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** Somewhat before they made ''First Contact,'' the Okudas used 2030 as the date for his birth in ''The Star Trek Chronology,'' working backwards from the dates given in "Metamorphosis." Later sources kept that date even though it doesn't really fit with Cromwell's casting. Interestingly, the Okudas also given the first contact with another alien species (not yet specified) as happening in 2061, when the movie made it 2063.
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Apparently some chronologies put him as being born in the early 2030s when this film takes place in 2063, although the novelization has him born in 2013. It's quite clear Cochrane in the movie has the appearance of an older man, and James Cromwell will have been in his mid-50s at the time of production, clearly not a man who would appear to our eyes as being in his early 30s as we are led to expect by some sources. One could imagine that the effects of radiation from a post-nuclear-war scenario, Cochrane's alcoholism and other realities of postwar life might have aged the man beyond his years, but really, how plausible is it?
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* Apparently some chronologies put him as being born in the early 2030s when this film takes place in 2063, although the novelization has him born in 2013. It's quite clear Cochrane in the movie has the appearance of an older man, and James Cromwell will have been in his mid-50s at the time of production, clearly not a man who would appear to our eyes as being in his early 30s as we are led to expect by some sources. One could imagine that the effects of radiation from a post-nuclear-war scenario, Cochrane's alcoholism and other realities of postwar life might have aged the man beyond his years, but really, how plausible is it?
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[[/folder]]
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[[folder: Just how old is Zefram Cochrane?]]
Apparently some chronologies put him as being born in the early 2030s when this film takes place in 2063, although the novelization has him born in 2013. It's quite clear Cochrane in the movie has the appearance of an older man, and James Cromwell will have been in his mid-50s at the time of production, clearly not a man who would appear to our eyes as being in his early 30s as we are led to expect by some sources. One could imagine that the effects of radiation from a post-nuclear-war scenario, Cochrane's alcoholism and other realities of postwar life might have aged the man beyond his years, but really, how plausible is it?
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*** I'd hardly say that the Queen's existence was 'no special secret'; every reference to the Queen after this film occurred in ''Voyager'', when they would have either had access to the Hansens' records (which likely included the Hansens finding at least something about the Queen's existence before they were assimilated themselves), or just witnessed her in "Dark Frontier", decided not to question her status as a Borg of authority in the middle of a crisis, and asked Seven about her afterwards.
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*** True, but it's interesting that none of these potential sources seemed to know of the Queen, whose existence later seems like no special secret. Such is what comes of recons, I guess. On that point, it's kind off odd that told that the Hansens knew of the Borg at least in rumour much earlier, yet these rumours never reached Picard and co. Shrug. I don't think the Hansens got any info the Federation, though, since ''Voyager'' initially has no more info on them than that they disappeared.
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*** True, but it's interesting that none of these potential sources seemed to know of the Queen, whose existence later seems like no special secret. Such is what comes of recons, I guess. On that point, it's kind off of odd that told that the Hansens knew of the Borg at least in rumour much earlier, yet these rumours never reached Picard and co. Shrug. I don't think the Hansens got any info to the Federation, though, since ''Voyager'' initially has no more info on them than that they disappeared.
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*** True, but it's interesting that none of these potential sources seemed to know of the Queen, whose existence later seems like no special secret. Such is what comes of recons, I guess. On that point, it's kind off odd that told that the Hansens knew of the Borg at least in rumour much earlier, yet these rumours never reached Picard and co. Shrug. I don't think the Hansens got any info the Federation, though, since ''Voyager'' initially has no more info on them than that they disappeared.
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* At one point Dr. Crusher states that "in the twenty-first century the Borg are still in the Delta Quadrant." This is the first time it is established in dialogue that the Borg hail from the DQ, though it's been a behind-the-scenes detail for several years (an Okudagram in "Descent" says as much, as mentioned in ''The Star Trek: TNG Companion.'' It's a minor thing but I always wondered just how Starfleet came to know this, and enough about the Borg's history to know where they would have been limited to a few centuries back.
** I think you could make the argument that we've seen the Federation has had several opportunities to glean intelligence about the Borg at that point--probably including enough to construct a rough partial history. Who knows what Picard learned through his two-way connection with the Borg hive mind, or what they managed to learn from Hugh. There were also a number of El-Aurian refugees who could very well have had local knowledge about the spread of the Collective. Data spent several days with a number of liberated Borg drones, and may well have learned quite a bit about the Collective and its history. And don't forget the Hansons, and whatever research they managed to deliver back to the Federation before they were assimilated.
** I think you could make the argument that we've seen the Federation has had several opportunities to glean intelligence about the Borg at that point--probably including enough to construct a rough partial history. Who knows what Picard learned through his two-way connection with the Borg hive mind, or what they managed to learn from Hugh. There were also a number of El-Aurian refugees who could very well have had local knowledge about the spread of the Collective. Data spent several days with a number of liberated Borg drones, and may well have learned quite a bit about the Collective and its history. And don't forget the Hansons, and whatever research they managed to deliver back to the Federation before they were assimilated.
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* At one point Dr. Crusher states that "in the twenty-first century the Borg are still in the Delta Quadrant." This is the first time it is established in dialogue that the Borg hail from the DQ, though it's been a behind-the-scenes detail for several years (an Okudagram in "Descent" says as much, as mentioned in ''The Star Trek: TNG Companion.Companion).'' It's a minor thing but I always wondered just how Starfleet came to know this, and enough about the Borg's history to know where they would have been limited to a few centuries back.
** I think you could make the argument that we've seen the Federation has had several opportunities to glean intelligence about the Borg at that point--probably including enough to construct a rough partial history. Who knows what Picard learned through his two-way connection with the Borg hive mind, or what they managed to learn from Hugh. There were also a number of El-Aurian refugees who could very well have had local knowledge about the spread of the Collective. Data spent several days with a number of liberated Borg drones, and may well have learned quite a bit about the Collective and its history. And don't forget theHansons, Hansens, and whatever research they managed to deliver back to the Federation before they were assimilated.
** I think you could make the argument that we've seen the Federation has had several opportunities to glean intelligence about the Borg at that point--probably including enough to construct a rough partial history. Who knows what Picard learned through his two-way connection with the Borg hive mind, or what they managed to learn from Hugh. There were also a number of El-Aurian refugees who could very well have had local knowledge about the spread of the Collective. Data spent several days with a number of liberated Borg drones, and may well have learned quite a bit about the Collective and its history. And don't forget the
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** I think you could make the argument that we've seen the Federation has had several opportunities to glean intelligence about the Borg at that point--probably including enough together a rough partial history. Who knows what Picard learned through his two-way connection with the Borg hive mind, or what they managed to learn from Hugh. There were also a number of El-Aurian refugees who could very well have had local knowledge about the spread of the Collective. Data spent several days with a number of liberated Borg drones, and may well have learned quite a bit about the Collective and its history. And don't forget the Hansons, and whatever research they managed to deliver back to the Federation before they were assimilated.
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** I think you could make the argument that we've seen the Federation has had several opportunities to glean intelligence about the Borg at that point--probably including enough together to construct a rough partial history. Who knows what Picard learned through his two-way connection with the Borg hive mind, or what they managed to learn from Hugh. There were also a number of El-Aurian refugees who could very well have had local knowledge about the spread of the Collective. Data spent several days with a number of liberated Borg drones, and may well have learned quite a bit about the Collective and its history. And don't forget the Hansons, and whatever research they managed to deliver back to the Federation before they were assimilated.
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** I think you could make the argument that we've seen the Federation has had several opportunities to gleen intelligence about the Borg at that point--probably including enough together a rough partial history. Who knows what Picard learned through his two-way connection with the Borg hive mind, or what they managed to learn from Hugh. There were also a number of El-Aurian refugees who could very well have had local knowledge about the spread of the Collective. Data spent several days with a number of liberated Borg drones, and may well have learned quite a bit about the Collective and its history. And don't forget the Hansons, and whatever research they managed to deliver back to the Federation before they were assimilated.
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** I think you could make the argument that we've seen the Federation has had several opportunities to gleen glean intelligence about the Borg at that point--probably including enough together a rough partial history. Who knows what Picard learned through his two-way connection with the Borg hive mind, or what they managed to learn from Hugh. There were also a number of El-Aurian refugees who could very well have had local knowledge about the spread of the Collective. Data spent several days with a number of liberated Borg drones, and may well have learned quite a bit about the Collective and its history. And don't forget the Hansons, and whatever research they managed to deliver back to the Federation before they were assimilated.
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** I think you could make the argument that we've seen the Federation has had several opportunities to gleen intelligence about the Borg at that point--probably including enough together a rough partial history. Who knows what Picard learned through his two-way connection with the Borg hive mind, or what they managed to learn from Hugh. There were also a number of El-Aurian refugees who could very well have had local knowledge about the spread of the Collective. Data spent several days with a number of liberated Borg drones, and may well have learned quite a bit about the Collective and its history. And don't forget the Hansons, and whatever research they managed to deliver back to the Federation before they were assimilated.
