Animu
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#21 argued that if the censorship is in visuals only, the TV Broadcast isn't that different from the Akogare version we have access to.
One-Track Mind (he/him)
The last episode of the anime (at least for now) has aired in Japan today. Now we can properly judge whether or not the anime should be troped.
I'm lovin' it. (My Troper Wall)
Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard
I'm not sure what to think of atm. I'm just going to wait until someone watches all the episodes, but I wouldn't mind keeping the manga.
Edited by Siegfried1337 on Mar 27th 2024 at 5:49:19 AM
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Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard
Bumping due to a lack of response.
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I watched all the way to when Lord gets defeated and the anime version doesn't seem to be too different from the Redo of Healer anime or manga that we did allow when censored (and I would argue Redo of Healer is even worse at it).
Also the underparts are never explicitly shown and the more explicit acts are still covered by a discretion shot. The most are nipples being shown out in the open.
Edited by Mr-ex777 on Apr 1st 2024 at 8:24:49 PM
Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard
Well, assuming we start judging from when the anime has ended, here's all the votes so far:
Abstain: Siegfried1337
Keep Everything: Mr-ex777
Unless I see more responses within the next 24 hours, we might have to close down due to an lack of a majority consensus, even if we were to count the votes before all 13 episodes aired.
Edited by Siegfried1337 on Apr 11th 2024 at 5:36:00 AM
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the Retromancer
Close down on what? We are not in a hurry, I'd rather get consensus even if it takes a while, like it has always been.
For the record, I personally will be leaning still on manga-only for now, but because I've yet to look at how much censoring is censored. To me the entire premise is already a problem, so I'll be going with skepticism that Lens Flare Censor would be helping much when the new scenes could have simply not be included.
e after trying to look up the epiosdes: Unless there's some censored-censored version I can't find, I don't think I'd be okay with the graphic sex scene at Episode 10 with 14yos, which deviates what the punishment was in the manga.
Edited by Amonimus on Apr 4th 2024 at 9:46:43 PM
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard
Bumping due to a lack of response.
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This one I have a hard time putting in either box. I am currently leaning towards 'keep'. The one obviously childish character is not involved in any of the sexual shenanigans if our page is right. Seems like a show trying to actively avoid pedo-pandering vibes, even if the nominal ages of the other more... statured... magical girls are on the low end.
Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard
Hm. Will be switching to keep both since I don't really see a solid argument for keeping only the manga (since the last argument made against the anime was when it was still airing)
Edited by Siegfried1337 on Apr 10th 2024 at 10:37:43 AM
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Shouldn't the fact that the characters are placed in very raunchy situations when they're only 14 cross a line or several?
Wasn't 16 the minimum age TV Tropes decided was OK to show lewd stuff?
Edited by Arawn999 on Apr 14th 2024 at 2:59:47 AM
autistic aro opal gemstone
❀ Mint, Nuts, and Waffle ❀
No, that's only for fanfic recs, since TV Tropes has higher standards for recommendations. For non-fanfic recs, according to the Content Policy page, generally (but not always) no fetishized or overly explicit sex involving children (which I think implies characters under 18), and no fetishized implied sex involving preteens or younger (implies characters under 13).
Edited by callmeamuffin on Apr 16th 2024 at 5:45:09 AM
Come play Character Uplift Game!
There isn't a specific rule for this forum (FFR excepted). We look at the work as a whole; do we think it's pedobait? Sometimes one page in the work can be so squicky that we say it is, other times it's a general feeling based on the whole, sometimes we take an entire month of arguing and only come to a consensus out of exhaustion. Whether the sex is offscreen or onscreen is a factor but not necessarily deciding (as are cases where physical, mental and chronological age are not aligned - generally we go by looks but, again, that's not a hard rule).
I noticed nobody did a check of the manga, so...
- While the manga uses Barbie Doll Anatomy for nude scenes, for the most part (later chapters use Scenery Censor), the outlines of Magia Baiser (Utena Hiiragi)'s nipples and various girls' lady parts are still visible through their underwear.
