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This thread is for discussing the following topics:
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(Edited Mar 28 2024, adding bullet about OTC and amending layout a little)
Edited by Mrph1 on Mar 29th 2024 at 10:55:20 AM
he/him
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Pretty much.
- The first step for any forum problem is usually to holler the mods.
- If the issue isn't specific to a particular post and you need to call out a wider pattern of behaviour, raising an ATT query may be appropriate. This tends to happen when a longer explanation is needed - e.g. when no individual post clearly breaks the rules, but viewed as a whole they're problematic. ATT queries can be set to private, so that only staff see them.
- If the mods look at the case and you're still unhappy with the decisions taken, this can be appealed via the admin contact form.
- If no action seems to be taken, it may be worth directly asking a mod before escalating to the contact form. Sometimes we're still discussing next steps or something's happened behind the scenes.
- In a similar way, if nothing's obviously happened yet and a new problem post from the same user appears, the best option is to holler it as a starting point. If we're already looking at the previous issue, we'll add it into that conversation. If we didn't take action on the previous issue, we'll revisit the troper's behaviour as a whole in light of the new evidence.
(Mod hat off, as this hasn't been reviewed by the team, but it's just restating existing policy)
he/him
That isn't really on-topic here, but as you've raised it, to be clear:
- Your signature contained a quote about real life politics and terrorism that was hollered several times. A mod review then decided that it was inappropriate for the site. It was deleted as a breach of forum rules and you were advised not to add it back.
- You appealed this via the contact form, which is the correct approach when unhappy with a moderation decision.
- The admins confirmed that they stood by the decision.
- You did not accept that response and, apparently, continued to argue with them via contact form email.
- The admins advised that the conversation was over, the decision was made, and asked you to drop it. You were informed that if you continued to argue about this there would be further consequences.
I don't have direct visibility of the emails, but the admins have summarised the conversation for the mods.
According to those records, you were not threatened for initially appealing the decision. You were told that the appeal had been declined, and then told that if you kept arguing about this there would be further consequences.
That statement still stands.
This thread is not the place to raise that sort of complaint and, in your case, the appeal has already been declined.
Lost in Space
Fundamentally, when you keep up a line of argument after it has been rejected and the appeal denied, you are the bad-faith actor and risk a ban for said behavior. It's been that way since the beginning of time and will remain that way until the end.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
Maverick Hunter.
So, from what I gather up till now, what the Mods are saying is that, like it or not, once a decision is taken on a topic it is final and this is not the forum thread to debate those final decisions.
That is all good, however, the problem arises because there's no forum thread were such a discussion can be had, that just causes a disbalance because all the power is on the staff's side. Say, if a Mod/Admin wants to ignore a problem they can and there's nothing we can do about it. Basically, what if the Admins ignored any and all hollers and emails that had to do with Fighteer? (this is just an example) What would be our options then? Because, from what I can see, that just leaves us with two options: Take it like a champ and move on or abandon the site entirely. And I don't think either of those are good options.
Admin
The recent hollers weren't ignored. Fighteer's posts were reviewed by other mods and thumped, and they also spoke with him via slack how it was highly inappropriate. A mod post was added to the thread and, as evidenced by recent posts here, the admins are aware of the feedback from users. I also knew about the fighteer comment before any emails were sent because I pay attention to hollers as well.
And yes, the power is always on the staffs side. The company owns this website and can do whatever they want with it. I don’t have a say and neither do the users if say, the company wanted to delete the entire site. Not that they ever would. So yes your only recourse is to email the staff and that’s the end of it. Conversations about this aren’t allowed so let’s end it here please.
Edited by kory on Mar 12th 2024 at 9:58:07 AM
Now monitoring Wishlist and Bugs
Maverick Hunter.
One-Track Mind (he/him)
Visiting from the Hoag Galaxy
Uh, is there a way to ask if a proposed On Topic thread was rejected or not? Because I pitched a thread in February and it's still sitting there, locked. At the minimum, I would like to know if it brushes up against something that's banned or if something about it is considered unpalatable for the forum so I know what to not touch on in the future.
EDIT: (also, is this the right thread for this question, I'm not sure)
Edited by Zendervai on Mar 25th 2024 at 8:36:13 AM
Not Three Laws compliant.
the Retromancer
For reference, I assume you mean this one?
If you need moderator action, you can Holler.
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
Lost in Space
We probably just lost track of it. I've opened the thread.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Visiting from the Hoag Galaxy
Yeah that was it. Thanks.
Not Three Laws compliant.
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
I’ve been gone for a while, around the last end of 2023 and…the U.S Politics Thread is still locked down. A 1/3rd of a year later.
This is very confusing and eyebrow-raising. I came around because I received a newsletter from Vox that reinforced something I once noticed in the thread and wanted to share it with the rest but it’s still locked? This raises a few questions.
I’ve been here since 2016 and I have a habit of thread-trawling so I am familiar with the sight of lockdowns. However, they’re usually a temporary measure, meant to try to let passions air out and let everybody come back with a cooler head and they don’t last so long, usually a few days, maybe a week.