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[[folder: Have they found somebody's History of the Borg book or something?]]
* At one point Dr. Crusher states that "in the twenty-first century the Borg are still in the Delta Quadrant." This is the first time it is established in dialogue that the Borg hail from the DQ, though it's been a behind-the-scenes detail for several years (an Okudagram in "Descent" says as much, as mentioned in ''The Star Trek: TNG Companion.'' It's a minor thing but I always wondered just how Starfleet came to know this, and enough about the Borg's history to know where they would have been limited to a few centuries back.
[[folder: Have they found somebody's History of the Borg book or something?]]
* At one point Dr. Crusher states that "in the twenty-first century the Borg are still in the Delta Quadrant." This is the first time it is established in dialogue that the Borg hail from the DQ, though it's been a behind-the-scenes detail for several years (an Okudagram in "Descent" says as much, as mentioned in ''The Star Trek: TNG Companion.'' It's a minor thing but I always wondered just how Starfleet came to know this, and enough about the Borg's history to know where they would have been limited to a few centuries back.
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** Not to mention, Data can't be assimilated. That may or may not factor into Picard's decision making, but it does make Data's situation fundementally different than any other crew member.
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*** It's more likely the medical explanation. As has been mentioned, un-assimilated drones usually regain past memories (Hugh was an exception for whatever reason), even if their personalities are changed by the experience. But with both Picard and Seven, it took a substantial amount of medical effort to remove the Borg components from them (they were in fact unable to fully remove Seven's). To do that for ''each'' of the assimilated crewmembers would be an immense task, not to mention they don't even have a functioning sickbay and they're in the middle of a battle. Not to mention the challenge of keeping those drones contained in the meantime.
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*** Riker was also ready to ram the Borg in "The Best Of Both Worlds". It doesn't mean he doesn't value the ship, but he recognizes that they're on the verge of being destroyed anyway, and/or that ramming the Borg may be the only way to hurt them. Especially since it's [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy Worf]]; if he's going to die anyway, he would [[TakingYouWithMe try to take the Borg with him]] - [[DefiantToTheEnd Defiant to the end]] ([[MeaningfulName rather fitting]]). Once that danger has passed, he asks after the ship because its destruction is no longer imminent.
*** Also consider that it's the only substantial ship Deep Space Nine had, and they're on the front lines of the whole ''other'' mess that's brewing with the Dominion. From a purely tactical point of view, Worf would ''not'' want to see them lose that.
*** Also consider that it's the only substantial ship Deep Space Nine had, and they're on the front lines of the whole ''other'' mess that's brewing with the Dominion. From a purely tactical point of view, Worf would ''not'' want to see them lose that.
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*** Riker was also ready to ram the Borg in "The Best Of Both Worlds". It doesn't mean he doesn't value the ship, but he recognizes that they're on the verge of being destroyed anyway, and/or that ramming the Borg may be the only way to hurt them. Especially since it's [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy Worf]]; if he's going to die anyway, he would [[TakingYouWithMe try to take the Borg as many of them with him]] - as he possibly could -- [[DefiantToTheEnd Defiant to the end]] ([[MeaningfulName rather fitting]]). Once that danger has passed, he asks after the ship because its destruction is no longer imminent.
*** **** Also consider that it's the only substantial ship Deep Space Nine had, and they're on the front lines of the whole ''other'' mess that's brewing with the Dominion. From a purely tactical point of view, Worf would ''not'' want to see them lose that. It's one thing if they're going to lose it no matter what, it's another when saving the ship becomes a realistic possibility.
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*** Riker was also ready to ram the Borg in "The Best Of Both Worlds". It doesn't mean he doesn't value the ship, but he recognizes that they're on the verge of being destroyed anyway, and/or that ramming the Borg may be the only way to hurt them. Especially since it's [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy Worf]]; if he's going to die anyway, he would [[TakingYouWithMe try to take the Borg with him]] - [[DefiantToTheEnd Defiant to the end]]. [[MeaningfulName indeed]]. Once that danger has passed, he asks after the ship because its destruction is no longer imminent.
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*** Riker was also ready to ram the Borg in "The Best Of Both Worlds". It doesn't mean he doesn't value the ship, but he recognizes that they're on the verge of being destroyed anyway, and/or that ramming the Borg may be the only way to hurt them. Especially since it's [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy Worf]]; if he's going to die anyway, he would [[TakingYouWithMe try to take the Borg with him]] - [[DefiantToTheEnd Defiant to the end]]. [[MeaningfulName indeed]].end]] ([[MeaningfulName rather fitting]]). Once that danger has passed, he asks after the ship because its destruction is no longer imminent.
