A project thread for the new Derivative Works/ namespace. The sandbox for the project is here.
The discussion agreed that adaptations of public domain works are not part of that work's "franchise", and their Franchise/ pages have to be reformatted and moved to the new namespace — DerivativeWorks/.
The current progress is handled at Sandbox.Derivative Works Namespace. Do not move pages to DerivativeWorks/ until the corresponding DerivativeWorks/ page draft is approved and stick to one work at a time.
For one thing, these simply aren't franchises. Fairytales are pretty much public domain. Anyone can make a story about these characters. It's not a franchise if it's just unrelated creators making unrelated adaptations. Second, I think these would function much better as normal indices or disambig pages. People who want to find a specific Snow White story would probably not expect to find it by clicking on the franchise button.
But what do you think?
I initially brought this up here
(in terms of the Cinderella one), but the discussion died almost immediately after. I figured that instead of keep bumping that thread, I'd make a new one here.
Edited by Synchronicity on Oct 14th 2022 at 12:42:47 PM
Hmmm
Maybe keep the licensed stuff in franchise And the PD stuff in derivative
Or have them both be in DW but seperate them by either being licensed or by being within the public domain
He/Him
Just searching online, there is no such thing as an official, all-encompassing "Sherlock Holmes franchise" besides the page on This Very Wiki. The most you get are film/video game series like the Downey Jr Film Series or Enola Holmes. But that's it.
Unlike say, Disney's Hunchback and Alice in Wonderland franchises
Edited by AudioSpeaks2 on Dec 27th 2023 at 12:25:53 AM
Art Museum Curator and frequent helper of the Web Original deprecation project
I'm bumping this thread since the public domin has expanded
Most notably 2 silent Mickey shorts, Tigger and Steamboat Willie have entered
There is already a YouTube Poop as well as a planned film (Mickey's Mousetrap) and a video game teaser dropped (Infestation 88)
There's also a Web Comic Mousetrapped from the Something*Positive artist.
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
The thing about Disney is that it is still a franchise first and foremost. Their oldest stuff just went into the PD, but IDK if that's enough to start calling things derivative works and not just, like... parodies or something. Since we only really just got to the point where people can make any legit work off of a Disney work without needing to worry about copyright.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
So would that make the short (as well as the silent versions of Plane Crazy and Galloping Gaucho) fit for a derivative works page?
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
I mean, are there any derivatives of the short? I'm asking genuinely. This is the first time people could even do so without Disney coming to kneecap them. It feels premature, especially since everything else Disney has made is still under copyright.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
You do have a point
I don't think I've seen a DW page where none of the adaptations had pages so I think a page or two should be made first then there should be a DW page
He/Him
Alright, Iridener seems to have sorted the Sherlock Holmes situation out. They just moved the whole franchise page to Derivative Works/
Which is fine to me because as stated earlier there is absolutely no such thing as a Sherlock Holmes franchise
Art Museum Curator and frequent helper of the Web Original deprecation project
Friends forevermore
I disagree with this being "fine", as it was Franchise-eligible before its last entries dropped into the PD. (See also Franchise.Winnie The Pooh, which isn't just the Disney stuff.)
I had a dog-themed avatar before it was cool.
He/Him
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
The only reason it could even be considered even a little (and I mean a very little) as a franchise was because Sherlock Holmes wasn't in the Public Domain yet and they had to ask permission from Doyle's estate and even then calling a group of works from completely unrelated studios that just so happened to ask permission from an estate is barely a franchise.
Now that all Holmes stories are PD, there isn't a reason to make a franchise page because again, looking it up at all shows that there exists no official Sherlock Holmes franchise. Unlike the Marvel Cinematic Universe or Disney's The Little Mermaid and Hunchback franchises, which do exist as official media franchises.
Search up "Sherlock Holmes franchise" and it straight up only leads to our site, the other search results are actually people debating as to whether it's appropriate to call Sherlock Holmes a franchise.
Edited by AudioSpeaks2 on Jan 16th 2024 at 10:02:01 PM
Art Museum Curator and frequent helper of the Web Original deprecation project
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
Yeah, there was no "Sherlock Holmes" franchise. There were the books and then there were a million adaptations made by unrelated companies. A franchise should be, well... owned by one creator.
If Pooh does the same thing, then the page should be evaluated, not emulated.
Edited by WarJay77 on Jan 16th 2024 at 8:55:21 AM
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
Would something like Chess be fit for a derivative works page
He/Him
Do you mean stuff like Theatre.Chess?
the Retromancer
The page has "Fictional works about chess". Which isn't what I think we're looking for. Chess doesn't even have a story, so I don't think it can have "derivatives" that aren't Variant Chess.
Edited by Amonimus on Feb 12th 2024 at 9:33:11 PM
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
Variant Chess is a trope
But I'm mostly curious on if old tabletop games would be fitting for stuff to have a derivative works page on. If so I think chess meets the criteria We got:
I don't see much possibilities outside video game adaptations of chess. The subsection "Fictional works about chess" seems enough.
Edited by Iridener on Feb 13th 2024 at 4:19:41 AM
So consensus seems to be tabletop games don't get derivative works, rip
Edited by Adembergz on Feb 13th 2024 at 6:47:30 PM
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Land of Oz was moved to Land of Oz which is fine as I am reasonably sure it is public domain. But what should we do with the The Wizard of Oz and Wizard of Oz redirects? Redirect them to the new page? I already redirected the franchise page like with the Sherlock Holmes one does.
Edited by Bullman on Feb 17th 2024 at 6:14:29 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
He/Him
Yes, definitely do that.
Because people have just called Land of Oz as just the Wizard of Oz books/world
Edited by AudioSpeaks2 on Feb 17th 2024 at 8:37:56 PM
Art Museum Curator and frequent helper of the Web Original deprecation project
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Crown Description:
The previous crowner agreed to create a new namespace for subpages of original works that have fallen into the public domain due to misuse from the Multimedia franchise namespace and the Fan Works namespace. The following options had the most support during discussion.
Does it count as a franchise if the non-literature adaptations are made by different companies? It feels off to have a franchise where the works aren't made by one creator.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness