History Main / AppealToForce

* ''LightNovel/RebuildWorld'': [[WrongSideOfTheTracks In the slums]] where Akira and Sheryl come from, this is virtually the only law. And the UnscrupulousHero Akira knowing this, is a SlaveToPr about trying to be TheDreaded in order to keep himself or Sheryl and her gang from being messed with. [[spoiler:Eventually after footage of Akira winning a DavidVersusGoliath battle spreads, Sheryl takes advantage of it to force all the other slum gangs under her.]]

[[caption-width-right:250:Simone Weil was always a real straight-shooter.]]

Maybe someone has a bigger army than the police, maybe they have a remote-control nuke buried underneath a city, maybe they have superpowers that render them nigh-invincible, maybe it's an [[NormalFishInATinyPond isolated situation]] where no greater authority is aware or able to respond. In any case, the strongest one around can do whatever they want because there is nobody who can enact justice upon them.

More formally, this is known as the "Argumentum ad Baculum"[[note]]Literally "appeal to the stick"[[/note]] or Appeal to Force, whose logic goes: "Agree with me, or I will physically harm you." The fact that this is obviously not ''valid'' doesn't stop it from being ''persuasive''. The phrase "talk shit, get hit", while crude, is one of the most common real-life applications of this.

Some political theorists consider this to be the basis of all law and ethics. The idea is that laws are just rules enforced by the threat of violence -- they don't have to be good or noble, they just have to threaten you if you break them. Hence why anybody can get away with [[FascistButInefficient useless, inefficient, and silly laws]] if the legislators have the weapons. Needless to say, this argument is rather on the cynical side of the [[SlidingScaleOfIdealismVersusCynicism sliding scale]], and one of the most popular themes of a {{t|heDictatorship}}otalitarian {{dystopia}}, though that doesn't necessarily make it untrue.

Of course, there's a catch. Unless you have the ability to live without sleeping and eating, sooner or later you have to put down the weapon, and somebody just might [[TheDogBitesBack slit your throat from behind]]. If your gang of supporters will avenge your death... that leaves you with the need to keep your gang happy, without risking them gunning for your spot. Also better hope you never get sick, old, or otherwise suffer BadassDecay. Following lines of logic for your security will quickly lead you to re-invent the military aristocracy and other basic sociology concepts, which passes beyond the scope of this article. We also note that while it's easy to force ''people'' to do what you want, ''nature'' is not so pliable: you can't threaten a hurricane to end, food to appear after a crop failure, etc.

Frequently the next step if ScrewTheRulesIMakeThem does not work, and related to ScrewTheRulesTheyreNotReal in that you're dismissing the need to make an "argument" at all. Other related tropes include FisticuffProvokingComment, HobbesWasRight, MutuallyAssuredDestruction, ShootTheShaggyDog, SexualExtortion, QuestionableConsent, and SwordOfDamocles.

* In ''WesternAnimation/JusticeLeagueCrisisOnTwoEarths'' the Crime Syndicate, made up of superpowered criminals, is so powerful that the police won't act against them and Slade Wilson, the President of the United States, will acquiesce to whatever demands they make of him.

* ''Series/IClaudius'': In Episode 10, "Fool's Luck", Claudius explains to a delegation from the Senate that he has been put on the throne by the Praetorian Guard and has no more choice in the matter than the Senate does. To drive this home, the scene is book-ended by the Praetorians ''and'' Caligula's personal guard of Germans marching in and out of the room in full panoply, something Claudius never ordered.

* UsefulNotes/LouisXIV of France referenced this when commissioning artillery for his armies: every cannon was cast with the motto ''VLTIMA RATIO REGVM'' on the barrel. The meaning? "The last argument of Kings."

Most of the modern world is built on the principles that justice is blind and that no man is above the law. Thing is, much as those principles are great, they rely on someone being willing and able to enforce[[note]]keeping in mind that the root of "enforce" is "force"[[/note]] the law. This trope is what happens when there's nobody who can or will.

