New namespace for Animated Films

It's a namespace move so it takes a week, not three days.

Shit, even aside from moving entries to the correct page, I realized...Does this mean that, say, WesternAnimation.Mortal Kombat Legends Battle Of The Realms will need a new namespace? That'll be a LOT of work, even if we do redirects.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts

78 wicks?

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

Probably not the best example.

The 60 well-loved and well-wicked films on Disney Animated Canon on the other hand, yes.

Yeah, I was just picking one that I got a Complete Monster from.

Let's take, say, WesternAnimation.Beauty And The Beast...all 2,000+? Yikes.

Edited by ACW on May 4th 2022 at 12:14:32 PM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts

Beauty and the Beast for instance already needs to be moved to have the (Disney) disambiguation so that would make for a good opportunity to do that.

CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes

Most of those wicks are in the right places, but WhyDidItHaveToBeSnakes.Western Animation, for example, is putting television and movies in the same media category. Beauty and the Beast is just one example of such. Probably due to being around since 2013. I did say that most of the problem here was growing pains where different editors had different ideas and enforcing a consistent rule wasn't always the priority. After that, things get left from inertia. Even if we weren't changing the namespace, we should be fixing those mistakes.

Link to TRS threads in project mode here.

I think the crowner question should sound like this:

(Judging from the Image Source and Quote Source dewicking, I can personally get about 400-800 wicks like that a day, and I still had IRL problems)

Edited by Amonimus on May 4th 2022 at 9:10:35 PM

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

One thing I've been doing lately to make overall efforts slightly faster is trying to tackle multiple at once. I focus on one thing, but on each page I'll stop and see if other TRS-cut tropes are also listed, and get rid of those at the same time. So for this one, someone could realistically change entire folders at once, taking some extra time in the present but saving more redundancy down the line.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Though I recommend we make the current ones redirects instead of just cutlisting them.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts

Yes, obviously we'd do that. Unlike with Disney/ and Discworld/, the WesternAnimation/ namespace isn't being deprecated entirely.

I had a dog-themed avatar before it was cool.

Plus, inbounds.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

You're underestimating the problem because there are other animated film indexes there, such as AmericanFilms.Animation. That's why when I created the crowner, I pointed out that there are almost 8500 work pages to check. Realistically we probably only have to move less than half. Also pointed out in the OP was that they'd need to be checked anyway, to make sure they're following the policy on Media Categories FAQ.

Crowner is currently at 38:9 in favour of creating the namespace.

Link to TRS threads in project mode here.

I'm voting nay until my original concern is addressed:

The only way to move over the page histories is to use the mod tool (discussions automatically get moved over using it as well).

Edited by MacronNotes on May 7th 2022 at 5:54:39 AM

Macron's notes

I hope that the mod tool would be fairly easy to use. I've seen hundreds of cut list entries be processed in a short amount of time, so this may be comparable. Still, it's unfortunate this obligation is left entirely on the mods.

Are page histories of cut pages being kept? If these can be published in some form, which could be risky for several reasons, people could piece together page histories even after they're cut.

Another alternative would be to copy a list of the editors on the discussion page after the page has been moved. This would probably be the easiest option as it wouldn't take any mod or admin work.

edit: The above option would still result in the times and contents of the edits being lost. Yet another option could be just to download the history pages, then link to an archive. This would require a bit more work than the above option, and like the above option it would need to be done before the pages are cut.

Edited by N1KF on May 7th 2022 at 5:22:48 AM

Question related to that—were the histories moved over when the Disney/ namespace was deprecated? I wasn't active on the forums yet when that deprecation occurred, so I am unaware.

TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall

Having to mod move all the pages won't be hard. It'll just be more time-consuming.

Cut page histories are only accessible to moderators.

As for ^, I don't remember being around when those pages were moved but it looks like WesternAnimation.Beauty And The Beast was moved using the page mover tool since the history stretched back to 2010 so maybe the other Disney/ ones were too.

Edited by MacronNotes on May 7th 2022 at 6:26:25 AM

Macron's notes

I still have concerns about video examples. If pages are going to be moved then it should be figured out how page moves affect video examples so they can be moved over properly, rather than tons of video examples potentially getting lost in limbo.

Mods can just edit the video sources or move clips entirely I'd assume.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

I don't know if video examples can get moved over with the tool. But If they don't, we can just access the video's sources from the Western Animation / Anime redirects they are on.

Edited by MacronNotes on May 7th 2022 at 7:49:41 AM

Macron's notes

Yes, but 1) the page they're being moved to needs to exist first 2) if moving a page de-sources its video examples, then after the page is moved, you'd no longer have access to all its video examples in one place — they'd be scattered everywhere.

It's a logistical complication.

But you'd have to create the redirect first. And to do that, you'd first have to move the work page. For instance:

1. WesternAnimation.Beauty And The Beast is moved using the page mover to AnimatedFilm.Beauty And The Beast
   1. as a side effect, video examples are (possibly) de-sourced
2. WesternAnimation.Beauty And The Beast is recreated as a redirect
3. video examples are still de-sourced?

So in this situation, to make sure all the videos are moved, you'd need a complete record of them before moving the work page, so after it's moved, you can go to the trope pages and re-add all the sources manually.

I'm assuming, anyway. What we need is some kind of test case to verify/work out the details.

Edited by Twiddler on May 7th 2022 at 4:56:14 AM

That's a good point... I'll make two sandboxes, add them as sources to a few videos, and then page move them to see what happens.

Edit: I moved a Solar-Powered Magnifying Glass video example to Sandbox.Video Testing and then used the page mover tool to move the page to Sandbox.Video Testing 2. The video did not move over but it's still on Sandbox.Video Testing even though that page no longer exists (the source is still there too).

Edited by MacronNotes on May 7th 2022 at 8:08:29 AM

Macron's notes

Interesting...

I recreated Sandbox.Video Testing, and the video is still there. So it looks like video sourcing is unaffected by the page mover. That's great to know. That'll save a ton of mod-work in moving them, if the videos can still be found in one place after a page move.

What happens if you cut Sandbox.Video Testing? Does the cut-list affect the sourcing?

Edited by Twiddler on May 7th 2022 at 5:21:32 AM

For your example of WesternAnimation.Beauty And The Beast that also additionally needs to be moved to AnimatedFilm.Beauty And The Beast Disney

CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes