DC Comics General

Steve has the two fold problem of an inconsistent character

Sometimes they make him REALLY fucking badass like Badass Normal Captain America greatest covert ops guy on the planet like He'd have Rick Flagg's job if Steve wasn't so good at his

and then other times other writers don't care about him and he doesn't exist cause they want to hook Diana up with either Sups or Bats or ETC

and well

WW continuity has NEVER been a priority at DC, they reboot it every other fucking run... sometimes during the run!

I'm A Pervert not an Asshole!

Yeah, I've noted before on here how I feel a big problem that Wonder Woman faces as a character and franchise is that she's never really been allowed to develop her own vibe, theme, and lore in comparison to Superman and Batman. She's hyper-nebulous once you scratch the surface of her being the anthropomorphic personification of Girl Power. A big part of the issue, I feel, being that she just wasn't ever really suited to the role of third member of the trinity, as Wonder Woman was pretty much just William Moultan Marston's Author Tract for his many radical views about stuff like feminism and BDSM; once Marston was gone, DC tried to rip all that kinda stuff out to make Diana a more general superhero with a more vague feminist ideal, but without the more in-depth stuff you're left with a very shallow concept that nobody can really agree on how to use.

Like, again as I've observed before, Wonder Woman has all these aspects to her that - as written by Marston - were clearly meant to tie into mature and heady topics that Marston covered but which DC is never going to want to subject their "brand name" character to, especially not explicitly. We're never going to see Diana engaging in BDSM sex with her partners, but her main weapon is still a rope for tying people up, for example.

Perhaps this is all why the two best - or at least, only memorable - Wonder Woman comics I can think of in recent times are Grant Morrison's Earth One and Daniel Warren Johnson's Dead Earth; both of which were alternate continuities that dug into the kind of themes that Marston wrote about and tackled them frankly and head-on, rather than just having Diana as a generic You Go, Girl! superheroine.

Wonder Woman Historia: The Amazons is the most critically acclaimed WW book in history. And it doesn't have anything to do with BDSM.

There have also been multiple acclaimed stories that had little or nothing to do with Marston's quirks. I think a lot of people exaggerate just how important Marston's (rather outdated) quirks are to Diana's writing.

I think Steve is just the biggest example of Wonder Woman's supporting cast not really being respected the same way other heroes' casts are.

There was a bit in the late sixties where they wrote a metafictional story getting rid of all of the Wonder Woman supporting characters and that was it. Steve is still pretty consistent, and if we're lucky someone will remember Etta, but that's about it.

TIL Wally and Linda recently had another kid. His name is Wade and he is a CHONKY BABBIE and I already love him.

The pig of Hufflepuff pulsed like a large bullfrog. Dumbledore smiled at it, and placed his hand on its head: "You are Hagrid now."

Interestingly, there's a Golden Age Wonder Woman story where Wonder Woman goes to a costume party and sees a bunch of folks dressed up like other DC heroes, and she notes that a woman dressed like her is dancing with a man dressed like Superman, and she says "Superman dancing with Wonder Woman—How appropriate!" So that idea has been around for a long time, though it's really only since the '80's that it's been used for more than a one-shot story. or a brief moment within a story (like them kissing at the end of "For the Man Who Has Everything").

I don't think the absence of the bondage stuffs are the problem with Wonder Woman at all. Batman and Superman have changed a lot since their golden age days as well and there are plenty of Wonder Woman takes that manage to be well received without that.
For me, Marston very obvious Author Appeal fall in the same bag as silver Age Superman's ocasional jerkassery or early Batman's willingness to hold a gun.

The real problem Wonder Woman have is that she never had a mainstream incarnation that fully solidify her image, supporting cast, and more importantly, rogue gallery in the public consiousness between the 70's show and the DCEU (and the latter would still need to go for a bit longer and didn't establish a consistent setting due to the plot of the films).
The only thing she got between theses was the DCAU, but she was featured here as part of the league, which didn't leave that much room to develop her own corner of things. (and notably popularised the idea of pairing her up with Batman)

With Superman, even someone who have never read a comic in their life knows who Lois Lane, Lex Luthor or Jimmy Olsen are. With Batman, there have not been a single time since the burton movies where there wasn't a oingoing movie or television version of the character. you can ask a random person in the streets who have never picked a comic in their life to give you six Batman vilains and two supporting characters, and they could do it no problem.
Notably, the current ghotic noir image of Gotham isn't based on the original Finger/Kane run, it's based on the Burton movies, The diniverse animated serie, and more recently the Dark Knight trilogy.
Now, what does that have to do with comics Wondy's lack of consistency? Well, with the image of Batman/Superman so firmly ingrained in the public consciousness, editorial is more likely to prevent any writer trying to stray far away from theses profitable, recognizable incarnations. And writers and artists who grew up with theses incarnations of their rogue gallery and supporting cast are likely not going to try and erase them to do their own stuffs. At best they'll try to add their own twists or reimagine them.
With Wonder Woman, any new writers just feel more free to just ignore everything else and do their own thing and exec are more likely to not care.
Compare that to Marvel, for example who desperately try to stop Spiderman from changing (and fail, but that's a conversation from another topic), while on the other hand every new Black Panther writer just want to create their own new supporting cast and ignore everything done by the previous writers.
Long Story short, if WB stopped with Batman and the Joker for two minutes and finally allowed a competent team to make a long running Wonder Woman animated serie in a way that can catch a large audience, this would stop being a issue. (though sadly, even if it did happen nowadays, it wouldn't have the same impact as 20 years ago because audiences are more fractured than they where).

