exists in real life.
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** This is an ''intended feature'' of the works of Bertolt Brecht, which he called ''Verfremdungseffekt'' ("alienating effect"). By discouraging the audience from relating to any of the characters (which was dismissed as a form of escapism), the goal was to draw attention away from them and towards the socioeconomic system that shaped them, and by extension, that same system which exists in real life.

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** **= This is an ''intended feature'' of the works of Bertolt Brecht, which he called the ''Verfremdungseffekt'' ("alienating effect"). By discouraging the audience from relating to any of the characters (which was dismissed as a form of escapism), the goal was to draw attention away from them and towards the socioeconomic system that shaped them, and by extension, that same system which exists in real life.
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** This is an ''intended feature'' of the works of Bertolt Brecht, which he called ''Verfremdungseffekt'' ("alienating effect"). By discouraging the audience from relating to any of the characters (which was dismissed as a form of escapism), the goal was to draw attention away from them and towards the socioeconomic system that shaped them, and by extension, that same system which exists in real life.
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[[folder:Web Comic]]

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[[folder:Web Comic]]Comics]]
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In other words, there is nothing really at stake. It might ''seem'' like there is, but ultimately if you're presented with a choice between supporting one of two equally horrible groups or hoping for one of two equally despairing outcomes, that's not really a choice at all. The outcome's going to be awful either way, so why bother?

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In other words, there is nothing really at stake. It might ''seem'' like there is, but ultimately if you're presented with a choice between supporting one of two equally horrible groups or hoping for one of two equally despairing outcomes, that's not really a choice at all. The outcome's going to be awful either way, so why bother?
who cares who wins?
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In other words, there is nothing really at stake.

to:

In other words, there is nothing really at stake. \n It might ''seem'' like there is, but ultimately if you're presented with a choice between supporting one of two equally horrible groups or hoping for one of two equally despairing outcomes, that's not really a choice at all. The outcome's going to be awful either way, so why bother?
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* The protagonists are unrepentant and hypocritical murderers, there's no point in the people who die learning last-minute lessons, and everyone else is apparently so stupid they never put two and two together to figure out the protagonists commit such horrible acts, and so they are never stopped. Congratulations, you just read everything wrong with ''Webcomic/SuicideForHire''. The only thing it has left is the BlackComedy.

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* The protagonists are unrepentant and hypocritical murderers, there's no point in the people who die learning last-minute lessons, lessons (or die for ''not'' learning them), and everyone else is apparently so stupid they never put two and two together to figure out the protagonists commit such horrible acts, and so they are never stopped. Congratulations, you just read everything wrong with ''Webcomic/SuicideForHire''. The only thing it has left is the BlackComedy.
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* This is a problem a lot of people outside of people with ravishment fetishes have with ''VisualNovel/DiabolikLovers'' and the main reason the franchise is [[AmericansHateTingle mostly despised outside Japan]]. The female lead/player character is trapped in terrible situations without '''any''' ways out (and develops StockholmSyndrome), the romantic options are horrible people with little to no redeeming qualities, there's lots of gross and {{squick}}y elements that are clearly, and most of the game's MultipleEndings are overly cruel or esoterically happy.

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* This is a problem a lot of people outside of people with ravishment fetishes have with ''VisualNovel/DiabolikLovers'' and the main reason the franchise is [[AmericansHateTingle mostly despised outside Japan]]. The female lead/player character is trapped in terrible situations without '''any''' ways out (and develops StockholmSyndrome), the romantic options are horrible people with little to no redeeming qualities, there's lots of gross and {{squick}}y elements that are clearly, elements, and most of the game's MultipleEndings are overly cruel or esoterically happy.
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Cut out stuff that read like "Hating on shows you don't like". Note that DL is a rape fetish game. It's not "portraying dom/sub relationships wrong", it's portraying a chillingly unhealthy abusive relationship, but it's not pretending like that relationship is good


* This is a problem a lot of people have with ''VisualNovel/DiabolikLovers'' and the main reason the franchise is [[AmericansHateTingle mostly despised outside Japan]]. The female lead/player character is a TooDumbToLive ExtremeDoormat who is also trapped in terrible situations without '''any''' ways out (and develops StockholmSyndrome), the romantic options are horrible people with little to no redeeming qualities (with poorly written [[FreudianExcuse "excuses"]] that fall utterly flat because all the guys are callous brutes), there's lots of gross and {{squick}}y elements that are clearly there just for shock value, and most of the game's MultipleEndings are overly cruel or esoterically happy. And the game uses a ''very'' poor understanding of sub/dom relationships to justify all this.

to:

* This is a problem a lot of people outside of people with ravishment fetishes have with ''VisualNovel/DiabolikLovers'' and the main reason the franchise is [[AmericansHateTingle mostly despised outside Japan]]. The female lead/player character is a TooDumbToLive ExtremeDoormat who is also trapped in terrible situations without '''any''' ways out (and develops StockholmSyndrome), the romantic options are horrible people with little to no redeeming qualities (with poorly written [[FreudianExcuse "excuses"]] that fall utterly flat because all the guys are callous brutes), qualities, there's lots of gross and {{squick}}y elements that are clearly there just for shock value, clearly, and most of the game's MultipleEndings are overly cruel or esoterically happy. And the game uses a ''very'' poor understanding of sub/dom relationships to justify all this.happy.

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