Maybe someone has a bigger army than the police, maybe they have a nuke buried under a major city, maybe they just have superpowers that render them nigh-invincible, but in any case, they are free to break any law they want without fear of any sort of official justice.

More formally, this is known as the "Argumentum ad Baculum"[[note]]Literally "appeal to the stick"[[/note]] or the Appeal to Force, whose logic goes essentially thus: "I'm right, and if you disagree, I will physically harm you." The fact that this is obviously not ''valid'' doesn't stop it from being ''persuasive''. The phrase "talk shit, get hit", while crude, is one of the most common real-life applications of this particular fallacy.

Of course, there is a catch. Unless you have the ability to live without sleeping and eating, sooner or later you have to put down the weapon. If you're the biggest badass in the room, there's always the risk that somebody will slit your throat from behind. If your gang of supporters will avenge your death...that leaves you with the need to keep your gang happy. Plus, there's always the problem of old age... Besides which, while you may be able to convince people that you're right just by being more powerful than them, nature is not so forgiving: you can threaten people all you like to extort everything they have from them, but you can't take from them what they don't have, and threats will not make goods appear out of nothing.

Frequently the next step after ScrewTheRulesIMakeThem does not work, and related to ScrewTheRulesTheyreNotReal in that you're resorting to force instead of words to win an argument. Other related tropes include FisticuffProvokingComment, HobbesWasRight, MutuallyAssuredDestruction, ShootTheShaggyDog, SexualExtortion, QuestionableConsent, and SwordOfDamocles.

* In ''Film/{{Eraser}}'', [[Creator/ArnoldSchwarzenegger Kruger]] tells TheMafia that TheMafiya are buying secretly-developed weapons from a government contractor. They don't care until he mentions that it's happening on their docks. Since it's their turf, they head to the docks but are stopped by heavily-armed guards. TheMafia guys pretend to be members of the dockworkers' union, demanding their cut. The guard captain simply tells them to get lost and indicates his assault rifle. He gets distracted by Kruger making noise and is promptly beaten down by the mob.

** Civs in ''Civilization V'' will also be "afraid" if your army both ''wildly'' outguns theirs (at least twice its strength) [[GunboatDiplomacy and is nearby]]. City-states can be intimidated in much the same way to give up money or units.

* Late-game meetings with the Dark assembly in the ''Franchise/{{Disgaea}}'' games can seem a bit this way, especially in new game plus. If your proposal gets denied, your insanely overpowered team can beat the senators into submission without breaking a sweat.

* HonorRelatedAbuse: Don't make waves, step out of line, or otherwise threaten our FamilyHonor, or we'll hurt/kill/maim/etc. you

* AI leaders like to invoke this trope in ''VideoGame/{{Civilization}}''. "Our words are backed with NUCLEAR WEAPONS!". [[http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/nuclear-gandhi Gandhi]] is especially prone to this in all games of the series.

* AI leaders like to invoke this trope in ''VideoGame/{{Civilization}}''. "Our words are backed with NUCLEAR WEAPONS!" For some reason [[http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/nuclear-gandhi Gandhi]] is especially prone to this in all games of the series.[[note]]It originates from an overflow error in the AI aggression programming in ''Civ I'' that [[AscendedGlitch was kept in later games]] because [[RuleOfFunny it was funny]].[[/note]]

* ''Leviathan'', by [[HobbesWasRight Thomas Hobbes]], is one of the works best known for using this theory to explain RealLife. Hobbes argued that people either had the choice of living in a "state of nature" (i.e. lawless chaos) or giving up some rights in return for security from a state powerful enough to enforce laws, with the latter being the better option. Along with forming social contract theory, this was innovative by stating in no uncertain terms that the state's authority rests ultimately on force, rather than divine right, justice, or any other ideal political theorists usually appealed to. Those might be well and fine but amounted to very little without force to back them up.
** Thrasymachus, one of the characters in Plato's ''Republic'' takes it a step further-he doesn't just say that law is the will of the strongest, he actually defines ''justice'' in those terms.

