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Ukraine protests: Thousands march through capital- over 100,000 by some counts

Ukrainian protesters besiege government building

Clashes amid huge Ukraine protest against U-turn on EU

Over 300,000 defy protest ban in Ukraine- "Fierce clashes erupt after protesters take to streets again, chanting "revolution" as anger against government grows."

What started as a protest against the decision not to sign an agreement with the EU seems to have escalated into a "Color Revolution" or "Arab Spring" style movement to force the government to resign. By some reports, the police are using violent tactics to suppress the street protests.

The Western half of the Ukraine has historically felt closer to Europe , and wants to move Ukrainian society in that direction. Eastern Ukraine feels culturally closer to Russia, and favors closer relations with that country. The current regime of President Viktor Yanukovich is part of that camp. The current confrontations can be seen as a clash between these two halves of Ukrainian society.


EDIT (2/24/2022)

This thread was originally opened in 2013 during the beginning of the revolt in Ukraine that eventually over-threw the dictatorship of the Yanukovyich regime and instituted democratic elections soon afterward. As of this writing, in the aftermath of the Russian invasion that began on 2/23, it is not clear whether or for how long Ukraine will continue to exist as an independent country.

Statements made nine years ago still seem relevant: "The Western half of the Ukraine has historically felt closer to Europe , and wants to move Ukrainian society in that direction. Eastern Ukraine feels culturally closer to Russia, and favors closer relations with that country... The current confrontations can be seen as a clash between these two halves of Ukrainian society." Some people have expressed the view that the confrontation between Russia and Ukraine, beginning in 2014, never really ended.

The invasion is also a result of certain grievances proclaimed by Vladimir Putin, the current President of Russia, and used by him as justification for armed attack and occupation. Western governments, and others around the world, have joined together in condemnation of this attack.

While we do not know what the ultimate outcome of these events will be, this thread will continue to be made available as a place to record news, ask questions and express opinions about the "Crisis in Ukraine."

This map will help track the latest developments.

Do not post anything about the Ukrainian military movement and strategy. This could actually result in casualties.

No discussion regarding nuclear war. As nuclear weapons are not being used by either side, nuclear war is off-topic.

When posting social media links, please (1) state the source [e.g. Reuters reporter? State-sponsored Facebook account? Civilian Twitter?] (2) clarify if it is fact or opinion and (3) summarize the information being presented.

Edited by Tabs on Mar 20th 2022 at 4:26:26 AM

TerminusEst from the Land of Winter and Stars Since: Feb, 2010
#9276: Jun 27th 2017 at 8:12:51 AM

Ukrainian banks, electricity firm hit by fresh cyber attack

A number of Ukrainian banks and companies, including the state power distributor, were hit by a cyber attack on Tuesday that disrupted some operations, the Ukrainian central bank said.

The latest disruptions follow a spate of hacking attempts on state websites in late-2016 and repeated attacks on Ukraine's power grid that prompted security chiefs to call for improved cyber defenses.

The central bank said an "unknown virus" was to blame for the latest attacks, but did not give further details or say which banks and firms had been affected.

"As a result of these cyber attacks these banks are having difficulties with client services and carrying out banking operations," the central bank said in a statement.

"The central bank is confident that the banking infrastructure's defense against cyber fraud is properly set up and attempted cyber attacks on banks' IT systems will be neutralized," it said.

Oschadbank, one of Ukraine's largest state-owned lenders, said some of its services had been affected by a "hacking attack" but guaranteed that customer data was safe.

Ukrainian state power distributor Ukrenergo said its IT system had been hit by a cyber attack, but the disruption had no impact on power supplies or its broader operations.

Ukraine has blamed Russia for previous cyber attacks, including one on its power grid at the end of 2015 that left part of western Ukraine temporarily without electricity.

Cyber security experts consider Russia one of the world's most advanced cyber powers, along with the United States, China, Israel, France and Britain.

Relations between Kiev and the Kremlin collapsed in 2014 following Moscow's annexation of Crimea and support for pro-Russian separatists in eastern Ukraine, where fighting continues despite a ceasefire agreement.

Russia denies carrying out cyber attacks on Ukraine and allegations it has fueled the eastern conflict by suppling rebels with troops and weapons.

Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
TerminusEst from the Land of Winter and Stars Since: Feb, 2010
#9277: Jun 29th 2017 at 11:36:31 PM

The Petya ransomware is starting to look like a cyberattack in disguise

Suspicions are mounting that this was a nation-state actor, although the evidence so far is largely circumstantial.

Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
FluffyMcChicken My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare from where the floating lights gleam Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: In another castle
My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare
#9278: Jul 19th 2017 at 2:11:15 PM

Washington Post: Ukrainian separatists claim to have created a new country: Malorossiya, or ‘Little Russia’

Separatists in eastern Ukraine claimed Tuesday to have founded a new country — Malorossiya, which means “Little Russia” in English — that they hope will eventually overtake Ukraine.

“We offer Ukrainian citizens a peaceful way out of the difficult situation, without the war,” Alexander Zakharchenko, leader of the self-proclaimed Donetsk People's Republic, told reporters during a surprise announcement. “This is our last offer not only to the Ukrainians, but also to all countries that supported the civil war in Donbass.”

The move seems to undermine the faltering Minsk peace agreement, a 2015 deal reached between Russian-backed rebels and the government in Kiev that sought to end the violence in Ukraine's industrial east. News of the Malorossiya proposal quickly drew condemnation from the international community, with Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko calling the Donetsk People's Republic “a puppet show that broadcasts messages from Russia.”

Notably, both Russia and other separatist movements in eastern Ukraine also distanced themselves from the move, with the self-proclaimed Luhansk People's Republic saying it was not notified ahead of time about the announcement and that discussions about the project were “untimely.”

Despite this, the proclamation of Malorossiya was dubbed a “historic event” by the Donetsk People's Republic. In a map released by the separatists, all of Ukraine was portrayed as part of Malorossiya with the sole exception of Crimea, the peninsula annexed by Russia in March 2014. Kiev would remain a “historical and cultural center without the capital city status” in the new state, according to the separatists' statement Tuesday, but Donetsk would be the new political center of Malorossiya.

The Donetsk People's Republic also released a flag, which it said was based on that of Bogdan Khmelnitsky, a 17th-century Ukrainian Cossack leader who organized a rebellion against Polish rule and transferred Ukrainian lands to Russian control.

The rhetoric behind Malorossiya draws on the complicated history of Ukraine. Much of what now makes up the country was once part of the Russian Empire and later the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic, a part of the Moscow-dominated Soviet Union, until it gained independence in 1991.

Many people in eastern Ukraine are ethnically Russian and speak the Russian language. Many Russians also hail their own historical links to Ukrainian land and the Kievan Rus, an East Slavic state that peaked in the 11th century and was centered upon what is now the Ukrainian capital.

As tensions flared between Kiev and Russian-backed rebels in 2014, separatists began to talk about the concept of Novorossiya — a concept that means “new Russia” in English. The name referred to what is now the east of Ukraine — lands that were taken from the Ottoman Empire by the Russian Empire in the late 18th century. Russian President Vladimir Putin referred to the historical concept during a December 2014 question-and-answer session.

However, Malorossiya is different from Novorossiya. The word is thought to date back as far as the medieval era, but came into widespread use under the Russian Empire in the 19th century when it was used to describe the land that now makes up Ukraine. The term has long been considered archaic in Ukraine itself; some nationalists use it disparagingly, and it is sometimes used as an insult to describe Russified Ukrainians in the country's east.