- Chapter 1
- Venalita records Utena transforming into Magia Baiser and threatens to share the footage on social media unless she agrees to work for her
- Magia Baiser's uniform consists of X-shaped pasties, a corset, and low-rise pants
- Chapter 3
- Utena fantasizes about molesting the members of Tres Magia again, and is shown groping Magia Magenta (Haruka Hanabishi) while both are naked
- Magia Baiser gropes Magia Azul (Sayo Minakami) after blindfolding her, with the latter's nipples being visible through her clothing
- Chapter 4
- Utena is shown naked from behind with her butt exposed
- Magia Baiser covers Magia Sulfur (Kaoruko Tenkawa) — the youngest-looking of Tres Magia — in hot wax, rips her top off, and drips wax onto her (very small) chest; then summons a tentacle-monster and declares her intent to have it "teach [her] body a lot more"
- Chapter 5
- Leopard (Kiwi Araga)'s dark magical girl outfit consists of a vest and a skimpy low-rise thong
- Magia Baiser burns off Leopard's clothes with an electrical torture device made from a lightbulb
- Chapter 6
- Having been humiliated by Magia Baiser stripping her naked in public, Magia Magenta wears pasties and a bandage over her "precious spots", though her nipples are still visible through it
- Magia Baiser and Magia Magenta crashland in a suggestive pose, Magenta straddling Baiser's waist with Baiser's face in Magenta's chest
- Chapter 7
- Magia Baiser BDSM-ties Magia Azul, gropes her, and then slaps her breasts
- Chapter 9
- Nero Alice (Morino Korisu) — who's just 9 — brainwashes Tres Magia into... ahem... playing house, with Sulfur (the baby) sucking on Azul (the mother)'s breasts and Magenta (the father)'s hand dipping below Sulfur's waist and straddling her leg in a suggestive manner; with Sulfur's horrified reaction when Morino dozes off and the brainwashing ends suggesting it went further
- Chapter 10
- When Azul tries to get serious during a one-on-one rematch, Baiser stuffs a ball-gag in her mouth and forces her to ride a panda-shaped BDSM sawhorse until she orgasms
- Chapter 11
- When Utena catches a cold after repairing Morino's favourite dall, Morino "thanks" her by transforming into Nero Alice and using her powers to transform into a sexy nurse, get Utena to undress, and gives her some attention that isn't strictly medical
- Chapter 13
- Lord Enorme (who's later revealed to be 20) forces Loco Musica (Akoya Matama) — who's 14 — to strip naked as punishment for failing to defeat Leopard and Nero Alice, chokes her with her whip, suggestively sticks the handle of her whip in Loco Musica's mouth, and "[makes] sure [her] body understands" the price of failure
- Chapter 14
- Utena, Araga, and Morino are shown naked while transforming, with only stars covering the minimal amount of their bodies
- Leberblume (Anemo Nemo) gropes Magia Baiser after taking control of her body
- Chapter 15
- Magia Baiser blackmails Loco Musica into stripping and singing naked in front of Leopard and Nero Alice, which awakens an exhibitionist kink in her
- Chapter 16
- Infuriated by Loco Musica and Leberblume having seriously injured and/or killed several magical girls, Magia Baiser has Nero Alice lock them in her dollhouse until they (sexually) satisfy her—forcing them to make out (with saliva strands) and eventually have sex while she watches—showing Akoya sucking on Anemo's breast and both of them sporting ahegao
- Chapter 17
- Lord Enorme siccs slime monsters on Enormeeta that are... well... shown doing what slime monsters tend to do in hentai, with only Nero Alice being spared due to her giant rabbit protecting her
- Leopard's Super Mode has her naked save for black flames covering her nipples and crotch
- Chapter 20
- While imagining Lord Enorme as a (vaguely) teenage girl, Magia Baiser strips her naked, gropes her butt, and gives her a spanking
- Chapter 21
- While giving Magia Azul a massage, Utena suddenly forces her legs open and starts groping her butt and spreading her... lady parts, the outline of which are visible through her panties
- Chapter 22
- While singing karaoke with Anemo, Akoya takes her panties off and holds up her skirt—shown from behind
- When Loco Musica is knocked into Leberblume, they crash-land in a 69 position with the outline of Loco Musica's crotch being shown in silhouette
- Chapter 23
- Magia Baiser summons a giant octopus for standard ecchi tentacle monster shenanigans, including a gratuitous shots of it sticking its tentacles into everyone (except Alice's) swimsuits in a very rapey manner. Magenta and especially Sulfur get the worst of it.
