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sabrina_diamond iSanity! from Australia Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
#1: Jun 29th 2015 at 11:03:37 PM

In my newest story, a previous protagonist was punished for her transgressions by being sentenced to the Underworld for over five-thousand years. She then assists another person, but she herself had noticeably changed during her time there... Not only does she go by a completely different name, she is forced to wear a red plague-doctor mask and red Femme Fatale dress to conceal her own identify (which is very ironic due to her tomboy attitude).

This is explained due to a curse cast on her. This is further elaborated from the way her usual weapon (a sword) which is changed into a whip. Does this curse make for good writing so far?

edited 29th Jun '15 11:09:02 PM by sabrina_diamond

In an anime, I'll be the Tsundere Dark Magical Girl who likes purple MY own profile is actually HERE!
editerguy from Australia Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
#2: Jun 29th 2015 at 11:49:12 PM

It sounds more like an imposed punishment than a curse.

Faemonic Since: Dec, 2014
#3: Jun 30th 2015 at 3:25:04 AM

Does this curse make for good writing so far?

Maybe it does in what you're actually writing, but the way you're explaining it sounds like an Ass Pull. Which is fine, if you don't want to reveal what happened in the 5000 years underworld that turned her from a swordslinging tomboy to a masque-wearing dominatrix, but this also means that I can't tell you how badly it's written. Izanagi came out from the underworld pissing himself because of reasons. Orpheus came out of the underworld probably extra emo because of reasons, not pissing himself. Even 5000 years of what they went through might not make the Cenobite transformation make any sense.

sabrina_diamond iSanity! from Australia Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
#4: Jun 30th 2015 at 6:49:52 AM

Which is mainly why I am trying to elaborate this incident which is explained via a curse that the Underworld caused on her... Since I do like the idea of curses in stories and fairytales which I've read over the years. Also a bit of Death Amnesia also applies here.

edited 30th Jun '15 6:51:43 AM by sabrina_diamond

In an anime, I'll be the Tsundere Dark Magical Girl who likes purple MY own profile is actually HERE!
Faemonic Since: Dec, 2014
#5: Jun 30th 2015 at 9:59:53 AM

Which is mainly why I am trying to elaborate this incident which is explained via a curse that the Underworld caused on her

What, the curse explains the incident in the underworld? The protagonist was cursed to the underworld? The incident in the underworld was the curse?

Forget elaborate, try to define.

But if you don't because you don't trust readers not to steal it or something, then that's fair but don't expect people to read the manuscript via telepathy! Nobody's going to tell you how to do this because you're the writer.

sabrina_diamond iSanity! from Australia Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
#6: Jun 30th 2015 at 6:12:45 PM

Alright, the protagonist was cursed while in the underworld, which was the incident itself. I just need to define the nature of the curse itself that changes her personality.

edited 30th Jun '15 6:19:01 PM by sabrina_diamond

In an anime, I'll be the Tsundere Dark Magical Girl who likes purple MY own profile is actually HERE!
Lorsty Since: Feb, 2010
#7: Jun 30th 2015 at 6:45:00 PM

The thing with curses in fairy tales is that there is usually a reason behind the curse. So let's start there.

Why was Alice (I'm going to call your character Alice) cursed? Considering the nature of the curse (some kind of ironic punishment), it sounds to me like she did something to piss off someone important... but not something so big that would earn her a truly terrifying curse (she has to wear a dress? Horror of horrors).

Who or what cursed Alice? In most tales there is usually a force behind a curse. Given that you mention that the curse itself was the incident, it appears that just being in the Underworld is NOT why she was cursed. So, as you answer the "Why?", try to find the "Who or What?"

What are the exact terms of Alice's curse? In my opinion, the most interesting curses have pretty well defined conditions for curses. There is the good ol' "and the entire kingdom shall fall asleep on your 16th birthday", or some bizarre ones like "if you touch another living person they will DIE!!!11one". The important thing is that you define the exact terms of the curse including what it does to the character, how it affects her, if the curse can be broken, etc.

How did Alice react to being cursed? How does she act now to the fact that she is still cursed? At the end of the day a great story or concept is nothing if your characters have no agency. Your concept sounds... okay, but as a reader I'm more interested to know what Alice wants, what she hates, how she reacts to the situation she's been put in and what she is going to do about it.

Start by asking yourself those questions and work from there. You don't have to share it with us if you're not ready or whatever. The important thing is that you get to know your own characters to see if a plot device would really work, and if it doesn't you need to be prepared to adjust it (maybe the whole dominatrix thing just doesn't work) or remove it, if it comes to that.

edited 30th Jun '15 6:47:03 PM by Lorsty

editerguy from Australia Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
#8: Jun 30th 2015 at 6:59:07 PM

[up]

The important thing is that you get to know your own characters to see if a plot device would really work, and if it doesn't you need to be prepared to adjust it (maybe the whole dominatrix thing just doesn't work) or remove it, if it comes to that.