The longest most recent lockdown I remember was the Jimquisition thread and even that didn’t carry on for as long, maybe like a handful of weeks? So going on for a quarter of a year, that’s not how normal lockdowns work-unless the subject of U.S politics is not kosher anymore? I remember seeing a convo here starting around that the last time I peeked and my two cents is that, yeah, I agree, that would be an absurd decision and cause more trouble then it purports to…I’d say “solve” but I don’t know what it would try to solve?
We’ve had banned topics before but that never meant a complete silence across the board, no talk about it whatsoever. We’ve had recent convos about abortion that weren’t disapproved of when they didn’t go into rhetoric about murder of children. We’ve had convos about Mass Effect 3’s ending plenty of times because whatever caused the original banning of the topic, it was no longer in people’s hearts to continue. Heck, we’ve even had a revival of the General Star Wars Thread by the time “Rise of Skywalker” came out.
Has there been an ETO (Estimated Time of Opening) given at some point, some sort of clear condition for the thread to reopen? Because I remember a moderator saying this was just supposed to be a normal lockdown and this…does not seem normal.
(Note: I’m using “lockdown” as a specific term, not interchangeably with “shutdown”, just as a “suspension” is not the same as a “ban”.)
Edit: I’d also like to point out a comment by Alley Oop that she had made a while ago, that previous moderation (including a controversial moderator) had been criticized for being too liberal with thread shutdowns rather then employing more nuanced and precise methods as they usually do.
Edited by fredhot16 on Mar 28th 2024 at 8:15:48 AM
Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
One-Track Mind (he/him)
IIRC the ETO is the moment the admins give the mods the ability to implement slow mode on forum threads.
the Retromancer
There's no ETO, the time of opening is "indefinitely later until more control tools are added, which are not priority or immediate interest". There's no use in nudging or explaining the importance of OTC Politics.
Maybe it's worth adding a QNA to the pin alongside the other bolded node, since this question keeps reoccurring.
Edited by Amonimus on Mar 28th 2024 at 6:05:58 PM
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
Lost in Space
This has been discussed multiple times over the past months. There is no "silence" — our position has been stated over and over again.
- The thread will only be reopened once we have built tech to allow "slow mode" to be enabled by moderators. This is in progress but we cannot provide an ETA.
- Nobody is entitled to a thread to discuss anything on these forums. We may shut down any discussion that repeatedly violates our rules, such as civility, doomposting, gravedancing, etc. The US Politics thread did that many, many times.
In other words, the posters are the ones to blame for this situation. If you can't use things responsibly, you can't have them.
Edited by Fighteer on Mar 28th 2024 at 11:08:02 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Admin
Moderators are volunteers with limited amount of time to do things. They were spending a lot of that time going into a single thread in OTC, US politics, so we locked it until we can implement something to prevent it from consuming so much of that time.
I’ll also reiterate what I’ve said before that even when slow-mode is implemented if the moderators still have to keep going into US politics too frequently it will then be permanently locked. If you want to discuss politics, you’ll just have to find another website. Our focus will always be TV tropes and the wiki will always take priority over the forums.
Now monitoring Wishlist and Bugs
he/him
Pinned post updated, as suggested, with a note about the OTC guidance and confirmation that it's off-topic here. I've included a link to the OTC moderation thread.
Movie and TV Goddess
So, I was wondering: how long does it take for new topics in threads to be opened up?
I love animation, TV, movies, YOU NAME IT!
the Retromancer
Whenever a mod gets a chance to look at them. If it's been a few days, you can Holler.
Lost in Space
Sometimes, if a thread isn't opened, it's because it slipped our attention. In other cases, we're debating whether it's a good idea. The Cancel Culture one is a very bad idea and has been declined.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
A procrastination in of itself
Can I suggest that when a topic is locked long-term or (in the case of OTC) decided not to be opened that it be noted in the relevant sub-forum pinned topic so that people have an easy reference point. Both to avoid repeat requests and so that forum regular have an easy palce to point people when they start asking about it.
"And the Bunny nails it!" ~ Gabrael "If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we." ~ Cyran
reconsidering
re: politics
do we have a thread for non-politics current events? i couldn't find one— if we did, would that be okay as a topic or is it too close to the banned topics
like for that bridge which collapsed or the boeing stuff thats going on, things like that. Just not elections or politics
Edited by Tremmor19 on Mar 28th 2024 at 9:35:30 AM
Redmess
I am still in favour of splitting US Politics up into smaller topics. That already seems to help in other threads where US Politics related topics pop up now and then.
Optimism is a duty.
This is an absolutely abysmal policy to have if you wish the community to have any faith and trust in you.
Likewise 'if you have problems email us but we don't promise to address your concerns or even email back'.
On the email, there's also "we'll threaten to straight-up ban you for even using the contact form because we agree with the decision so hard" which is what happened to me when I reported a mod deleting my signature.
Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Mar 12th 2024 at 6:37:33 AM