Importantly, the word is used to refer to almost of all of Ukraine rather than the eastern provinces that made up Novorossiya — implying increased ambitions for the Donetsk People's Republic. Zakhar Prilepin, a Russian writer who formed a volunteer battalion for the Donetsk People's Republic, told the Komsomolskaya Pravda newspaper that the ultimate aim of Malorossiya was to merge with both Russia and Belarus.

Despite these lofty ideals, there were signs that the announcement of Malorossiya was rushed. The statement announcing the proposed country referred to "19 regions of the former Ukraine” — an apparent error as Ukraine has 24 administrative regions and the Malorossiya map showed all these regions accurately. Documents claiming to mark the official establishment of the country were riddled with red squiggly lines, suggesting that they were images taken hastily from word-processing software.

More strikingly, although the news was covered exhaustively by Russian state media Tuesday, Moscow said it did not support Zakharchenko's calls for Malorossiya, and there was little sign of backing from other separatists.

Kremlin press secretary Dmitry Peskov distanced Russia from Malorossiya, telling reporters that the proposed country was a “personal initiative” of Zakharchenko. “Moscow learned about it from the press,” Peskov said. Boris Gryzlov, Russia's envoy for the Minsk talks, also Russian told journalists that the proposal was “likely related to informational warfare and is not a subject of real politics.”

Although there seems little prospect of Malorossiya becoming a recognized country anytime soon, Tuesday's announcement highlights that little progress has been made in finding a solution to the conflict in eastern Ukraine since the Minsk agreement came into force in 2015. And Zakharchenko seemed undeterred by the low feasibility of his plan.

“I am convinced that we will do everything possible and impossible,” Zakharchenko told reporters Tuesday.

Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#9279: Jul 24th 2017 at 3:48:16 AM

BBC reports pro-separatist individuals from North America/UK crowdfunding to help in the fight against Ukraine and to support the east.

A former perk featured in an American fighter's crowdfunding is to give a tour of Donbass after it's liberated from fascists.

Kickstarter and other crowdsourcing sites are already cracking down on them.

Krieger22 Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018 from Malaysia Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: I'm in love with my car
Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018
#9281: Sep 10th 2017 at 2:54:47 PM

Mikheil Saakashvili is trying to reenter Ukraine from Poland, following the cancellation of his passport and his sacking from the position of mayor of Odessa.

KYIV — Mikheil Saakashvili, the feisty former Georgian president and ex-governor of Ukraine's Odesa region, is gathering forces in Warsaw ahead of an attempt to reenter Ukraine from Poland — a move that could escalate the showdown between him and his former ally, Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko.

Saakashvili, who was granted citizenship by Poroshenko in 2015 to assume the post of Odesa governor only to have the president strip him of the status while out of the country in July, has said he will try to reenter Ukraine through the Krakovets border crossing in the Lviv region on September 10.

It appears he will be traveling with an entourage.

Polarizing former Ukrainian Prime Minister Yulia Tymoshenko, currently head of the opposition Batkivshchyna (Fatherland) party in Ukraine's parliament, said on Ukraine's News One channel that she would "personally" join Saakashvili.

Mustafa Nayyem, a reformist lawmaker and Poroshenko critic, said that he, too, would walk with him. Many more people — including European parliament members, activists, and journalists, according to Saakashvili's press service — are expected to follow along with the group in prearranged buses.

A beefed-up border-guard presence is expected to be waiting for them. RFE/RL's Ukrainian Service published video showing barbed-wire fences set up at Krakovets, while the security news site Info Resist posted images taken at the border crossing of what appeared to be a military vehicle hidden by camouflage netting.

.

His Plan B?

If Ukraine does refuse to let him pass, Saakashvili may live in a tent on the Ukrainian-Polish border, one member of his Movement of New Forces reportedly told the Kyiv Post newspaper on Sept. 4.

I have disagreed with her a lot, but comparing her to republicans and propagandists of dictatorships is really low. - An idiot
Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#9282: Sep 10th 2017 at 11:37:30 PM

Saw photos of NG soldiers "greeting" him by blocking the border gate.