I think this is particularly important.

In this case, it's not clear from the summary what the curse adds to the scenario. The character is banished for her transgressions and adopts a new persona to hide her identity. A curse doesn't seem necessary to explain any of this.

sabrina_diamond iSanity! from Australia Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
#9: Jun 30th 2015 at 11:30:53 PM

The curse has to do with the way it changes her whole personality while under the persona. Basically the longer she stays in the underworld, the more it warps her personality to twisted proportions and she becomes much crueller after her Death Amnesia. As for the curse itself, it was mandated by an Arch-demon.

edited 30th Jun '15 11:34:01 PM by sabrina_diamond

In an anime, I'll be the Tsundere Dark Magical Girl who likes purple MY own profile is actually HERE!
Tungsten74 Since: Oct, 2013
#10: Jul 1st 2015 at 3:08:55 AM

Why was it mandated? What motivated the Arch-Demon to do it? Was it meant to be part of her punishment? Or was it just something the Demon did for shits and giggles? Is the Demon also trapped in the Underworld as punishment for his sins? Or are they the jailer?

Define this shit.

sabrina_diamond iSanity! from Australia Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
#11: Jul 1st 2015 at 3:23:34 AM

Basically it was part of Misako/Goethe's punishment and the Arch-demon is her jailer basically. And it was mandated because she in a previous life destroyed a universe. The same Arch-demon also cursed her for giggles.

edited 1st Jul '15 3:33:51 AM by sabrina_diamond

In an anime, I'll be the Tsundere Dark Magical Girl who likes purple MY own profile is actually HERE!
Faemonic Since: Dec, 2014
#12: Jul 1st 2015 at 5:50:17 AM

The curse has to do with the way it changes her whole personality while under the persona. Basically the longer she stays in the underworld, the more it warps her personality to twisted proportions and she becomes much crueller after her Death Amnesia. As for the curse itself, it was mandated by an Arch-demon.

Basically it was part of Misako/Goethe's punishment and the Arch-demon is her jailer basically. And it was mandated because she in a previous life destroyed a universe. The same Arch-demon also cursed her for giggles.

I don't see why you need a curse if the afterlife already warps people, though. That's like cursing Sisyphus with well-developed biceps.

I'm also confused if Misako is the protagonist and Goethe is the alter ego, or if Goethe is the one who punished Misako. So, I'll continue to call her Alice and call the demon Archie.

From what I understand, Alice was a kind and desexualized sword-slinging tomboy who showed her face and made universe-destroying mistakes.

Alice finds herself in the afterlife underworld, but resurfaces 5000 years later as Dominatrix Alice. Dominatrix Alice is cruel, sexy, whip-snapping, womanly and masqued. She does not remember being any other way.

So, here are some ways that Archie could have cursed her:

  • That Alice return to the world of the living
  • That Alice not remember her past life
  • That Alice not remember the afterlife
  • That Alice never show her face
  • That Alice never be a noble victor (as represented by the sword) but only have a whip as a weapon as ineffective and belonging to those only a little higher than animals or slaves
  • That Alice never do anything for herself or her own forgotten values, but compelled to Archie's agendas of sexuality and destruction

The curse can be broken by:

  • Dominatrix Alice is in the world of the living, and there's a curse-breaker item/person/event somewhere there
  • Dominatrix Alice finding reminders of regular Alice
  • Unlocking the gate to the underworld and dipping in enough for Dominatrix Alice to regain the memories
  • Dominatrix Alice destroying/removing her mask, or somebody else doing that for her either accidentally or in an elaborate Alice-restoring ritual
  • Dominatrix Alice returning to her strengths, her values, and her virtues, especially symbolically as with the sword
  • Something bad happens to Archie, or at least it's bad for Archie but it's good for regular Alice because it means Dominatrix Alice is no more

The consequences of the curse breaking:

  • Regular Alice comes back, embarrassed by her recent behavior
  • Dominatrix Alice finds a synthesis between regular Alice and Dominatrix
  • Archie does something horrible to Alice in retaliation
  • Curse magic does something horrible to Alice in retaliation, like she gets diseased if she removes the doctor's mask
  • Alice dies for trying to free herself
  • There are no negative consequences and everybody lives happily ever after because the curse is gone

Does that help?

edited 1st Jul '15 5:57:26 AM by Faemonic

sabrina_diamond iSanity! from Australia Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
#13: Jul 1st 2015 at 7:13:57 AM

Yes, that is very helpful indeed. Thank you for listing the possibilities! grin

(Update: 21/7 - Starting to get big ideas...)

edited 20th Jul '15 11:58:25 PM by sabrina_diamond

In an anime, I'll be the Tsundere Dark Magical Girl who likes purple MY own profile is actually HERE!
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