- Chapter 24
- Azul's mental self gropes herself while getting hit by Magia Baiser's attacks
- Chapter 25
- Utena and Araga go to a love hotel and have sex, with some shots of their breasts touching, grinding, neck-biting, and breast-sucking
- Chapter 26
- Baiser cuts off Azul's panties and spreads her legs (and lady parts) for everyone to see, with the bare minimum of Scenery Censor in effect
- Nero Alice turns Magia Magenta into a baby, the hypnosis ending just as Nero Alice is changing her diaper (taking off her skirt and panties) after she wets herself (Nero Alice's head acting as a Scenery Censor)
- Chapter 27
- Leopard and Baiser fight, the former using her aforementioned Super Mode
- Baiser clamps electrical cables on Leopard's nipples, though Barbie Doll Anatomy is in effect
- Chapter 28
- Baiser has Nero Alice make a dungeon full of traps and drags Tres Magia inside as a "game"
- Baiser traps Azul in a wall, takes off her panties, and leaves her with her skirt flipped up
- Magenta ends up strapped into a chair with a paddlewheel rubbing her crotch—her lady parts being visible through her panties
- A puppet doppelganger of Magenta sticks its hands in Sulfur's shirt and gropes her while she's trying to hold up a ceiling trap
- Chapter 29
- Sulfur gives Azul a spanking to free her from the wall-trap
- When Loco Musica breaks the rules of Baiser's "game", Baiser summons tentacles to molest her
- Azul slides down a knotted rope-bridge with a starbust covering her crotch
- Sulfur kicks a knot right into Leopard's lady parts
- Panty-stealing lotion-wrestling
- Chapter 31
- Bathhouse skinship between Haruka and Kaoruko
- Chapter 32
- Araga yanks down Akoya's panties in order to activate her exhibition kink when she's trying to debut as an idol
- When Akoya faulters in her singing at her idol debut, Anemo uses her shadow powers to spur her on—voyeuring her from below and groping her with shadow tentacles under her clothes
- Chapter 33
- Leopard rips off Magenta's top and puts clamps on her nipples to torture her, with Barbie Doll Anatomy not being in effect... sort of
- Baiser has a demonic mosquito bite Magenta's thigh and then uses the bite to torment her in a very rapey manner, with Baiser spreading the skin around the bite and scratching it with two fingers in a manner evocative of fingering
- Chapter 34
- In a Battle in the Centre of the Mind, Utena is molested by Baiser when her Superpowered Evil Side takes over
- Chapter 35
- Controlled by her Superpowered Evil Side, Baiser rips off Magenta's clothes and stabs her with Combat Tentacles, Barbie Doll Anatomy not being in effect with Haruka's lady parts being visible—albeit partially obscured by one of the tentacles
- Corrupted Baiser forces the corrupted Magenta to rape Sulfur
- Corrupted Baiser whips Azul and then stomps on her crotch
- Imitatio (Imita Shion) of the Shio-chans looks like a pre-pubescent girl but still dresses scantily, with a lot of emphasis on her mostly-exposed butt throughout her appearances
- Chapter 36
- After the Shio-chans defeat the corrupted Baiser and rescue Tres Magia, Imitatio spanks Azul and kicks her in the crotch
- Chapter 36.5
- Hot springs episode featuring Tres Magia
- Upon being reminded of the "playing house" brainwashing incident, Kaoruko angrily grabs Sayo by the nipple and yanks on it, telling Haruka to do the same to her other breast
- Chapter 37
- Momo Momomori masturbates while watching Haruka and Kaoruko flirt at a hot spring, transmutes the water to slime, forces them into a 69 position with Haruka's fingers going inside Kaoruko and Kaoruko giving Haruka cunnilingus, and snaps photos of them
- Chapter 38
- Berserga (Randa Tada) tries to grab Imita's butt before being told off
- Utena stands under a waterfall with her nipples being visible through her translucent soaked shirt
- While Utena meditates, Baiser's "Reason" and "Lust" engage in a Battle in the Centre of the Mind where they end up stripping each other naked and groping each other
- Chapter 40
- Imitatio combines her powers with Berserga's to create a haunted house full of ghosts, then drags Enormeeta and Tres Magia inside