Found some videos taken in 2014 in Crimea regarding how Russian special forces secured the area.

edited 11th Sep '17 4:56:29 AM by Ominae

FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#9283: Sep 11th 2017 at 6:23:26 PM

Saakashvili is really starting to worry me. He has Yulia at his back, and Poroshenko is not very popular....

Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#9284: Sep 11th 2017 at 7:19:10 PM

No doubt he was "welcomed" into Ukraine.


http://khpg.org/en/index.php?id=1504824908

Kharkiv Human Rights has more information on what happened to Pavlo Hrib after being lured out of Ukraine and charged as a terrorist.

Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#9285: Sep 15th 2017 at 3:32:30 AM

http://www.ecfr.eu/article/commentary_putins_peacekeepers_beware_of_russians_bearing_gifts

ECFR has a report on being skeptical towards his proposal for peacekeepers in Donbass.

Deadbeatloser22 from Disappeared by Space Magic (Great Old One) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
#9286: Sep 15th 2017 at 3:39:20 AM

>Russian special forces

Don't you mean local militia?

"Yup. That tasted purple."
TerminusEst from the Land of Winter and Stars Since: Feb, 2010
#9287: Sep 15th 2017 at 3:53:36 AM

[up]

A mix of both. The first ones to move were these guys, thanks to the skill and armaments they were pegged as SOF almost immediately. Whether there were any actual militias is a moot point now.

Generally thought that the parliament and key locations were seized by SOF, regular military secured the rest.

edited 15th Sep '17 3:57:43 AM by TerminusEst

Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#9288: Sep 15th 2017 at 5:08:10 AM

https://en.lb.ua/news/2017/09/14/4500_pavlo_hrybs_abduction_russian.html

An analysis of kidnapping Hryb by the FSB in a black op.

Apparently, the courts charged him in absentia.

Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#9289: Nov 24th 2017 at 7:24:49 AM

OSCE has released a report with observers spotting military vehicles heading to Luhansk. The civilian cars in the convoy have no plates.

Internet/social media access was restricted.

http://defence-blog.com/army/osce-observed-the-military-convoy-moving-in-the-direction-of-luhansk-city-in-ukraine.html

Krieger22 Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018 from Malaysia Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: I'm in love with my car
Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018
#9290: Dec 6th 2017 at 11:08:27 AM

Meanwhile in Saakashvili's Continued Misadventures

Ukrainian supporters of former Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili freed him from a police van on Tuesday after his detention on suspicion of assisting a criminal organisation led to clashes with police in Kiev.

Once freed, Saakashvili raised a hand in a V-for-victory sign — a handcuff still dangling from his wrist as he stood in a melee of supporters. He then led protesters towards parliament, where he called defiantly for President Petro Poroshenko to be removed from office.

Prosecutors said they would make all efforts to regain custody of Saakashvili but the chaotic scenes of his detention and escape are likely to undermine the image of stability that Ukraine’s leadership are keen to present to foreign backers.

Ukrainian prosecutors suspect Saakashvili of receiving financing from a criminal group linked to former president Viktor Yanukovich which planned to overthrow the current government.

He could face up to five years if found guilty. Saakashvili is also wanted in Georgia on criminal charges which he says were trumped up for political reasons.

I have disagreed with her a lot, but comparing her to republicans and propagandists of dictatorships is really low. - An idiot
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#9291: Dec 8th 2017 at 3:26:54 PM

Police recaptured him, now there are protests...

I feel like he's trying to rerun the Rose Revolution. Saakashvili shouldn't be anywhere near the levers of power in Ukraine. The amount of chaos that man could cause, Kiev would probably end up bifuricated or something.

edited 8th Dec '17 3:27:19 PM by FFShinra

TerminusEst from the Land of Winter and Stars Since: Feb, 2010
#9293: Dec 23rd 2017 at 3:57:51 AM

X-posting from military thread:

US will provide anti-tank weapons to Ukraine, State Dept. official says

(CNN)The US is going to provide anti-tank weapons to Ukraine, a senior State Department official told CNN.

