General Disney Princess Discussion

I actually kind of liked Moana more than Zootopia. -prepares to have things thrown at him-

No I get that. People keep praising Zootopia's metaphor but to me the metaphor is so vague that it doesn't hold up well. Yes a lot of people see it as a metaphor for racism but it can also be seen as one for homophobia, sexism, etc. Moana at least tells one story and tells it well.

It's really clear from the characters' remarks and seeming "post-racial" context that it's meant to be about racism. The metaphor wouldn't work at all with homophobia; we are not yet close to a "post-homophobia world", at least, not in the same way "post-racial" is used.

edited 23rd Mar '17 4:42:23 PM by Tuckerscreator

Zootopia's basic metaphor kinda fails when you look closely at it because predator animals do have predatory instincts, and were designed by nature to be hunters and devourers of other animals, while human races are another matter altogether, and no race is more or less prone to savagery and crime than the others.

That makes the intended comparison still good intentioned but flawed.

I think that attitude takes everything far too literally. It's like complaining about Maus because in real life cats are beloved, useful pets and mice are pests that ruin food.

Maybe, but in Maus, the characters are pretty much humans with animal heads. Zootopia keeps making much more of a point on the animals' instincts and biological dispositions, making the point harder to ignore. Willing Suspension of Disbelief is one thing, but then the movie itself keeps calling attention on that plot point.

Look, any story using metaphors to make a point will invariably fall apart when taken too literally and that's why the metaphors shouldn't be taken too literally. This is a very, very, very old and common thing to fantasy and science fiction in general, and Zootopia is hardly the first. Are you going to complain about all of them?

edited 23rd Mar '17 8:01:49 PM by Nightwire

And this is why Demetrios was perfectly justified when he wrote -prepares to have things thrown at him-

Hey now, leave me out of this.

I've mentioned this before, but I don't think that holds up in Zootopia because it's explicitly stated that the predation age was during their equivalent of the Stone Age. In other words, no prey has been in danger from predators for tens of thousands of years. No one has ever seen a predator eat someone in all of recorded history. Whatever instincts there were originally have been forgotten around the same time that woolly mammoths lost their coats and sloths shrank and migrated to trees.

edited 24th Mar '17 2:10:35 PM by Tuckerscreator

I've always found the "the setting of Zootopia doesn't exactly line up with the real world, ergo it can't actually be an analogy to real world issues" to be rather silly.

That's is, after all, not how metaphor works. It's like saying Animal Farm isn't an analogy to the Russian Revolution because the real life Stalin didn't actually turn himself into a Tsar the way Snowball made himself more human.

And either way, as I remember it that whole line of reasoning comes from people overreacting en masse to a small handful of poor reviews that were, themselves, badly interpreting the movie.

edited 23rd Mar '17 11:25:24 PM by KnownUnknown

Speaking of the Princesses, I recently remembered one of my favorite memories. My mom stopped an argument my younger brother and I would have had before it happened.

Here's what happened. This one afternoon a few odd years ago, my mom, aunt, brother, one of my cousins, and I were all having lunch together at my grandma's favorite restaurant. My aunt and I were discussing fun things to do at Walt Disney World (her husband likes to go on a lot of vacations, and Walt Disney World is one of his favorite places to go). For one of them, I said that if I were to see or meet the Princesses, I would blush like an anime character, which my mom and aunt thought sounded cute and sweet. :) My brother, on the other hand, very sternly said my name, like he was going to start an argument. Our mom quickly cut him off and said "Now now, be nice," and nothing came of it.

Alright, I think I'm gonna wake this thread back up, because I found the perfect thing to do so!

Hey, that looks cool. :)

HOLY CR*P. That's beautiful and creative!

I'd kinda like to see if Moana could pull off a more traditional dress. If she's ever officially inducted into the fold, I have to wonder what kind of redesign they'd go for. Also if she'd largely go barefoot like Aurora and Rapunzel sometimes do.

Or they might just fancy up the outfit she already has, like they did with Pocahontas.

I am wondering if Disney even cares much about the Disney Princess lineup. They haven't been pushing it as much since the Frozen franchise blew up.

Have you heard the latest? Apparently there's a Disney Princess Lingerie line now. As in, for adult women. Not sure if this is real or a hoax. (I won't provide a link in case that's forbidden.) I don't mind it, but I wonder why Disney would allow it, its caused some controversy already.

Same reason why cutesy costumes with an edge fly off the shelves in Halloween.

-on second thought, removing this line before I get in trouble-

edited 11th Apr '17 4:19:26 PM by Demetrios

Happy National Princess Week!

edited 24th Apr '17 7:42:51 PM by Demetrios

Huh. Didn't know that was a thing.

Neither did I until a year or two ago.

Alright, Let Me Get This Straight......

Whenever there was a new addition to the Disney Princess lineup, they would receive a coronation ceremony to officially induct them into the Royal Court, with Tiana, Rapunzel, and Merida all getting official coronations. People naturally assumed that Anna and Elsa would receive coronations as well, but that never came to be, and the sisters made sporadic appearances in Disney Princess-labeled media, marketing, and merchandise while mostly selling under the Frozen banner. It then became Common Knowledge that Anna and Elsa didn't join the Disney Princesses due to Frozen being such a Cash-Cow Franchise in its own right.

That seemed to make sense until Moana, and to a certain extent Elena, hit the scene. They were also assumed to be joining the lineup, but time passed and nothing happened. Elena and Moana have since also made sporadic appearances in Disney Princess-labeled media, marketing, and merchandise, with no word on whether or not that speaks for their inclusion into the lineup. This is especially head-scratching since Moana and Elana of Avalor don't seem to have become enormous cash cows like Frozen did.

It's very conspicuous the Walt Disney Company has this famous banner made to assemble all of their most popular and beloved heroines, and has yet to officially include all these newcomers who appear to check all the marks for induction. Perhaps the Mouse House does consider them Disney Princesses, but isn't concerning themselves with making it official because they don't believe their target audience will? Is there any word on this?

edited 22nd May '17 3:30:22 PM by Noah1