Marvel's Hawkeye

I think the whole scene of him re-motivating a distressed Wanda was my favorite illustration of this.

Edited by dmcreif on Jan 19th 2022 at 9:11:56 AM

Agreed. I loved that part.

I know people think it's actually just confirming his Memetic Loser-dom, but I view it as him acknowledging how insane the situation is and how crazy it is to go out there and fight, but he's still going to do it.

Cause he's an Avenger, and that's what he's supposed to do.

He picks her up, comforts her, and even re-inspires her.

Cause yeah, he's just got a bow....but he still went out there, kicked some ass, and then got Wanda to do so as well.

Hello! What did anyone thought about the show?

Edited by Meistro2021 on Jan 19th 2022 at 7:25:34 AM

I thought it hit the bullseye!

The target, not the marvel character from Season 3 of the Netflix Daredevil. That's a completely different thing.

Also, right after he says "I have a bow and arrow", he shoots an arrow through a hole in the wall and creates an off-screen explosion, and the scene ends with him popping out a huge number of arrows from his boot and creating an Off Screen Moment Of Awesome. That scene does more to prop up Hawkeye as a badass than it does mildly poking fun at him being just a guy with a bow and arrow.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jan 19th 2022 at 11:20:00 AM

He's always been the dude with a Bow and Arrow.

He makes it work pretty damned well.

Hell, his stint as Ronin in both the comics and MCU shows he's not just a dude with a Bow and Arrow either.

He uses that bow and arrow as a favour to all of us. Make it sporting and all that.

Or not. Either way, Clint Barton deserves respect. I've been saying this for a while now.

He's a Magnificent Bastard for a reason

Edited by magnumtropus on Jan 19th 2022 at 10:24:46 PM

Fun fact: Hawkeye is the only character in history to be a canonical member of both the Avengers and the Justice League.

Hell yeah the dude deserves respect.

I've mentioned that before as well.

He's also been a Defender, a Thunderbolt, two different kinds of West Coast Avenger.

In comics he's one of the most experienced guys out there.

I actually used that as a Greak Lakes Avenger point.

For all the shit they take, I point out the GLA were trained by Hawkeye, an Avenger of decades, so they are in fact an Avengers branch.

Lets face it, this scene shouldn't have been deleted as it established how Eleanor came to work for Fisk, or explicitly showing Fisk in the episode 3 flashbacks.

Edited by dmcreif on Jan 20th 2022 at 6:46:58 AM

But even without that scene, they clearly established why Eleanor was working for Fisk. And seeing Fisk clearly that early would be odd seeing he doesn't truly show up again until the last episode, they were trying to keep his appearance a secret. And the photo at the end of episode 5 is really only worthwhile if its a confirmation to the audience, as well as to Clint and Kate, as to who the bad guy is.

The thing about the deleted scenes with Fisk is that I think I remember a rumor that Fisk was supposed to officially appear an episode earlier then he actually did, but some scenes were cut. These cut scenes seem to validate those rumors.

The one with Fisk and young Maya should've been retained because from a Doylist standpoint, the audience needed a reason to care that Maya shoots Fisk at the end of the show. Since they never show the characters interacting with each other before Maya realizes what Fisk did to her dad, there is no emotional weight to her decision to shoot him.

I feel like they were trying to do a "big bad villain reveal", but they messed it up. They should've just introduced Fisk early on in the show so we could properly explore Maya's relationship with him (I prefer the way Daredevil season 1 handled its reveal of Fisk: first as a voice on the other end of a phone call from Wesley in episode 1; then Matt gets Fisk's name from Healy in episode 3, and immediately after Healy kills himself, we get to see Fisk for ourselves to close the episode; episode 4 is used to start establishing him as a character). Unless they're saving that history for Echo.

Speaking of the cut scenes, I think they also should've kept the one with Clint and Kate being surprised by Aunt Moira coming home early, the one of Clint polishing the Ronin sword in Grills's place, Clint's nonverbal exchange with Maya before she leaves the Rockefeller Center showdown, and somewhere should've put the circus flashback of young Clint and his mother, which shows that Clint got his mother arrested for trying to get him to kill a gas station clerk with the clerk's own shotgun, much like Kate gets her mother locked up.

Yea, I just assumed the whole Fisk/Echo past relationship beats are just getting saved for her own show.

Yeah, that. Those scenes were probably cut because, ultimately, the show isn't really about Echo, nor is it about Kingpin, and they likely didn't want the last couple episodes to too obviously be a Backdoor Pilot for Echo's show. Echo's subplot in the last episode sets up her the show just fine by itself.

I do think the interaction between Clint and Echo being cut - even if its small - is a failing, though. Echo isn't the protag, but she was the villain of the piece until she wasn't at the very end, and some linking with to the characters rather than her just doing her own thing entirely might've been more cohesive.

That said, I wouldn't have had Echo interact with Clint (and maybe that's why it was cut). I would've had her interact with Kate.

I find this funny considering how much strength is needed to pull the string of a bow and Hawkeye often does this very quickly.

It's also odd that archers specifically often get treated as glass cannons, but users of other types of ranged weaponry don't typically have this issue.

If anything, the Hawkeye series showed that he is quite proficient in close combat as well. He held his own against a Black Widow, though I'm still not quite if Yelena was holding back.

I can't imagine Yelena was holding back, she was very visibly angry here.

I'm probably in the minority that Clint was holding back. That if he went all out, Yelena would be dead in two seconds flat.

He's very much not going to murder Natasha's sister.

But while I think of him as a glass cannon, I think that he'd disengage from Yelena, get a short distance away and she'd be full of arrows.

One of the better moments is Clint telling Echo, "Listen, I'm trying to be reasonable here actually because you can either go after your dad's real killer or I can kill right now."

It's a delightfully understated Badass Boast.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jan 21st 2022 at 1:54:11 AM

Is that really a minority opinion?

I mean we literally saw him an episode earlier completely hand Echo her ass, he was clearly holding back against Yelena because he doesn't want to kill Nat's sister.

I used to teach archery and one of the highlights of the job was seeing kids who could barely pull back a bowstring get ridiculously strong from practice over the course of the week. Day 1 the arrow might only fly 2 feet, Day 5 they’re piercing targets clean through solid wood (the heavy kind, not plywood) and out the other side.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Jan 21st 2022 at 2:01:29 AM

I don't think Clint knew that his opponent was Yelena during their first fight on the rooftop, so he had no reason to hold back at this point. He is clearly holding back on their subsequent fights, though.

I think Clint is generally holding back in general, even with the fact he's permanently no longer at his A-game due to aging as well as Dented Iron.

Because he is in a state of being The Atoner.

No more killing if he can help it.

His speech when he has Maya defeated pretty much solidifies him as someone who is not going to kill if he can help it - but absolutely can and will if he has to. Later on he beats down Kazi but leaves him alive even after the guy had made several attempts on his (Clint's) life.

It's an unusual take inasmuch as he's not got any particular moral qualms about killing, he's just very tired of it and doesn't want to, as opposed to the "killing is 100% wrong" Batman type.

Edited by jakobitis on Jan 21st 2022 at 2:40:53 AM