Protest in Hong Kong

Large scale pro-democracy protests have begun in Hong Kong.

"...The march comes days after nearly 800,000 residents participated in an informal vote on making the selection of the city’s top official more democratic, an exercise that Beijing dismissed as illegal. It also follows the release last month of a so-called white paper that reasserted the central government’s authority over the semiautonomous territory."

The protest apparently attracted a very large crowd- over one hundred thousand people by some accounts. So far, the protest has been entirely peaceful. NPR has also done a story on it.

And so it begins again...

[Note to the mods: I am opening this in a new thread because the East Asia thread isnt about protests specifically.]

edited 1st Jul '14 5:08:15 AM by demarquis

Honestly, this could be put in that thread. That thread is for all kinds of things related to places like Hong Kong and China, protests included.

But I'll let others decide. You can cross-post there, in any case.

Hong Kong’s Biggest Protest in Decade Calls for Democracy: "...At least 510,000 people took part, Johnson Yeung of rally organizer Civil Human Rights Front told a cheering crowd, while police tallied 98,600 at its peak, broadcaster RTHK said. Both estimates are the most for the annual event since 2004."

I'll be very curious to see where this goes. On the one hand, I wouldn't be surprised if China brought down the hammer. On the other hand, if they manage to become another Singapore, that changes Asia's dynamics greatly....

On the other hand, if China does bring down the hammer on Hong Kong, it'll just worsen China's reputation with its neighbors and the West further, I'd have to guess.

Somehow, I don't think that that would make too much of a difference.

Somewhat more interesting is how these protests affect the "One China, Two Systems" doctrine (assuming that it is still in practice right now) - for those unfamiliar, it means that Hong Kong and Macau would keep their political systems.

Yeah, but they know that would eventually subside. After all, it ain't the first time...

But then again, having only ruled it since 97, they may not care after a certain point. But considering how obsessed they are with the old Imperial boundaries, they probably would...

This comes close after an extremely fractious Chinese visit to Britain, where the UK government was told, in effect, to keep out of HK affairs. The return treaty specifies 50 years of HK keeping its own system...but without anyone fighting Hong Kong's corner, I fear the CPC might decide to hang the treaty and go ahead with their plans for it.

It's also important to note that in the years before Britain handed over Hong Kong in 1997, Britain did a lot of work to promote democracy there...

Despite China's best efforts.

Yeah, I'm expecting this to end in China bringing down the hammer too.

It would make them look more dickish to other nations, but as long as they keep to killing their own people, the international community is sort of fine with that. It's when they start killing other countries' people that we get upset.

There are significant economic implications that the Chinese have to worry about. HK is basically a cash cow for the PRC. They face a brain drain and other consequences if they crack down too hard. Then again, they face serious political implications if they do not.

Another thing to consider is that the goal of the PRC is Taiwan. Hong Kong is supposed to be an example to show Taiwan that she has a way to govern Taiwan without compromising the people's life, ie the "one country, two systems". If they come down too hard it would scare Taiwan off.

Therefore I'd guess that the hammer would come, but not too hard and not in an explicit way.

Hong Kong police arrest 511 democracy protesters at sit-in

After knowing what this dude has done, I call bullshit on his shit.

What has he done? I see both "suggesting Deng Xiaoping (—> among other things, the perpetrator of the Tiananmen Massacre) for Noble Peace Prize" and "lowering job prospects".

I mentioned this in a very old thread, hang on...

Edit: This is what he pulled up several years ago. This is what I posted about it. This is an English site for what the "moral and national education" entails.

Edit edit: And also, this happened after the protests back then.

edited 2nd Jul '14 2:40:14 AM by IraTheSquire

Very good, Hong Kong. Make sure to keep China occupied.

I keep telling myself that China can't be "that" ridiculous, but I can't bring myself to completely discount the idea that someday China will try to claim Singapore.

It'd be an outright war of aggression. And Singapore's military is nothing to sneeze at. They could put up quite a fight. Plus they are on good terms with quite a few other nations who have issues with China so they'd have back up

China would have tohave a monumentally dumb leader to try it.

edited 2nd Jul '14 5:58:49 AM by joesolo

They will have to get through Thailand and Malaysia to get to us. It won't happen unless they decide to imitate Imperial Japan. And really.. other than having a Chinese majority, Singapore is of no more interest to China than, say, Switzerland.

Tiananmen might go down as Deng Xiaoping's greatest mistake, but defining him by Tiananmen alone is doing an injustice to the man who, after all, saved China from Mao's legacy.

Deng was a fuckbag like every other CPC leader.

Statements from the Hong Kong Police Force declare that the protestors were removed because the march was done without prior consent.

Deng's enduring achievement will be to have fused the absolute worst of capitalism's machinery of exploitation with the absolute worst of communism's machinery of repression. I suppose he saw the future.

he, permission to protest. Reminds me of something from a parody "Government Manual for new wizards". While mostly jokes about wizards, obviously, it did sneak in some stuff at government expense.

There was a form for protests which included a extra couple pages under something along the lines of "If you intend to protest against any government policies or practices, please include the names, phone numbers, and home addresses of all participants below"

You ask for permission first it just gives them time to stomp it out.

Here's a press statement released by the HKPF.