- Akoya wets herself out of terror when trapped by a ghost
- Haruka is groped by a ghost
- Kiwi lifts Sayo's shirt and gropes her in a fit of jealousy over how close she and Utena are
- Kiwi and Sayo are grabbed by an onryō that ties them up with her hair in suggestive ways
- Chapter 40.5
- In a follow-up to 37, Haruka complains that Momo's slime got inside her lady parts and... err... cleans herself out... while groping herself, an embarrassed Kaoruko watching
- Chapter 41
- Imitatio hits Baiser with an aphrodisiac potion and starts groping and fingering her, then changes the potion to cause pain instead of pleasure and tugs on her nipples with Barbie Doll Anatomy not being in affect (kinda)
- Baiser gets revenge by groping Imitatio's butt
- Chapter 42
- Nero Alice uses her magic to turn a toy kaiju into an actual kaiju and then tosses Magenta an Ultraman toy that turns her into a giant, with numerous gratuitous upskirt shots showing the outline of her lady parts through her panties
- Baiser and Leopard attempt to strip Magenta and Azul and Sulfur try to stop them, the four fighting inside Magenta's panties and ending with their heads poking out the top of her underwear and legs poking out the bottom, with what look like... secretions... running down Magenta's legs
- Magenta's panties fall off with Baiser acting as a Scenery Censor, Azul also getting an upskirt shot that shows off the outline of her lady parts
- Chapter 43
- Momo uses her powers to create simulacrums of Baiser and Azul, livestreaming them having sex (and getting herself off) in order to get a rise out of Leopard and the real Baiser
- Leopard puts some mini bombs on Momo's breasts that will explode if she touches herself, then puts on a show with Baiser in front of her—Leopard licking Baiser's bellybutton being framed as cunnilingus, Baiser implying that she's fingering Leopard under her loincloth, and the edge of Leopard's areola being exposed when Baiser starts removing her top to grope her
- Chapter 45
- Imitatio captures Loco Musica and Leberblume, putting the former in an illusion of being naked in front of a huge croud and molesting her while Leberblume is forced to watch her give in to her exhibitionism and masturbate... though it turns out she's fantasizing about having an orgy with a bunch of Nemos
- Imitatio's lady parts are visible through her panties when Baiser gropes her butt again and unmasks her as a disguised Lord Enorme
- Chapter 45.5
- Pure pedo-pandering promoting a crossover with Tokomeke Mahou Youjo Kokopure, with the cast of the latter being drawn as little children and one character shown topless with pasties over her chest
- Chapter 46
- While rescuing Loco Musica and Leberblume, Baiser spanks Imitatio and then briefly sticks her fingers in the front of her panties
- Venalita reveals that Imitatio is the result of Lord Enorme's Super Mode turning her into a child as a result of Baiser's initial humiliation
- Chapter 48.5
- Akoya and Anemo go to the love hotel, the former gropes the latter in the shower, and then they have sex at the love hotel
- Chapter 50
- Baiser exposes Azul's breasts during their fight, with the sound effect kanji and rays of holy light censoring most of her nipples
- Chapter 51
- More tentacle monster shenanigans, with Magia Tres, the Shio-chans, and even Enormeeta getting molested by Baiser's octopus monsters
- After attaining her corrupted Super Mode, Magenta plays with herself under her skirt and then licks her fingers clean
- Magenta forces Sulfur to suck on her breast for a power boost
- Leopard is shown with a bandaid over her crotch while bandaged up after a fight
- Chapter 53
- Momo gropes Haruka and pinches her nipples through her clothes to see whether that will activate her corrupted Super Mode
- Chapter 54
- Nero Alice transports Enormeeta, Magia Tres, and the Shio-chans into a Dark Souls-style video-game... then unequips all of Loco Musica's gear to make her fight naked—giving her an exhibition-based stat-boost
- Chapter 55
- When Anemo unequips Loco Musica's gear to fight Azul, Akoya has a mental image of Anemo undressing her
I need brain bleach now, please and thank-you.
