Arrow. Green Arrow tv show.

Oh, so THAT'S who those were. I know the second one is Vibe, but who's the first?

The other is the New 52 version of Killer Frost.

Ravager is now Slade's daughter, in the sense that she was reborn through him.

Saw the Roy thing coming from a mile away.

I loved Ollie's face when he realized his old man had been there first.

Ok, I'm not happy with what they did with Isabel's character. They basically turned her from an interesting character with unclear, but interesting motivations, to a sexist stereotype defined by a man who she had a thing with years ago and is now dead. Like, she's still cool, but I'm bothered.

Honestly...I'm not sure how long I will keep watching the show. The writing becomes more and more contrived and boring, the characters unlikable, and on top of this the sexist writing... This episode for example: Is there a particular reason why Moira couldn't Oliver about Isabel? He already knew that his father had affairs, and it certainly wouldn't make Moira look bad, so why? Why exactly does Laurel need a whole episode to figure out what she suspected but discarded in the past (with the help of a doctor who just ignores the whole idea of patient confidentiality). On top of this the whole "we have to do that now or we loose everything" nonsense....I have said it in the past, but it bears repeating: The private assets and the company assets of the Queen family should be two separate entities. The company might go bankrupt and the family would still be rich.

To be fair, most of Isabel's character in her comic counterpart is also defined by Ollie's dad, so the show can't entirely be blamed for its own source material: http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Isabel_Rochev_(New_Earth)

I for one really enjoyed this episode. Slade's a d*ck but I love him anyway. Poor Roy though.

Ok, fair enough, but it still bothers me, even if I now have someone else to blame for the sexism.

Other than that misogyny, I actually really liked this episode, and I can't wait for Flash.

I am holding out a tiny hope that Isabel was lying her ass off. Not the "I used to bang your father" bit, but the whole "And he was my One True Love!" bit? I really hope that is just a line she was selling Ollie, because eughghgggg.

Yeah, my response to that was just an "No... Just... No..."

What's the trope for pushing the entire world down into darkness so that heroic nature of the jerk ass hero isn't an informed attribute?

Black-and-Grey Morality?

Episode was clunky as hell but I think Vibe and Killer Frost were the worst parts.

I really like the casting and I think they'll be fine on Flash but they were way too expository and out of place on Arrow and Felicity suddenly knowing all about them was really awkward and way too shoehorned.

I hope they let both shows do their own thing from here on.

Keep getting the feeling recently that there's a lack of solid plan with this show ? It just feels like they're throwing stuff out there.

Slade and his love for Shado. Merlyn. The sudden cure. Even Isabel's motivation.

It's as if they know what they want to do but have no patience to build it up. Just throwing up ideas and twists.

Yeah...contrived plot twists combined with a lot of stalling.

Don't they make it up as they along? At least that's what I heard.

They have a plan for the endpoint of the season but what happens between the season premiere and season finale they make it up as they go a long.

Certainly feels that way, like Lance getting out of jail in the last episode. That went nowhere. Obviously some things are planned, like Slade = Bad but the details are filled in as they go.

It's a shame. I think it's a drawback to the show. I hope they use the break to season three to draft a plan for it.

edited 18th Apr '14 8:09:46 AM by Anteres

But doesn't making things up as you go along make it easier to toss characters under the bus if their actors give you any lip?

Mayhaps but another suggestion might be be nice to your actors... and lock them into contracts so you can sue.

Walk softly and carry a legal department.

This episode might have also taken a hit from the fact that plans changed about it being the backdoor pilot to the Flash show; they probably had to rewrite it on short notice once those plans came down from the executives.

The plans were for episode 20 to be the backdoor pilot. This was episode 19 but yeah it does make sense they had to change their plans for an episode.

Andrew Kreisberg talks about the rest of Season 2 and what they are looking forward to with Season 3.

“That plays out in the last five episodes,” Kreisberg said. “And we’re going to start Season 3 with Oliver in very different circumstances than he’s been before, which, obviously, him being in different circumstances changes the circumstances of his paid bodyguard [Diggle] and his paid assistant [Felicity] since he can no longer pay them.”

Kreisberg also said Arrow Season 3 will have a different feel than previous seasons, comparing it to classic series like Buffy The Vampire Slayer and Angel where you can now tune in for different seasons and see the varied feel and tone to them.

And, yes, he also mentioned there will be new sets in the third season, too.

edited 18th Apr '14 11:16:16 AM by Halberdier17

Um... how did season 2 feel different from season 1?

Aside from Season 1 starting out weak and ending strong and Season 2 starting strong and ending weak (so far), I mean.

Season Two is really really different because Ollie feels worse about killing people.