Environmentalism

Good? Bad? Don't care? Could be done better? Perfect as it is?

Discuss.

Could be done much more intelligently, as in doesn't come off as a bunch of Communist Luddites intelligently.

And we're off to a roaring start in the stupidity department!

edited 6th Sep '11 6:40:21 PM by Thorn14

Communist? That's a strawman.

Luddite? That's actually pretty accurate to a large—though still a minority—subsection of the movement...

The problem that dogs the environmental movement is that the media really only pays attention to it in cases where:

A) Someone like Al Gore has enough sway to push the issue to the front of the agenda

or

B) Someone does something crazy in the name of it

That's because a lot of environmental issues involve really detailed science and economics that it takes the news media too long to explain.

When did "Caring for the environment" turn into "TECHNOLOGY BAD!"

An honest-to-god good case can be made for technology being the biggest reason why the environment is as it is.

I read a very interesting—and batshit insane, not to mention sociologically epic failtastic—essay about how the author, a staunch "environmentalist," thought the only way to "save the planet" was for humanity to literally cull itself back into the Stone Age...

@Thorn

It's largely a straw man. Most environmentalists that I've met tend to actually be very pro-technology, as many of the improvements tend to be cleaner and more efficient than previous models. They'd just rather not rely on unspecified future tech as the answer to everything.

For what it's worth, for most environmentalists it's not so much that they're Luddites as much as they're futurists. (although the former do exist).

For example, if you're going to bitch about changing light-bulbs, that's a prime example of futurism, NOT Ludditism. Most environmentalism in fact revolves around the idea that we can think our way into a clean environment via better technology, better energy efficiency, better renewable power generation methods, etc.

Edit:Ach, Hans run, it's the Ninja!

edited 6th Sep '11 6:44:23 PM by Karmakin

@USAF

When was this essay written? Sounds like the person's a Malthusian.

When being a Christian turned into "Wants to replace the government with a theocracy".

It's preachy and gets stuff down your throat and it gave us Captain Planet.

Although funny when I was younger I had a great interest in animals.

It's great to do the little stuff like pick up garbage and throw them away.

@joyflower

Wat.

I read it about two years ago. Probably couldn't find it again if I tried.

~shrug~

It seems like the environmentalists love to suggest things that are really expensive compared to the run-of-the-mill, environmentally-unfriendly version, thinking that corporations will pay for it along with government.

And then the consumer and the taxpayers are really the ones who pay for it, and they get mad because taxes on the middle class go up instead of on the rich, and so they vote it down, and then the environmentalists complain that nobody cares about the environment...

Depends on your example. Like I said, there are plenty who take economics seriously into consideration.

As a Christian I will go with the idea the enviorment needs to be better taken cared of but at the same time let's not make every CEO into a Looten Plunder and Hoggish Greedly.Besides like I said who would do business with people with obviously evil names.

I also vote bull on the population control thing because it usually leads to disaster,exmaple China one child policy.

I am also against the the New Age enviormentalism for many reasons.

edited 6th Sep '11 6:50:20 PM by joyflower

Malthus plays an incredibly tiny role in the environmentalist movement today. The rest of your argument is a straw man.

Captain Planet was a great show though...

I agree, its just like how christians/muslims shouldn't be lumped with the crazies.

Environmentalists aren't insane hippie terrorists who want us to live in the stone age again or live like elves.

Its like the new lightbulbs, they are longer lasting, better for the energy, and save you money.

I'd argue being AGAINST them is being Luddite!

USAF@Define great because looking back at it now its very preachy and is in need of a better script and more personalities for the main characters.Heck,if they improved and rebooted Captian Planet I would watch it and be better sold on cleaning up the planet.T He main problem with the show is how they never really did the research like Gi's name it is Vitamese and a boy's name and to top it all off she is implied to be Japanese.Or how Linka's name isn't even a legitimate Russian name.And there is much more.

Well, the problem with new things, USAF, is that things tend to be more expensive right at the start, only getting more affordable later down the line when it's been proved, tested, and made cost efficient to produce. It's not that they think corporations and such will go for it right away, as I'm sure they're well aware of the starting costs since they're trying to get someone else to pay for it. It's a matter of convincing them that it's worth that initial cost (getting them interested in a long term investment, really) and getting it started. I think a lot of the energy efficient and 'green" technologies are in their infancy right now, so there's not exactly a lot of people ready to jump on that bandwagon. On the other hand, the people in the ground floor now stand to make a profit after years of investment and effort..

Anyway, we're stuck here for an undetermined amount of time. We need to be more careful about the environment. So yeah, I'm for environmentalism. So long as it's not the PETA style environmentalism.

~shrug~

So Bad, It's Good

Edit: PETA can take a long walk off a short pier into Hell...

edited 6th Sep '11 6:56:48 PM by USAF713

PETA isn't even environmentalist, technically. Animal rights. Different emphasis.

He means PETA level of crazy.

Enviromentalism? Has a good premise, but is often ruined by zealots. Course, same could be said about most anything.

Myself? I don't give a fuck, really. I only have to deal with the enviroment until I'm dead; then it's someone else's problem.

See THATS THE PROBLEM.

Its ALWAYS SOMEONE ELSES PROBLEM. Again and again, until whoops, its our problem! That episode of Futurama with the trash ball was a perfect example of why this is a bad.

To just think about ourselves is selfish and a disservice to this planet and the people who will live on it.

edited 6th Sep '11 6:59:43 PM by Thorn14