This is discussion archived from a time before the current discussion method was installed.
: Cutting out the Conversation in the Main Page
- The illegality stems from the fact that the half-ogre in the above example gets two attacks of opportunity...when the rules state that movement (no matter how great) doesn't incur more than one.
- You sure? By my understanding, you might be referring the the rule that states that you can't take more than one attack of opportunity per provoking circumstance. The rules say that one provokes an AoO when moving out of a threatened square. Since Roy had to move out of several in a row, he would provoke more than one for his movement. I'm willing to concede my point, though, if you provide an appropriate rules referrence.
: "Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more than one opportunity for that opponent." Second to last sentence of the relevant section of the SRD: [1
: Should we cut the OOTS quote? We already have three and it doesn't really add anything. Having an example is enough.
: Agreed, especially since we already have that specific strip linked in
the first example:
: All I have to do is keep moving back every time it's my turn. Attack of Opportunity! Attack of Opportunity! Roy
: Well, I have to admire your mastery of the reach rules, but don't you think it's unwise to continually use the same tactic, round after round? Shouldn't you vary your attacks? Half-Ogre
: Why bother? This combo is perfect, I'm telling you. As long as I move back 15 feet every— [falls down a cliff]
— Order Of The Stick #216
: Throwing it back on the quotes wiki, because, eh, why not.
: Snipping mcdoom's addition of
- No-one's mentioned the card game of the same name? It parodies Dungeons and Dragons stereotypes (with expansions for other genres such as martial arts and IN SPACE) and actively encouages comical rule lawyering, the standard method for conflict resoultion in the official rules being to 'roll a die, then have a loud argument'.
because he apparently didn't read the article far enough to notice that the fourth paragraph is entirely about the game.
: cut this out:
- The depicted tactic certainly is a bit off. The rules explicitly states you can't make multiple attacks of opportunity against the same opponent the same round for the same action, even with the feat mentioned. Also, has anyone noticed Roy never gets to attack? There is nothing in the enemy's build tactic that would accomplish that.
- Wouldn't he have to make a Concentration check to continue his action after taking damage, just like spellcasting? Roy might have a decent Constitution, but there's no way he would ever, ever, put cross-class ranks into Concentration
- No. If an action wouldn't provoke an Attack of Opportunity, it doesn't require a Concentration check to keep doing it.
- ...Except that it (it being moving through a threatened square) does trigger an attack of opportunity, which is the entire base of the half-orc's strategy.
- Concentration checks don't happen for movement. The base of the half-ogre's strategy is killing an enemy via attack spam by continuing to force melee opponents to move often enough to cause attacks of opportunity over and over and over again. The only things that Concentration occurs for in core is spellcasting and prolonged skill use. Assuming proper memory, that is.
The Concentration skill is not used in melee, and we don't see Roy hitting the half-ogre because the emphasis is on the half-ogre's broken and unfeasible build. Granted we don't see Roy doing any damage, but Roy's ability with the Greatclub is fairly crummy (even though the different in attacks is likely 2-3 at most from Weapon Focus, Greater Weapon Focus, and maybe Masterwork), so he's probably missing.
Wyvernil: Now that the other Player Archetypes
are complete, I'd like to revise this trope a bit to consolidate some of the information and bring it in line with the others. See the YKTTW
"Munchkin Rewrite" for a basic idea of what I mean. What do you think?
: Cut this out, and then burned the stump
so it won't regenerate, damnit.
and Roy only takes it because he is not sufficiently proficient with the Attacks of Opportunity rules to call the half-ogre out on it (Roy admits he only got a C- in that course). In the 3.5 rules, you cannot provoke more than one attack of opportunity for moving over a threatened area, which is the only thing Roy does to provoke the attacks.
- Only because the Half-Ogre didnt' have the Int score to use the technique properly. What a chain-monkey is supposed to do is trip the person when they move, allowing them to hit him when he's down. Then when he gets up, hit him again, when he moves, trip him again. So on and so forth. This troper may have just had one as a player in his game once =). I love the smell of Improved Sunder in the morning, smells like.. victory...
- More precisely, you trip them. When they get up, you disarm them. When they pick up their weapon, you trip them. On your turn, you puree them. Also, Sundering is just shredding your own loot.
- Also, you play a Thri-keen. So you can dual-wield spiked chains, using one to trip and the other to shred. Add psychic warrior levels to it for the Expansion power (doubles reach of the spiked chains, plus size bonuses to trip) and the Psionic Lion's Charge power (full attack on a charge). Then, take the Shock Trooper feat and start laying about you with 20-foot reach trippings and a lot of follow-up damage and... I'll stop now.
- This troper is glad that he enjoys playing monks making that tactic pretty damn useless. He has also just learned what a twinking munchkin bastard he is.
- You don't need tactics to beat monks, as the monk is the weakest class in the game by far.
- NOTHING can give you extra attacks on an Attack of Opportunity. They provoke, you get ONE attack action, two/multi weapon fighting doesn't apply. Remember, Two Weapon Fighting only ever gives you an extra attack when you spend a Full Attack Action.
- There is at least one feat that does just that.
- As said in the comic, it is Combat Reflexes. Gives you an extra Ao O per point of dex bonus. So if you had 15 dex, you'd get 3 Ao Os. Page 92 in the 3.5 book, 83 in 3.0.