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*** Why should he be bothered to ram it into the Borg cube? The end goal and priority is to destroy the cube by any means necessary. If nothing else so much as scratches them and the ship's systems are failing to the point of potentially leaving them adrift (which does happen but thankfully the Enterprise appears), why wouldn't he use the last resources he has to try and affect the cube in some way? [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy Worf]] would not stand adrift to be shot into oblivion, he would [[TakingYouWithMe try to take the Borg with him]] - [[DefiantToTheEnd Defiant to the end]], [[MeaningfulName indeed]].
*** Also, the last time we see the Defiant is when the Enterprise-E covers it from weapons fire. The Defiant was very close the Cube at that point. Then Picard has the Defiant evacuated, so clearly no one is flying it around any more and its said to be adrift. The a few minutes later the Cube explodes... so apparently the drifting Defiant wasn't close enough to get caught in that explosion, when we clearly see at least one Starfleet ship graze the edge of that explosion and be instantly destroyed. Tough little ship indeed.
*** Also, the last time we see the Defiant is when the Enterprise-E covers it from weapons fire. The Defiant was very close the Cube at that point. Then Picard has the Defiant evacuated, so clearly no one is flying it around any more and its said to be adrift. The a few minutes later the Cube explodes... so apparently the drifting Defiant wasn't close enough to get caught in that explosion, when we clearly see at least one Starfleet ship graze the edge of that explosion and be instantly destroyed. Tough little ship indeed.
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*** Why should he be bothered Riker was also ready to ram it into the Borg cube? The end goal and priority is to destroy in "The Best Of Both Worlds". It doesn't mean he doesn't value the cube by any means necessary. If nothing else so much as scratches them and ship, but he recognizes that they're on the ship's systems are failing to verge of being destroyed anyway, and/or that ramming the point of potentially leaving them adrift (which does happen but thankfully Borg may be the Enterprise appears), why wouldn't he use the last resources he has only way to try and affect the cube in some way? hurt them. Especially since it's [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy Worf]] would not stand adrift Worf]]; if he's going to be shot into oblivion, die anyway, he would [[TakingYouWithMe try to take the Borg with him]] - [[DefiantToTheEnd Defiant to the end]], end]]. [[MeaningfulName indeed]].
***indeed]]. Once that danger has passed, he asks after the ship because its destruction is no longer imminent.
**** Also consider that it's the only substantial ship Deep Space Nine had, and they're on the front lines of the whole ''other'' mess that's brewing with the Dominion. From a purely tactical point of view, Worf would ''not'' want to see them lose that.
%%*** Also, the last time we see the Defiant is when the Enterprise-E covers it from weapons fire. The Defiant was very close the Cube at that point. Then Picard has the Defiant evacuated, so clearly no one is flying it around any more and its said to be adrift. The a few minutes later the Cube explodes... so apparently the drifting Defiant wasn't close enough to get caught in that explosion, when we clearly see at least one Starfleet ship graze the edge of that explosion and be instantly destroyed. Tough little ship indeed.
***
**** Also consider that it's the only substantial ship Deep Space Nine had, and they're on the front lines of the whole ''other'' mess that's brewing with the Dominion. From a purely tactical point of view, Worf would ''not'' want to see them lose that.
%%*** Also, the last time we see the Defiant is when the Enterprise-E covers it from weapons fire. The Defiant was very close the Cube at that point. Then Picard has the Defiant evacuated, so clearly no one is flying it around any more and its said to be adrift. The a few minutes later the Cube explodes... so apparently the drifting Defiant wasn't close enough to get caught in that explosion, when we clearly see at least one Starfleet ship graze the edge of that explosion and be instantly destroyed. Tough little ship indeed.
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*** And in "Time's Arrow," he passes as a human, just a slightly odd-looking one.
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** In the first place they didn't really intend to interact with the locals, and probably thought that his skills outweighed any potential challenges his appearance might pose. This was a rushed situation, after all.
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** They might have just planned to say he was [[CallBack South American]].
** Seriously, however, they probably figured that a) given the assault on the launch site, with all the debris, his android strength would be useful in preserving lives that, historically, hadn't been lost by getting the people out that much faster, not to mention attending to any necessary repairs and that b) there wasn't time to alter his skin pigment if they wanted to preserve the most lives. If nothing else, they had the capability of wiping short term memories or that the impact would be minuscule in the grand scheme, in comparison to a Borg invasion of Earth in the mid-21st century, on the cusp of First Contact.