The State Department officially announced Friday evening that the US was going to provide Ukraine with "enhanced defensive capabilities as part of our effort to help Ukraine build its long-term defense capacity, to defend its sovereignty and territorial integrity, and to deter further aggression," but the statement from spokeswoman Heather Nauert said it was not going to give any further details

The State Department said the "US assistance is entirely defensive in nature, and as we have always said, Ukraine is a sovereign country and has a right to defend itself."

Members of Congress and the US-backed Ukrainian government had long requested anti-tank weapons to boost Kiev in its fight against Russian-backed separatists.

This is another development from the US that Russia is expected to criticize. Some experts told CNN that Russia could use this move as a pretext to take further action in Ukraine, after its invasion and annexation of the Crimea region in 2014. US allowing Ukraine to buy arms from US companies

The move comes amid a recent uptick in clashes between Ukrainian soldiers and Russian-backed separatists, and the same week the Trump administration announced it would permit sales of some small arms to Ukraine from US manufacturers.

Secretary of State Rex Tillerson had discussed the recent escalation in clashes in a phone call Friday with Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko, according to an official readout issued by the Ukrainian government.

The statement says Poroshenko thanked Tillerson for "the prolongation of sanctions against Russia" and for "the consistent support of Washington regarding the increase of Ukraine's defense capacity."

The statement also said that "Tillerson emphasized that the US would further support Ukraine."

On Wednesday the Trump administration had announced it was allowing the export of some small arms to Ukraine. Nauert said the department notified Congress on December 13 that it had approved an export license, which allows Ukraine to buy certain light weapons and small arms from US manufacturers.

"The US government is not selling the Ukrainian government these weapons," she said. The US has not provided lethal defensive equipment to Ukraine, Nauert said, nor has it ruled out doing so.

Following that announcement, the chairman of the Armed Services Committee, Sen. John Mc Cain of Arizona, issued a statement calling on Trump "to authorize additional sales of defensive lethal weapons, including anti-tank munitions," to Ukraine.

Anti-tank weapons have long been seen as a critical capability to allow the Ukrainian military to combat the armored vehicles in the possession of the separatists, equipment that US officials say is supplied by Russia.

"Vladimir Putin has chosen war instead of peace in Ukraine. So long as he makes this choice, the United States and the Free World should give Ukraine what it needs to fight back," Mc Cain added.

Russian Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova responded to reports that the US and Canada have decided to allow weapons exports to Ukraine by accusing Washington and Ottawa of making false claims about the conflict in Ukraine as a "pretext to begin large-scale lethal weapons deliveries to Ukraine."

Zakharova went on to say arming Ukraine would further inflame tensions and push Ukraine "towards reckless new military decisions."

Nauert had also addressed the conflict in Ukraine on Tuesday, saying, "Russia and its proxies are the source of violence in eastern Ukraine, and the Russian government continues to perpetuate an active conflict and humanitarian crisis through its leadership and supply of military forces on the ground."

Nauert said the US continued to call on Russia to withdraw its forces and weaponry from Ukraine.

Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
Grafite Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: Less than three
#9294: Dec 23rd 2017 at 12:14:57 PM

[up] Now watch as Putin complains how unfair it is that he can't send tanks to a rival country without consequences and the populace goes along with it saying it's more of the US' "imperialism".

Life is unfair...
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#9295: Dec 23rd 2017 at 12:25:18 PM

Good, we should've been sending them weapons the second Russia started supporting the separatists.