Edited by Arawn999 on Apr 16th 2024 at 7:08:34 AM
Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard
Do have further context of those actions?
Pinging ~Arachnos, ~Zaiaku 666, ~Troperweatherly 23, ~Whaterva since they seem to have read the manga.
Edited by Siegfried1337 on Apr 14th 2024 at 11:50:09 AM
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Context on which actions?
the Retromancer
For the record, since I did say that I've read it to compare it to the anime, I was looking specifically for differences to the anime without deep reading, and have treated it as "extremely distasteful, but I could see some people arguing for a keep".
Since it sounds like later chapters go from "magical girls with bdsm gimmick" to just softcore sex, with every thing continuing Fetish Fuel instead of picking up the story, I wouldn't miss it if it were gone as well.
That's not how ping works. You can double-check if PM has been sent through.
Edited by Amonimus on Apr 14th 2024 at 9:48:13 PM
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
Ghoulish Brain Worm
I haven't read the original manga myself, but from what I've gathered in my research, the work itself focuses on plot first and foremost, with the fanservice/Fan Disservice being secondary. Also, judging by the tropes present, this looks to be a Deconstructive Parody more than anything. For that, I'm voting on keeping this work.
"We are gonna sit here and take it! You hear me!? We're gonna take it!"
The plot does progress, with Venalita masterminding most of the fights to push the different characters to attain their super modes over the course of the battles, and being the one resonsible for Magia Baiser's Superpowered Evil Side incident. It just so happens that—as I highlighted in my above post—almost every chapter contains gratuitous ecchi and sometimes borderline hentai fanservice scenes.
After a few rematches the members of Tres Magia that only increase her perversion levels (and awaken a masochism kink in Magia Azul), Utena is inducted into the supervillain team Enormeeta, duelling her teammate Leopard (Kiwi Araga) — who transfers to her school and becomes her classmate.
After some more raunchy rematches with Tres Magia, Enormeeta runs afoul of Lord's Legion—a team of evil magical girls led by the whip-wielding original leader of Enormeeta, Lord Enorme—who've just returned from hunting and killing every magical girl they could find. Lord's Legion members Loco Musica (Akoya Matama) and Leberblume (Anemo Nemo) attempt to kill the members of Enormeeta themselves but are defeated and forced to surrender—awakening an exhibitionism kink in Loco Musica. To punish them for their role in killing magical girls, Magia Baiser forces them to confess their feelings for each other and have sex. Magia Baiser attempts to take Lord Enorme down by herself but is captured, turning the tables on her by absorbing her powers, visualizing her as a little girl, and utterly humiliating her. Lord Enorme escapes, but her lieutenant Sister Gigant is revealed to be secretly working for Venalita and seemingly finishes her off on Venalita's orders.