** Seriously, however, they probably figured that a) given the assault on the launch site, with all the debris, his android strength would be useful in preserving lives that, historically, hadn't been lost by getting the people out that much faster, not to mention attending to any necessary repairs and that b) there wasn't time to alter his skin pigment if they wanted to preserve the most lives. If nothing else, they had the capability of wiping short term memories or that the impact would be minuscule in the grand scheme, in comparison to a Borg invasion of Earth in the mid-21st century, on the cusp of First Contact.
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** Data's appearance is a liability, yes, but he also has perfect recall of all the historical records available to the crew on the 21st century, which could make his assistance invaluable in making sure significant historical events are not changed.
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[[folder: Why was Data on the away team to 21st century Earth?]]
* Why was Data on the away team to earth in the 21st century? If you're trying to blend in and not change history by mistake, isn't bringing an obvious non-human android with you a very bad idea?
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* Why was Data on the away team to earth in the 21st century? If you're trying to blend in and not change history by mistake, isn't bringing an obvious non-human android with you a very bad idea?
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***They suffered VillainDecay the more the writers tried to make them more relatable. They were scary as a force of nature. Having a Bond villian leader and societies and feelings makes them another alien of the week.
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****The Borg don't seem to invent much. It might have been mentioned in canon, but I recall a conversation that stated they pretty much only consume. If more advanced tech isn't available in the past, giving themselves the extra time isn't going to change anything. They have to wait for somebody to invent something, and then steal it.
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*** Except Arabic historians didn't have advanced sensors, electronic recordkeeping, or a physican who directly and thuroughly examined a living Viking captured at Seville to compare to the Viking merchants they were encountering. It's apples and oranges.
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*** Also, the assumption that someone on Enterprise-D at the time of ''Q Who?'' would not only know about the events of ''Regeneration'' but also have made the connection with the Borg is a pretty big one. For a point of comparison, Arabic historians didn't make the link between the Vikings who attacked Seville in 844 with the Viking merchants they had encountered in Eastern Europe since the 920s until the middle of the 11th century, and in that case there was continuous contact going on, unlike with Starfleet and the Borg.
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** Within about an hour or two of their arrival, the Enterprise crew realize the ship is infested with Borg. If they'd gone to the Vulcans - to say nothing of anyone further out - they'd risk unleashing the Borg on an unsuspecting mid-21st century. Imagine what would happen to the timeline if even a single drone had managed to get onto the Vulcan ship and escape notice. By staying in Earth orbit and not contacting the Vulcans, not only are the Enterprise crew minimizing their personal impact on the timeline, they're also minimizing the risk of the Borg getting the chance to assimilate the Alpha Quadrant in 2063.
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'Engines of Destiny' wasn't part of the Shatnerverse
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** One of the expanded universe novels (''Engines of Destiny'') actually had this as the point-of-divergence between the usual and mirror universes.
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** One of the expanded universe novels (''Engines of Destiny'') actually had this as the point-of-divergence between the usual and mirror universes.
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* Why didn't the Borg go back in time, send the message, and ''then'' fly to earth? The Federation would be unmade without ever knowing what hit them ...
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* Why didn't the Borg go back in time, send the message, and ''then'' fly to earth? Earth? The Federation would be unmade without ever knowing what hit them ...
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** The novel ''Engines of Destiny'' offers a potential justification for this; in an alternate timeline where Picard wasn't present at the Battle of Sector 001 in the film (either he died stopping Soren or the entire ''Enterprise'' crew were killed; it's never specified), the Borg cube suffered heavy casualties when Starfleet put up a better fight than expected and was just intending to go back a few days to warn itself, but when it overshot, it decided to make the best of its situation.
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*** Probably because most officers would consider that a career-ending humiliation. Sending him off to patrol the Neutral Zone at least maintains the facade of having him do something useful. If Starfleet wants to retain Picard, their best bet is to afford him at least a modicum of dignity.
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*** In a really cool bit of continuity, Data isolates the computer with a "Fractal Encryption Code." In the series, it's revealed that the Borg can't process fractals.
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** The more reasonable question is... Why not just relieve Picard from command and have Riker take command of the Enterprise, at most using Picard as an adviser, maybe even suspend his access codes to prevent him from being a wild card or something? The Best of Both Worlds had Riker in command of the Enterprise after Picard's assimilation, and he's part of the reason there's still a Starfleet in First Contact to face the Borg.
