Genres you'd like if it wasn't for...

And what if I want a collage of 1/2 second long sounds all working together in a single riff? You can't really write something like that, and even if you did, it wouldn't create the same effect as sampling.

Or what if I want to take a piece of music, and rearrange and edit it to create a different sound? Or use a bit of music as an intro?

Or, what if I want to parody an existing song?

But then, I suppose you're really complaining about the appearance of laziness or originality. I can't really come up with a rebuttal to that (though i will suggest you read this).

You know that all he took was a line of the chorus and the first note of the riff, right?

edited 17th Aug '11 11:49:50 AM by Wicked223

Once again, I find myself quoting Jay-Z. Ahem.

Devin Townsend probably isn't a good suggestion for Saeg except maybe the Ki album, which is focused mainly around gradually building and releasing tension instead of the ZOMGSOFUCKINLOUD that Devin is generally known for.

Death Metal: I can't get past the vocals. I don't really understand what the vocalists' goal is. I assume the idea was that they're supposed to just have really harsh vocals, but if that's the case I've heard bands in other genres that can do a much better job of that.

Black Metal: Most of it just sounds the same to me. Not to the point that I can't tell one band from another, but to the point that I don't see any point to become a fan of the genre.

@ Saeg: Thanks for the recommendations. I'll check them out.

Shit, Forgot about Alcest. They're good. Traced in Air by Cynic is another good record. Focus is an AMAZING record, but alternates between death growls and vocals that are processed through a vocoder, so I'm not sure how much you like that effect.

If you're gonna try Vintersorg, Visions from the Spiral Generator or The Focusing Blur would probably be the best starting points for you and work backwards from there into Cosmic Genesis, which is where they switched from a Folk Metal Band into a Progressive/Avant Grade Metal band and then get Till fjälls, Ödemarkens son and Solens rötter for their Folk Metal stuff, provided of course that you enjoyed their other albums.

Also, You might give Opeth's Blackwater Park a try if you don't mind progressive death metal, as it still has the death growls, but the other half of the time has Mike Akerfeldt singing in a 70s style voice.

I agree that pure black metal does sound all the same (which makes it even more hilarious how seriously some people take it), but it's the hybrid bands that sound the best. Black metal and folk metal cross over really well, and you end up with bands like Finntroll or Catamenia.

And when you mix it with prog or neoclassical, all bets are off.

I've heard that harsh vocals are meant to convey an oppressive and nightmarish atmosphere. I personally don't buy it.

RE: Black metal vocals:

...Don't they make this sound ridiculous?

Not that it isn't awesome.

edited 17th Aug '11 2:05:23 PM by inane242

Oh, Almost forgot. I can't say they're subdued or vulnerable sounding, but if you ever wondered what a combination of Metal with an opera singer sounds like, try Diablo Swing Orchestra.

edited 17th Aug '11 2:31:20 PM by Thenamelesssamurai

They put your Swing in your Lacuna Coil so you could.... I'll stop that meme here.

I'm surprised it took that long for the inevitable death/black metal post.

All I can say is: you get used to "harsh" vocals, you just need to put in some effort.

edited 17th Aug '11 2:57:12 PM by TheSanityAssassin

It's not that I can't get used to it, I've just heard what I consider far better than what Death Metal has to offer.

edited 17th Aug '11 3:13:45 PM by NULLcHiLD27

In what way?

Vocal wise or music wise?
Because the latter is the important part, disliking the music is a perfectly valid reason to not like the genre.

Vocal-wise. I just feel like I'm settling on vocalists that aren't as harsh or don't have as much range as other vocalists.

Like Heaven Shall Burn, I think that vocalist is far more harsh and almost inhuman sounding and it just makes most other stuff I hear seem 'meh.'

Another one would be Lamb of God, I think that vocalist has a damn good range for screaming and it just feels like I'm settling for less when I listen to a random Death Metal band.

Does that make any sense?

edited 17th Aug '11 3:14:48 PM by NULLcHiLD27

Wow, so basically you're saying Metalcore vocals are more XTREME than Death Metal ones? I mean, sure, they're more grating but I dunno if I would call it more extreme . . .

Heaven Shall Burn: Melodic Death/Metalcore and just because they're part of a genre you don't like doesn't mean they can't out-perform bands in genres you do like.

edited 17th Aug '11 3:26:43 PM by NULLcHiLD27

Speaking of Diablo Swing Orchestra, their first album is available for free.

To me, the only person who can do consistently interesting harsh vocals is Chuck Schuldiner.

edited 17th Aug '11 3:36:43 PM by KitsuneInferno

More or less. I suppose I have less issue with creative use of it, rather than just sticking a section into your song.

Could you give me a précis? That thesis is rather long, and I'm not sure which part (going by the table of contents) is most relevant.

Basically, I believe I would like rap more if more rap acts were instrumentally more interesting rather than relying on samples to add flavour (and if anyone fancies linking to some counterexamples, I'd certainly appreciate it). The main problem is my first one, in that the beat and the lyrics is where the focus is and by themselves alone I don't find them that interesting. I'm not that keen on the actual singing style, but hey, I like death metal so I'm hardly one to complain about that.

After reading the bulk of that thesis, I gathered that authorship is dead and trying to fight sampling is doing nothing but impeding art, from 2 Live Crew juxtaposing "Pretty Woman" with blatent sexual imagery to sound collages making statements about the current state of the mainstream.

Don't know if this is what you're looking for, but Donuts by J dilla is an instrumental hip hop album and it's pretty awesome.

The Samurai Champloo soundtracks are pretty killer too.

edited 17th Aug '11 4:02:05 PM by Thenamelesssamurai

As is Entroducing by DJ Shadow, A Heap of Broken Images by Blue Sky Black Death and either of Nujabes' studio albums. Only the first one is fully instrumental, excluding vocal samples from films and Lyrics Born.

How is the rest of Nujabes' solo stuff? I like the stuff he did with Forces of Nature and Fat Jon on the Samurai Champloo soundtrack, but didn't like Battle cry( The opening theme), where the flow felt weird to me, but that might have been shing02, who I think was the rapper on it.

edited 17th Aug '11 3:56:22 PM by Thenamelesssamurai

Yeah, that was Shing02 rapping. He's on both of the albums. It's all pretty calming jazzy stuff, about equally divided between instrumentals and vocal tracks. Perfect walking around music.

edited 17th Aug '11 3:53:55 PM by KitsuneInferno

Alright. I'll give it a try.