Enormeeta resumes having increasingly perverted clashes with Tres Magia as the girls work to attain super modes called La Verità, occasionally obliviously palling around in their civilian guises before Venalita pulls strings behind the scenes to get them to fight. Utena and Kiwi consummate their relationship but are interrupted by Venalita barging in and telling them it's time to fight. In what's meant to be the final battle between Enormeeta and Tres Magia, Venalita causes Magia Baiser to enter a Superpowered Evil Side where she corrupts Magia Magenta, forcing her to rape her teammate Magia Sulfur. Magia Baiser's rampage is stopped by the arrival of a new team of magical girls, the Shio-chans — the childlike Imitatio (Imita Shion), the bandage-wrapped yandere Berserga (Randa Tada), and the so-perverted-even-Utena-is-grossed-out Pantano Pesca (Momo Momomori). Intent on wiping out Enormeeta and Tres Magia, the Shio-chans begin pulling cruel tricks intended to utterly humiliate them (in Momo's case, in explicitly sexual ways), but Imitatio is eventually unmasked as a disguised Lord Enorme—whose La Verità transformed her into a child due to psychological trauma inficted by Magia Baiser's humiliation. Rather than expose Imitatio's identity to Tres Magia or the public, Magia Baiser — who attains her own La Verità — decides to help her pull a Heel–Face Turn and go legit as a proper magical girl by getting her to realize she's in love with Berserga.
Meanwhile, Kaoruko starts to fall in love with Haruka, who has no memories of what she'd done under the corrupted Magia Baiser's control and is feeling left behind due to being the only member of Tres Magia not to attain La Verità... until she does so out of a desire to heal and protect her comrades. However, trace remnants of Magia Baiser's dark magic corrupt her La Verità form and—to Utena and Kaoruko's horror—she's transformed from a pure-hearted girl into a lascivious nurse who uses Intimate Healing to restore her teammates. With Haruka having no memory of what happened after she turns back, Tres Magia and the Shio-chans are left to try to figure out how to undo Magia Magenta's corruption, while the members of Enormeeta start to figure out that Venalita has been masterminding things all along.
Edited by Arawn999 on Apr 15th 2024 at 3:15:53 AM
I'm going to vote keep for all versions. Reluctantly. It feels like torching it would be a bit overzealous and silly, but I won't miss it if it goes.
Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard
Yeah, agreed, torching an entire work based of some cherry-picking would be very ridiculous. And I have read the manga as well, and this includes the recent chapters, and I can safely say, while there are indeed some fanservice scenes, they do not take up entire chapters of manga.
Edited by Siegfried1337 on Apr 15th 2024 at 12:38:05 PM
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Also, Imitatio appearing to be a child while still being subjected to the same sort of raunchy shenangans as the other characters strikes me as pretty blatant pedo-pandering.
Edited by Arawn999 on Apr 15th 2024 at 2:34:18 AM
Unofficial co-Wiki Curator for Magnificent Bastard
I did a look on the character Imitatio for you. Note that her age is a spoiler, but I will leave it unmarked for necessity's sake.
While you described Imitatio as pedo-pandering, I actually took a look at her age- and she's stated to be 20 years old. And from looking at her civilian form, she has the shape of an average adult.
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Yes, she's eventually revealed to be a disguised Lord Enorme, aka 20-year-old Tanaka Michiko... but that's a secret when she's first introduced. When she's incognito as "Imita Shion" she's presented as and appears to be a child despite having a fanservice-y outfit, and even after her true identity is revealed she continues to use her Imitatio form — which is explicitly said to look like a child — as her main combat form (which is where most of the fanservice scenes happen). The very fact that as Imitatio she looks like and presents herself as a child both before and after her true identity is discovered, and is repeatedly subjected to various sexualized situations while in said childlike form both before and after the reveal, strikes me as a breach of the content policy regardless of her actual age or what her civilian form—which for the most part isn't subjected to fanservice scenes—looks like.
And while Imitatio may be 20 and the other two members of the Shio-chans are 17, that doesn't change that the rest of the girls fall under the age of consent even in Japan and yet are shown routinely molesting each other, being molested, and occasionally having sex. Does that not constitute a breach of the content policy?
And "some" is an understatement when almost every chapter contains at least one lewd scene featuring said underaged characters, as I went through the trouble of noting in my breakdown of the manga.
Edited by Arawn999 on Apr 15th 2024 at 2:37:03 AM