* TwoPlusTortureMakesFive

%% Image selected per image Pickin' thread: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=16797665920.36949600
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[[quoteright:250:[[Webcomic/ExistentialComics https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/sayit.png]]]]

See also TwoPlusTortureMakesFive, AnOfferYouCantRefuse, TheCoup and MilitaryCoup, FisticuffProvokingComment, HobbesWasRight, MightMakesRight, MutuallyAssuredDestruction, ShootTheShaggyDog, ScrewTheRulesIHaveSupernaturalPowers, SexualExtortion, QuestionableConsent, and SwordOfDamocles. Frequently the next step after ScrewTheRulesIMakeThem does not work, and related to ScrewTheRulesTheyreNotReal in that you're resorting to force instead of words to win an argument.

[[folder:Film]]

* In ''[[Film/ImNotRappaport I'm Not Rappaport]]'', when Midge tells Nat to go away and get off his bench, Nat asks where it is that it says that it's his, that he doesn't see a plaque. "It says right here," replies Midge, holding up his fists.

* In the WebSerialNovel {{Literature/Worm}} the main character (Skitter) often threatens people with horrible fates if they don't do what she says due to her power to control bugs, including some unpleasantly venomous spiders.

* Laconia from ''Literature/TheExpanse'' was founded on the belief that humanity's expansion among the stars can only end in ruin if it won't be guided by one--and only one--man, that man of course being their High Consul Winston Duarte. It's ridiculous to think that just one person could keep control over every human colony scattered over ''1300'' star systems, but try to argue about that when Duarte has control over [[LostTechnology ancient shipyards]] able to construct dreadnoughts, just ''one'' of which is capable of eliminating whatever it points at in a blink of an eye and able to absorb more firepower than 2 powerful fleets combined can dish out and come out without a scratch. [[spoiler:Except for a few damaged sensors, which eventually help the underground destroy the ship and prove that fear of swift retribution was the ''only'' thing keeping hundreds of comm channels across the Solar System from speaking out against Laconia and [[BullyingADragon their irresponsible actions against aliens known for eradicating a civilisation far more advanced than humanity]].]]

* In ''WesternAnimation/JusticeLeagueCrisisOnTwoEarths'' the Crime Syndicate, made up of superpowered criminals, is so powerful that the police won't act against them and Slade Wilson, the President of the United States, will acquiesce to whatever demands they make of him.

[[quoteright:350:[[Webcomic/ExistentialComics https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/force_42.png]]]]

[[quoteright:237:https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/middle_finger_flame-1_4829.jpg]]
[[caption-width-right:237:Giving the nuke ''and'' [[FlippingTheBird the bird]] all at once.]]

* Arguably the basis of all law enforcement, by [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monopoly_on_violence State Monopoly on Violence]]. Follow the law, or the state will enforce it on you.

** ''Film/ANewHope'': The Death Star was explicitly built for this purpose, as Grand Moff Tarkin explains: a planet that refuses to submit to the rule of the Empire will be destroyed. Demonstrated when Tarkin threatens to destroy Princess Leia's home planet of Alderaan if she doesn't give him the location of the Rebel base... [[KickTheDog and then blows it up anyway to prove to every other planet that he can carry the threat out]].

* ''WebAnimation/{{RWBY}}'': James Ironwood holds two seats on Atlas' council and commands most, if not all, of the kingdom's military might. He repeatedly uses his large fleet of soldiers to see his way through both in Vale after the breach, and in Volume 7 to maintain order. It's implied the council is too intimidated by him to voice any actual protests first. Ironwood contemplates invoking martial law to get Mantle to deliver the necessary supplies for the Amity Tower project when Robyn inspires them to take a stand against him. [[spoiler:When he finally succumbs to his paranoia and chooses to launch Atlas into the sky to protect it from the Grimm, Weiss asks what the Council would say to his plan; Ironwood calmly says martial law will be declared, so it wouldn't matter.]]

