I feel like Contested Sequel and Too Bleak, Stopped Caring are seriously shoehorned in here. Especially since general consensus seems to be that the movie is, if anything, a Surprisingly Improved Sequel to Spectre especially given the infamous Troubled Production this movie had. It's definitely rated higher than its immediate predecessor. I suppose it could be argued that it is a contested sequel to Skyfall, but I legitimately am not sure if you can skip sequels for Contested Sequel.
Too Bleak, Stopped Caring is a more straightforward shoehorning. In terms of audience reaction, well, people cared. The movie managed to have the third highest box office of a Bond movie despite being a pandemic release.
- From that page's note to editors: This trope frequently gets misused for any work that is dark, angsty, or depressing. That is just Complaining About Shows You Don't Like. It only applies when there is no meaningful conflict because everyone is awful and the world sucks, and therefore there are no stakes for the audience. If people enjoy the work despite its tone, this trope does not apply.
Now, I have no horse in this race because I haven't seen the movie but these entries seem to fly in the face of general consensus that I've been hearing.
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Well I have seen the movie myself, but either way, I agree with your reasoning. These entries feel shoehorned. I could kinda see a case for Contested Sequel perhaps, but Too Bleak, Stopped Caring especially feels like a stretch. It seems like a big part of the reason it was added is because Bond dies at the end. Which hasn't happened before in a Bond movie, true, but The Hero Dies is certainly not an unheard of trope in itself. And the entry itself even links to Heroic Sacrifice, indicating that Bond did not die for nothing, as now his wife and daughter get to live a life of peace, and Bond's surviving allies all have (somewhat) happy endings as well. The film would need more grimness than that to qualify for the trope, I feel.
You should also remember that the previous movie had a happy ending, with Bond getting the girl and defeating Blofeld, and that this one overrides it. That’s why I added it there.
Edited by Saberwulf2018
That doesn't address any of the arguments that it's misuse.
No one in the James Bond thread
thought it applied either.
Regrading the captain obvious reveal of when Madeleine tells Bond that Mathilde is not his daughter. I think there is a case to he made that that statement is not meant to be taken literally.
Madeleine is not saying that Mathilde isn’t his literal biographical daughter, what she’s saying is that by abandoning her before she was born and contributing absolutely nothing to raising her, James had no right to call himself her father.
That’s why Madeleine said that she wasn’t his, despite all the obvious evidence to the contrary. And it’s only at the end of the film, after James Bond rescues her and sacrifices himself to save them that he finally proves himself worthy to be her father, hence that’s when she acknowledges his parentage.
So yeah, it’s not a “you are not her father,” it’s more of a “you don’t know anything about her, how dare you call yourself her father.” Also let’s not forget that Bond abandoned her with his child for 5 years, there’s some justified spite to her words too
Pulled to discuss.
- Contested Sequel: Critical and public opinions on the movie have ranged from "it's excellent", "it's good, but the ending. . .", to "it sucks/worst Bond movie ever". Ironically, all three opinions are based on the main elements of the film—the stunning conclusion in which Bond is killed, as well as him NOT bedding every woman he meets and having fathered a child.
- Too Bleak, Stopped Caring: One of the main reasons behind the movie's Contested Sequel status. The last movie ended on a positive note with Spectre and Blofeld defeated and Bond quitting MI6 to live a peaceful life with Madeleine. But here, not only do the two part ways due to a misunderstanding caused by Blofeld, but by the end of the movie, not only is Bond's best friend Felix Leiter dead, Bond later sacrifices himself for Madeleine and Matilde due to him being poisoned by Safin.
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