A Song Of Ice And Fire

I reckon Jaime, and the "hands" (which can't be his own for obvious reason) are going to be the chain that killed Shae, meaning (probably) that he's going to be Hand of the King at the time.

Well I just finished A Storm of Swords. That was certainly a shocking ending. I can't imagine what the wait for AFFC was like.

So now I'm starting the fourth book. Tell me, is it really as bad as people say?

If I had to choose between calling it "good" or "bad," I'd choose good without a doubt. Unfortunately, things aren't that simple. It's flawed and a step down, yes.

I MUST AGAIN MENTION HOW AMAZING SANSA'S FINAL CHAPTER IS.

Just in case you guys haven't heard.

And yeah, AFFC is a step down, but I still love it.

edited 13th Oct '12 2:54:41 PM by Chrisham2

I'm kinda annoyed that Sansa's not in Dance. She's my favourite POV character.

No, that's not true; it's Jaime. Second favourite, then.

Well how much of a step down is it? Three was the best book in the series so far so if it's only a slight step down it will still be a worthy successor.

That was probably one of the most intense chapters in the book. For a second I thought Lysa would actually kill Sansa. I know that might seem kind of silly but Robb and Catelyn already died (sort of) and I thought Arya was dead at one point so Sansa dieing wouldn't have been entirely unexpected.

edited 13th Oct '12 3:01:24 PM by Kostya

AFFC isn't really bad; it's just something that would be extremely frustrating if you were waiting five years for it and then had to wait another five for the next book, because it pretty much leaves out the main characters (aside from a couple chapters each for Arya and Sansa), and the plot drags. There's some interesting characterization, though, and a few great moments.

Well I'm going to start it a few days after the third so I guess I don't have to worry about that. I'll probably be annoyed by the lack of Tyrion, Dany, and Bran but I can live with that since I'll have ADWD soon.

Aheh... Yeeeaaah.

Also Jon. Jon's not in Feast.

IIRC, Jon is in Feast very briefly- he's just not a POV character again until Dance.

Apparently Sam has a POV so Jon not being in won't be the worst thing in the world.

Heh... Tyrion and Dany...

Also, your annoyed list is missing a certain Davos. You should correct that.

I really, really liked AFFC - thought it was one of the best. A nice break from Bran and Dany chapters, and it's back to the political intrigue and backstabbing that first attracted me to the series.

I really didn't think Feast was that bad (although to be honest, I have trouble remembering which bits were in which books as I read them all in quick succession). Pacing problems, yes, and I blame that on the bizarre idea to split the two books geographically. Having said that, if like me you read them one after the other, you won't have that problem of having to wait ten years to find out what [insert at least three of your favourite characters here] are up to. I get the impression that annoyance is behind a lot of the Feast-hate.

I'm struggling to remember specific things I liked due to the aforementioned memory-plot-blurring. Is that the one with Sansa-as-reluctant-Bastard Understudy? That was good. And Sam's journey, Fan Disservice notwithstanding.

EDIT: It occurs to me that Sansa'd been playing Bastard Understudy for a long time before that. But it's to someone else, now, and it's a much more interesting relationship.

edited 13th Oct '12 9:23:03 PM by johnnye

Quite seperate from the issue of the favourites not showing up, Feast also the the problems of introducing the controversial minor POVs, and having every POV moving in completely disconnected spheres, which killed the pacing. We had Cersei theoretically tying it all together, but since she's completely unlikable and doesn't care about anything happening outside of KL, that didn't quite work. She'd be fine as just another one of our dozen POVs, but as the book's core…

Good points. It was very disconnected — to be honest, I don't see how it could not be, given the way plot threads diverge/constrict and the huge canvas the series is based on. It's not so much that there are too many PO Vs in too many places, it's that there had to be that many PO Vs in order to cover all the places the story was going to go.

But on the other hand, thanks for reminding me about Dorne, that was a highlight for me (even with its particular POV problems).

Oh, me too. I actually like the minor POVs and Dorne in particular, I was just repeating the complaints I've heard elsewhere.

I found the Dorne bits fairly boring. Loved the Sand Snakes, could do without everything else. Also, while I love Brienne as a character, her plot was going a whole lot of nowhere.

Alas poor Nimble Dick. He was one of the best parts of Feast, IMO.

...Who?

Yeah, Brienne goes on the list of "kicking around until their cue to do something interesting shows up".

edited 14th Oct '12 4:55:00 PM by johnnye

The guy who took Brienne to the Whispers then got his face crushed by Shagwell.

I don't expect to see him on Game Of Thrones. That part doesn't go anywhere, takes its sweet time, and the more-important fight could be transplanted elsewhere.

Septon Merribald on the other hand, I expect to see. His monologue on the pillaging hordes is the highlight of the novel.

edited 14th Oct '12 5:11:29 PM by Rotpar

I like Nimble Dick because he's a relatively pleasant fellow, has some interesting stories and gives Brienne the motivation to kill Shagwell.

Merribald is also great.

Personally, I found Brienne's chapters to be some of the best parts of Feast. Sure, we know that she's going in the absolute wrong direction, but she just meets the most interesting people. I also like Jaime's Feast chapters.

I don't consider AFFC/ADWD bad as much as suffering from middle act syndrome. Reading through them leaves you stuck in an unsatisfying place, but they'll pay off in the end. They do suffer a bit from being time-skip material, but I still found most of what happened well-written and engaging. There were no plot-ruining twists or developments, characters stayed in-character, and enough happened to keep them from being pointless.

Also, I had pretty much always assumed that Jaimie was going to be the one to off Cersei. His arc and her arc are like two trains speeding toward each other on the same track. She'll get her own kids killed with her failed attempts at regaining her power, and Jaimie will kill her for it.