"Sandwiches are probably easier to fix than the actual problems" -Hylarn
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#9296: Dec 23rd 2017 at 12:39:36 PM

[up][up]It is imperialism, just as much as Russia's actions are. Ukraine is not in NATO nor the EU. Aiding them is entirely for the purpose of splitting them off of Moscow, as was the agreement that kicked off this crisis in the first place. The subtlety of one and the blatantness of the other do not change that its both imperialism.

Also, the Russians now have the excuse they need to escalate this, especially since Syria is no longer distracting them.

Grafite Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: Less than three
#9297: Dec 23rd 2017 at 12:55:00 PM

[up] Or maybe they're doing it to protect a nation from another invading country, those are Mc Cain's motivations, for example.

Anyway, what was the excuse when the tanks first started rolling in? The situation was already there before the US decided to intervene today, Russia is not doing this to get a stab at the United States.

edited 23rd Dec '17 1:00:27 PM by Grafite

Life is unfair...
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#9298: Dec 23rd 2017 at 1:49:29 PM

No nation has such high ideals. Individuals might, but nations act out of interest.

This all started when the EU tried to outwardly entice Yanukovich into leaving the Russian sphere of influence via an economic agreement with them, one that was exclusive, so he couldn't just accept it and also be friendly with Russia. And unlike how the media likes to portray him nowadays, the guy was seriously considering it (as a way to balance against Russia) before Russia bullied him into not doing so through economic carrots and sticks and then the Europeans forced him out for not doing so by funding opponents like Yatsenyuk, having the media portray Tymoshenko as some sort of political martyr, and covering the Maidan protests like it was 1989 all over again rather than regionalism gone mad (there were protests in both east and west Ukraine...against each other). Russia escalates by taking Crimea, and then so on and so forth.

Europe for its trouble, meanwhile, has a the corrupt candy king to deal with, who is not doing much to turn Ukraine around. Yatsenyuk has left the government in disgust, there is now possibility of unrest and infighting among the pro-West side in the form of Saakashvili. Yulia Tymoshenko, despite being no less corrupt, is turning into the last hope Brussels has in having a partner that is at least somewhat tolerable and also pro-West. Because a rampant and dangerous strain of nationalism has developed in Western Ukraine, now they are beefing with the Poles over issues of genocide dating back to WWII, who are probably the greatest cheerleaders within the EU to get their support for the pro-Western order in Kiev.

The reforms that were supposed to happen are not happening. The EU and the IMF are doling out money for increasingly diminished returns. At this point, hope and momentum are the only reasons this program is continuing. Not to mention, opening up the markets to Ukrainian workers is just not feasible right now given the issues with refugees and economic migrants overwhelming the labor pool and the concurrent rising nationalism.

Things were at least going to settle into a frozen conflict stalemate however. That way the EU and Russia could eventually move on from what has become a white elephant for them in terms of foreign policy. Now, because Trump thinks this will somehow prove he is not colluding with Moscow back on the domestic front, he agrees to up the ante with these weapons. Putin isn't going to just sit and whine about it like you seem to think. He will escalate, and Trump will not be willing to get into it for a country he doesn't care about, if only because he doesn't want Russia to get even more media coverage and thus draw more attention to the investigation.

Ominae Since: Jul, 2010
#9299: Dec 23rd 2017 at 6:09:00 PM

The SD announced the backing of selling Barrett M82s to Ukrainian forces.

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#9300: Dec 23rd 2017 at 10:11:16 PM

Individuals might, but nations act out of interest.

Nations act because the individuals that make up their desicion making bodies choose to do so, you can’t ignore the environmental, cultural and occasionally even personal factors that impact that.

Which you actually don’t, as you grant that this isn’t being done because of US national interest, it’s being done out of personal interest for Trump and other Republicans (it’s a good way to look tough on Russia without doing anything domestically).

In the end you’re right though, this is another escalation, Sure in a vacuum it might sound good and be moral, but there’s a greater moral weight to consider, the moral weight of not dumping fuel onto a finally smouldering fire.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran

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