Edited by Smoker130 on Apr 17th 2024 at 11:15:42 AM

I don't particularly want fucking badass Steve Trevor, though I'm not really against it either. But all we as readers need from Steve Trevor are competence and agency. The worst time was the Silver/Bronze age when several creative teams made him outright useless when he wasn't dead.

Wonder Woman usually isn't super nebulous though. Protean, perhaps. What she is at the moment might be up in the air, but double agent spy smasher? That's what she started out as, and it was pretty easy to grasp. Peace maker, boutique owner, non profit figure head, ambassador, ambassador's assistant, Kane Milohai/Pele's champion, queen, there have been times between those things where what is she even doing? (Her whole nation is up and gone? Time to dabble in private investigations, and bake some tacos!), but Post Crisis those periods of time have thankfully been the minority. Lot's of different jobs, but usually a job nonetheless. Not just rahrah go women!

I don't know how you got Dead Earth as a good example of what the character is supposed to be. I'm not arguing that it is a bad story, but The Dark Knight Returns is not a definitive Batman outing, even though people think it is a good story. Quite the opposite, those are extreme circumstance that test characters in unusual ways. Those kinds of stories are like firefighters responding to a truck falling off a bridge.. The crew will arrive if no one else is available, probably do an adequate job, but that's not what they're for. Like the police aren't supposed to handle animal control, but they'll do it if they have to, Wonder Woman isn't supposed to be about irradiated wastelands most of the time. She's not supposed to be too good for a cruel petty world, most of the time.

That's why he wants you to have the money. Not so you can buy 14 Cadillacs but so you can help build up the wastes

Plot details and synopsis for Absolute Power and tie-ins are unveiled

We are getting a new Amazo robot.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

The character designs for this event are baller.

I guess Atlantis' democracy didn't last long... and neither did Mera on the throne.

The Protomen enhanced my life.

Arthur can't get a vacation without the place falling apart.

Wake me up at your own risk.

Also since you making pages for Aquaman stories, I recently finished Aquaman Andromeda and its a fun read.

Cool cosmic horror Aquaman, and plus its the first Black Label Aquaman story so it be pretty rad to make a page out of it.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

I started an Aquaman: Andromeda page for you! :) It's been a while since I read it—I remember my main criticism was 'not enough Aquaman'—but I did remember enough to trope it some.

The Protomen enhanced my life.

Nice thanks, I appreciate it.

I just noticed as others pointed out, AP's plot is similar to Dark Knights Metal.

An organization of evil counterparts to the Justice League, only instead of evil Batman with the JL's powers its evil robots.

Though the robots are crested by Amazo so there is an evil Batman like Batman Who Laughs.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

Blue Beetle packs it up on July 2024 at 11 issues.

BB's writer Josh Trujilo shares a good-bye message.

(*punches a wall in frustration*)

That sucks I was really enjoying this Beetle run.

Is the scarab magic or alien tech?

I keep forgetting.

One Strip! One Strip!

Pretty sure they opted for alien tech, since the preceding miniseries brought the Reach back.

Trujillo's run seems to be going for the middle ground they should've gone with to begin with, having the Scarab be Magitek. So it is alien tech and all the Reach lore is firmly canon, but there is some magical elements as well so the lore about mummies and such from the original Blue Beetle comics is canon too.

Edited by immortaleditor on Apr 19th 2024 at 10:53:34 AM

Meanwhile, Primer spray paints again in a new miniseries, this time with the Teen Titans...and their appearance might trigger some nostalgia neurons for you guys.

Prep time....for Superman.

Honestly, I'm kinda with Bruce on this one. I mean, why does Superman even need that kind of prep. At most he should just be looking for ways to counter Bruce's prep, not infecting him with a virus.

One Strip! One Strip!

Silver age Superman was a monster of prep time sometimes.

Secret Signature

Plus, didn't he need prep time to fight The Elite in WSFATJATAW and Superman vs. the Elite?

I've never seen "What's so Funny about Truth, Justice, and the American Way?" abbreviated like that but somehow it took me only 5 seconds to decipher it.

Well, Supes did have prep time in that case (but only to limit collateral damage and sell the ruse, not to beat up the Elite).