Unclear Description: Convenient Eclipse

This may be quick.

Despite the specific name, the description of Convenient Eclipse is very broad and unspecifically about contrived events that help the hero. We are even told that literal eclipses go under Total Eclipse of the Plot.

My Wick Check tells a different story. Here's a breakdown of 47 (couldn't find more) checked examples:

• 38 actual eclipses
• 3 volcano eruptions
• 2 storms
• 1 special day
• 3 ZCE

If we only look at valid cases then we can say 91% of examples actually deal with eclipses. This indicates to me that we should change the description to make it specifically about eclipses advancing the plot. The volcanoes are valid variations, the storm cases should move to Weather Saves the Day, and the idea about a Special Day can be yarded or dropped.

Edited by eroock on Jun 17th 2022 at 4:20:21 AM

Opening

Macron's notes

Yard "Special Day", cut the trope and move examples elsewhere.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

If the vast majority of expamples are of eclipses, move examples and make it a redirect to Total Eclipse of the Plot.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

There seem to be two (or three, if we're also considering what Total Eclipse of the Plot says in its description) ideas floating around here:

1. Characters are somehow more knowledgeable about astronomy than most locals, and successfully predict an eclipse, either to pull off a God Guise or to use the confusion as a distraction.
2. Characters have supernatural powers, and create an eclipse to further their aims.
3. (T Eot P) Eclipse coincides with dramatic high point, but both/all parties are aware that it's coming/what effects to expect.

Edited by underCoverSailsman on Jun 16th 2022 at 7:16:09 AM

Total Eclipse of the Plot is an artistic license trope which is only remotely related to the trope at hand.

^^ The wick check only showed three examples of characters artificially creating eclipses.

To add on to my previous vote, I think multiple tropes mentioned in the description (Deus ex Machina, Contrived Coincidence, Total Eclipse of the Plot, and Weather Saves the Day) could have examples moved to them, since I don't think this trope is distinct enough from them (particularly with only 58 wicks), but I think the name should be redirected to Total Eclipse of the Plot specifically (or we could disambiguate between those four tropes).

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jun 16th 2022 at 7:30:21 AM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

for disambiguating between above

CSP Cleanup Thread | All that I ask for ... is diamonds and dance floors

^^ I disagree with the notion that the examples from Convenient Eclipse are not distinct enough from other tropes.

• Convenient Eclipse: An eclipse gets a character out of a tight spot either by foreknowledge of it (exploited God Guise) or by sheer luck (darkness induces confusion).
  • ~40 fitting examples is a healthy base - my only complaint is the loose description
• Total Eclipse of the Plot: Eclipses coincide with dramatic high points, are cool, probably unrealistic but otherwise don't help a character
  • A wick check would be needed to see if that distinction holds up

Edited by eroock on Jun 17th 2022 at 1:37:59 AM

Maybe the wick check needs resorting. If there are a lot of examples of "character uses the timing foreknowledge of astronomy to their advantage", then it would be completely unrelated to Total Eclipse of the Plot and just needs a better name.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

^ Noted and Wick Check updated. I now split the "eclipse helps" idea into three subcategories:

1. Eclipse foreknowledge helps (18)
2. Eclipse accidentally helps (16)
3. Eclipse generated to help (4)

As a lumper I have no problem keeping these under one trope Convenient Eclipse.

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Note that this is only one dimension to look at the trope. The other dimension is what the eclipse achieves. E.g. there could be:

• an accidental eclipse that convinces captors to release a prisoner
• a predicted eclipse that weakens the enemy during battle

Edited by eroock on Jun 17th 2022 at 4:33:30 AM

So... what exactly are you proposing we do with Convenient Eclipse? You haven't exactly made that clear.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

• Total Eclipse of the Plot: The climax happens or will happen at eclipse, which itself scan last absurdly long.
• Convenient Eclipse: Eclipse happens just at the right time to be useful, especially when a character in a bind knows when.

I'd argue one is a dramatic effect and the other is utility, and both can be used together. If these still sound too interchangeably, I can suggest remaking Convenient Eclipse into "A character with knowledge of astronomy is advantageous over characters without", expand to other non-eclipse cases (with 58 wicks it may need it), and move accidental examples to Contrived Coincidence.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

If rewriting the definition is being proposed, a sandbox would help.

Edit: Retracted.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jun 17th 2022 at 1:34:44 PM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

Yeah, I'm a bit confused here, too. I thought you wanted to redirect examples to Total Eclipse of the Plot?

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

I'm tempted to just lock the thread, because the reorganized wick check doesn't demonstrate any problems. It merely shows that examples are different from each other, but anyone who's read Administrivia.Tropes Are Flexible already knows that tropes attract varying examples.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

I thought we going to do a merge but apparently not. This thread was very last minute. It would have been best to start a trope discussion first as said before.

Macron's notes

Yeah, this is why we need to get wick checks done before posting on the queue...

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness