Would that it were so simple.
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I like the Death Star, the original that the Empire poured their best and brightest into, only to see that taken away and the resources spent squandered. A decent Deconstruction of massive defense spending projects, writ large, that end up just being wastes of resources. The second one was meh, and was the inspiration for the superweapon-of-the-day Imperial Remnant from the mid-90s EU.
For me it's a problem with a fully built and operational superweapon and used as a surprise. Something that massive is difficult to keep a secret, and ANH starts off with the heroes aware of it and in possession of vital intel. The Death Star II was still in construction, making the heroes feel proactive by learning about it and making a pre-emptive attack. Starkiller Base just shows up in the middle of the film with no prior set-up.
I think there was one capital cruiser in the EU with a significantly scaled down version of the super laser, which I think is much better writing than another ostentatious construction project. I was thinking that TFA would have been massively improved via a "Sink the Bismark" battle instead of Death Star III.
That was the Eclipse from Dark Empire IIRC.
The original Death Star is amazing, but Starkiller Base gets cool points for literally being part of the planet. Presumably, the First Order had to do a lot of heavy engineering in order to make that happen.
I wonder what the planet was called originally? All we know is that it isn't Ilum, but it's nearby.
Would that it were so simple.
How does the FO keep Starkiller fueled? It would need a constant stream of supplies just to keep itself running. Wouldn't the New Republic be able to trace the massive supply line needed to keep that thing running and already know about the weapon?
"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
Given the size of galactic space and the number of stars in the galaxy, I don't see that being much of a problem. Nobody's going to miss a star here or there.
"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
Well, the planet uses the star it orbits to power the laser. There's either that or, well, an entire planet's worth of resources.
And if we're talking about mundane supplies like food and equipment, it's not like Starkiller Base is a densely populated planet. They probably have only a handful of manned stations on there, if that, and the rest of the planet is just empty wilderness. So it's still not a problem.
"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
Yeah, they've got enough troops to patrol the facilities, and enough defenses to guard the vital parts.
Given how it's an entire planet they can probably just grow a lot of the food they eat.
And even if they don't, they probably have few enough people there that they can easily just ship in the food from offplanet through ordinary means. I mean, I wouldn't be surprised if Starkiller Base actually has fewer personnel than the Death Star, because the Death Star was a space station the size of a moon, while Starkiller Base may only have a handful of staffed and guarded stations on its surface.
"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
Would that it were so simple.
The NR doesn't have any scanning posts looking for weird anomalies that arise from an entire planet jumping into hyperspace? I mean, Kamino was found because Dooku did a shitty job erasing records about the planet's gravitational pull in the space around it. If a planet just literally up and left, there would be signs of that. I find it hard to believe, even without unified political will, there wasn't any intelligence that pointed out weird shit happening wherever Starkiller was.
"Well, the planet uses the star it orbits to power the laser. There's either that or, well, an entire planet's worth of resources."
The Republic doesn't have a space telescope of some kind showing stars mysteriously vanishing over the years? There wasn't a scouting program that reported mysterious weapons tests, stars going supernova way ahead of schedule, that sort of thing?
As for the development of Starkiller, I find it hard to believe there weren't any double agents willing to give the NR some sort of information on the weapon. Nothing is ever developed in absolute secrecy, because a secret is almost impossible to keep airtight.
Just, everything about the First Order and SKB feels like the writers basically handed them an "I win" button and stacked contrivance upon contrivance with the basic notion that Good Is Dumb and Good Is Impotent to justify why a faction can develop top level superweapons without anyone knowing about it, fuel it without anyone knowing up it, move it without anyone knowing about it, and test it without anyone knowing about it.
edited 28th Sep '16 10:11:17 PM by CrimsonZephyr
"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
The idea of Starkiller Base really should have been the focus of its own story, it's construction, the sheer devastation of its power, the way it draws power from stars, etc. Instead it's really just something for the heroes to blow up and feel good about themselves. Not to mention the whole "the darker it gets, the closer we are to losing" was heavy handed.
Doctor of Doctorates
The Darksaber (the superweapon not the sword) is probably one of my absolutely favourite SW superweapons purely because it was so hilariously awful it recurved back around to fantastic. It's hard to think of how anyone involved in any way in building the damn thing could have been any more incompetent... and then it ends up being squashed by an asteroid anyway.
Say what you will about the new canon in contrast to the Legends but the new version still has not got an equivalent to Kevin J. Anderson... thankfully.
"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
Would that it were so simple.
Well, I mean, the Darksaber had probably the most realistic take on the logistical nightmare that comes with trying to build one of those damed things without a government R&D budget supplying you — you end up cutting corners massively and the final product is hilariously useless. Other series had random third parties building superweapons, but KJA, despite the overall stupidity of his writing, actually hit the nail on the head when he made the Darksaber a piece of junk. It's just a shame Madine had to die for it — and he still had a better death in Darksaber than he did in Life Debt where he and unsung hero Hostis Ij are blown up unceremoniously.
edited 29th Sep '16 6:19:23 AM by CrimsonZephyr
"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
I would imagine eventually someone could write a story about Starkiller Base along the lines of the Death Star book. Maybe one of the main characters could be that one lieutenant who goes Screw This, I'm Out of Here! when the base starts exploding.
I love the idea of Starkiller Base, but it was one of the weakest parts of the film, mostly because it was just a rehash of the first two Death Stars, and not even an interesting rehash. Episode IV had the fighters rushing for the trench run, Episode VI had the fleet action and the Rebels caught between the force field and the enemy fleet. Starkiller Base was the "fighters and trench run" all over again. I think it would have been better if they had saved Starkiller Base for the next movie, and only hinted at it during the first
Queen of Good Things, Honest
I can't even think of Starkiller Base anymore without thinking of this.
The Death Star can beat up the Starkiller.
My Tumblr. Currently liveblogging Haruhi Suzumiya and revisiting Danganronpa V3.
I agree that Starkiller Base is logistically improbable, but it doesn't make me too mad. And I will forgive everything wrong with it if it turns out to have been made with Starforge technology. It would explain why Snoke is so blase about losing it.
My (theoretical) assumption has always been not that it's made with Star Forge technology, but that it's actually based on Star Forge technology.
"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
To me, it all hinges on the Unknown Regions. Rakata Prime is there, which is why the First Order was capable of incredible technological progress in a relatively short amount of time. Also it explains why nobody ever even conceived of them to be a large threat. There's literally no telling what they've been able to do in the three decades they've lived there. Maybe that's where Snoke comes from.
Hell, if they've kept the part of the place being difficult to traverse (due to hyperspace shenanigans), the First Order might be the only power capable of operating in the area.
Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
Sounds pretty plausible, actually.
Queen of Good Things, Honest
And he's called Snoke because of a terrible misunderstanding.
- Revan: (over hologram communications) This is my warning. The galaxy will fear the resurgence of the Dark Side.
- Leia: Who are you, mysterious evil guy?
- Revan: You will all come to know me as cough cough choke.
- Leia: SNOKE?!
- Revan: What? No, I'm—
- Mon Mothma: We must spread word immediately about the nefarious Snoke.
- Revan: Stop calling me that, I'm—
- Admiral Ackbar: Something must be done about the sinister forces of Snoke!
- Revan: Please, it's so stupid—
- Leia: Prepare our forces. Today, we go to war with Snoke.
- Revan: I'm literally about to start crying here.
- Leia: Poor impulse control! That proves it. The Dark Side has returned, and Snoke is its master.
- Revan: I hope you choke on a bantha and die! (signs off)
- Han: So how long are we expecting this to work?
- Leia: As long as it has to. The galaxy isn't going to take a dark, evil master named Snoke seriously. It'll be devastating to recruitment. His order is going to be barely a fraction of the Empire's size. Nothing can go wrong.
- Ben Solo: (secretly listening through the door) OMG His name rhymes with Force Choke! That's, like, classic Vader! Grandfather will be so proud!
edited 29th Sep '16 8:40:38 AM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently liveblogging Haruhi Suzumiya and revisiting Danganronpa V3.
Death Star is a classic superweapon, can't go wrong with the originals. Personal favorite is the Star Forge. I think the only superweapon I can't remember liking was the Sun Crusher.
edited 28th Sep '16 3:31:21 PM by VeryMelon