It's not it's own genre.: Real Robot Genre

Thats not Fan Speak when everyone even the makers of the series use the term and define works around a specific set of critera and made it into a genre its not Fan Speak. High Fantasy is not Fan Speak, Super Hero is not Fan Speak....

edited 5th Aug '11 2:20:12 AM by Raso

Bobby, Eddie custom titled the page to be Real Robot Genre when it was previously Real Robot. Since the page describes almost nothing but the robots themselves, this is a problem. He did the same for Super Robot and Super Hero, which also need to be split amung the prop/character and the genre.

You can also have Real Robots in something not of the genre, such as Patlabor, which is a cop show featuring robots.

Oh yeah, the dubbing of any term people disagree with as "fanspeak" is getting annoying. These are most certainly established, known terms in the industry.

Banpresto explicitly has "Super Robot Routes" and "Real Robot Routes" in its Super Robot Wars games.

Now, sometimes the dividing line can bring people to blows, but thats a different issue.

Patlabor is a Real Robot show, but not Military Science Fiction.

Edit: Granted that this is a weird situation, and these are fairly unusual. Except for random comedy shows that like to have crazy shit like mecha show up for gags and such, but thats a different issue.

edited 5th Aug '11 2:23:26 AM by SakurazakiSetsuna

I'm not a particular fan of "the industry uses it" as a good reason. That's how utter shit titles like Mickey Mousing happen.

While I disagree that it's its own genre, that is likely because I lump my genres and split my tropes.

How exactly is Patlabor a Real Robot Show? I've got a few DV Ds, does it suddenly take a turn for the darker? Does it focus on the horrors of war? Does it do all of this later? Unless your definition of a genre consists of "this element shows up", I'm not sure how Patlabor even fits.

edited 5th Aug '11 2:25:46 AM by Deboss

[1] The Other Wiki's take on the subject.

Now I agree 100% that we need to make a page about Real Robots themselves and separate them from the genre itself. (like Super Hero and Super Robot... although that topic died.)

Real Robots can appear in Super Robot although they are almost always Faceless Mooks

edited 5th Aug '11 2:32:37 AM by Raso

Well, they end having to fight off a giant monster in at least one of the movies. I have, admittedly, watched very little of Patlabor (backlog, oh the backlog!), I would certainly not scream bloody murder at seeing it on a list of Real Robot shows, and who ever said that Real Robot shows have to "turn dark" or anything like that?

You are ascribing elements of the genre that are not, in fact, necessary. Yes, many Real Robot shows "demonstrate the horrors of war", but they all don't. Just like how most Magical Girl shows have a girl fighting against darkness/evil by collecting an arbitrary number of trinkets by defeating monsters of the week, but they all don't.

Patlabor is a show that doesn't neatly fit into a existing genre. Its Police Procedural With Real Robot Elements, which is, suffice to say, not an actual genre. I honestly would expect to see it listed under several different genres, since it doesn't fit anyone perfectly, so you have to make do.

That being said, with a few exceptions around the edges *cough*Evangelion*cough* most mecha fans can divide up Super and Real shows and robots with little difficulty.

edited 5th Aug '11 2:31:13 AM by SakurazakiSetsuna

Apparently it's actually a sub-sub-genre...

edited 5th Aug '11 2:32:05 AM by CyganAngel

Let me demonstrate with a chart:

What I read is sub-genre. Unless you count mecha as a sub-genre.

I suppose it's just one more instance of people using genre to mean both plot and setting. I suppose we could make an effort to separate the two for people, but that might be getting ahead of ourselves.

Does anyone else think Setting Genre and Story Genre would be a good idea?

edited 5th Aug '11 2:40:49 AM by Deboss

Mecha Anime would be a sub-genre, yes.

Setsuna, even your chart shows that it is way down there.

I suppose the existence of this article means we are allowed to create a page for every one of these sub-genres though?

If there is sufficient need and/or desire to do so.

Remember, There Is No Such Thing As Notability applies precisely in this situation. There's 32 years worth of anime and manga examples of Real Robot stories, its most certainly notable as one of the two most common subgenres of Mecha. In fact, its quite unusual to find a Mecha work from Japan that doesn't fit into either Real Robot or Super Robot.

So then, writeup for the genre page? Probably want to do one for Super Robot Genre as well.

What I wrote earlier is a good place to start. I don't have much confidence in my ability to write good descriptions, but thats the place to start.

Take it to YKTTW as an index or sandbox it on Sandbox.Real Robot Genre? My advice would be to focus less on the plots (which tend to vary) and more on the setting you'll see and the function of the robots themselves.

edited 5th Aug '11 2:51:42 AM by Deboss

Battle Tech

Transformers

Chromehounds

Fairly well-known examples...

Wait, I misread that. Sorry.

It's nowhere near being a Japan-only thing though. It's used quite often in Western works.

edited 5th Aug '11 2:53:21 AM by CyganAngel

I'll sandbox it, I'm having less than stellar luck with my request for help on YKTTW for something else.

Not right now, I have to get some sleep.

edited 5th Aug '11 2:53:27 AM by SakurazakiSetsuna

You're going to have to provide Western examples that didn't either originate in Japan. And I'm not saying its only Japanese, but they created it (this is undeniable, Mobile Suit Gundam was the first Real Robot series) and are by far the largest producer of mecha content in general, and Real Robot and Super Robot shows in particular.

Remember, these aren't the only two kinds of mecha, there are plenty of things which have mecha but wouldn't fall into either of those categories. I'd put Transformers under a different subheading, for example. Battletech is, of course, Real Robot, but it also got it start as licensed designs from SDF Macross. Unsure of Chromehound's pedigree though.

Chromehounds.... blatant clone of Armored Core which is Japanese From From Software. (I hate that name... messes up my sentences)

Battle Tech cloned from Robo Tech and Licensed Robo Tech stuff,

Transformers not exactly the Real Robot Genre. (it comes close sometimes but it has so many differences.)

edited 5th Aug '11 3:01:14 AM by Raso

A lot of Western mecha was heavily influenced by Robotech, and of course Robotech was just three Japanese Real Robot shows smashed together.

Dude, Chromehounds IS Japanese!

FFS That will teach me.... actually read the article we have on it...

edited 5th Aug '11 3:04:42 AM by Raso

ah ah ah ah

no no no

It does not matter where the inspiration came from- they are Western works.

But I posted this because of a misunderstanding. Sorry.

^ Teach me to listen to Wikipedia and TV Tropes.

edited 5th Aug '11 3:02:55 AM by CyganAngel

But it does matter.

Hell, the most American Super Robot ever, Megas XLR, was a loving homage to everything Japanese about the genre.

I'm not saying there aren't Western examples, but finding a western example un-influenced by the history of how the genre was created in Japan will be very difficult.

Purely western Mecha is quite different from Super Robot and Real Robot, and should not be shoe-horned in unless they actually fit the description. Some will, some won't. And as I said, not all Japanese Mecha are one of these either.