* China relies on this for some of the stunts it pulls in the South China Sea, such as unilaterally expanding its airspace, betting that no one will call them on it because it would be too costly to fight a war over it. Indeed, they completely disregard national law and will do whatever they want because they are powerful, and, therefore, international law doesn't apply to them.

* China relies on this for some of the stunts it pulls in the South China Sea, such as unilaterally expanding its airspace, betting that no one will call them on it because it would be too costly to fight a war over it.

** And if you have beaten [[BonusBoss Baal]], they recognize that you ''have a nuke'' and don't even dare to object proposals made by a main character.

* Kyril Sutherland from ''Fanfic/TheNightUnfurls'' is not a bully who imposes his values on others, but he is definitely an AntiHero, since he has no qualms about explicitly or implicitly threatening people with force, either to achieve his objectives or get any belligerents out of the way. The fact that he is a [[NighInvulnerability nigh-unkillable]] individual of [[TheDreaded dreaded]] repute helps a lot. Consider this exchange in Chapter 13 of the original:

* This exchange from ''Fanfic/TheNightUnfurls'':
-->'''Sharkov:''' {{Silence|YouFool}}! [[WhoDares How dare you]]! I carry a sacred office, and I demand that you apologise for your rudeness!\\

** This is a valid legal argument in the Clan justice system. As they are a ProudWarriorRace, ''any'' decision not already settled through battle or a Trial can be nullified through a [[TrialByCombat Trial of Refusal]], in which the defender essentially fights their accuser(s) for the right to undo the decision. Because the Clans aren't ''complete'' idiots, however, they built the system so that the odds you face is equal to the degree by which you were found guilty: A "he said, she said" situation DecidedByOneVote boils down to a 1 vs 1 duel between accuser and defender. A 16-person council finding one side unanimously guilty, meanwhile, means 17-to-1 odds as the defendant has to put down the prosecutor ''and'' everyone else who agreed with them.

** ''Film/TheLastJedi'': Kylo Ren and General Hux are arguing about who gets to be Supreme Leader of the First Order with [[spoiler:Snoke dead]]. By which we mean, Kylo Ren says he's Supreme Leader, Hux starts to argue about it, and Ren gives him a ForceChoke to shut him up. ([[StealthPun Which makes this]] Appeal to the Force...)

* ''Series/GameOfThrones'':
** A recurring theme. Aegon the Conqueror didn't seize the kingdoms because he had any claim or right, he seized them because he could. Power may come from knowledge, the gods, or be derived from the law, but ultimately a swordsman decides whether the king, the priest or the rich man live or die.
--->'''Lord Tywin:''' You really think a crown gives you power?\\

** Renly decides to make a claim for the throne based on right of conquest like his big brother Robert. By law, his claim is weaker than Stannis', but Renly's charisma provides him with a bigger support, which in turn is used to press said claim.
--->'''Renly:''' Look across those fields, brother. Can you see all those banners?\\

** {{Defied}} by Tommen when he balks at hacking his way through the Faith Militant just to talk to the High Sparrow.
** Ramsay Bolton casually stabs his father Roose to death mid-conversation, then tells the House maester to announce that Roose was "killed by our enemies".
--->'''Maester:''' ''(hesitates)''\\

-->'''Sharkov:''' [[SilenceYouFool Silence]]! [[WhoDares How dare you]]! I carry a sacred office, and I demand that you apologise for your rudeness!\\

Most of the modern world is built on the principles that justice is blind and that no man is above the law. Thing is, much as those principles are great, they rely on someone being willing and able to enforce the law. This trope is what happens when there's nobody who can or will.