Needs a rename: Pardon Me Stewardess I Speak Iambic Pentameter

1. Too long a name. 2. Opaque reference to Airplane! which isn't even an example.

3. Every time I read this title I think it's supposed to be in iambic pentameter at first.

Anyway, I agree that this could use a better name.

It can't be. I even wrote a couplet about it.

"Iambic Pentameter" cannot fit
In Iambic Pentameter, so s**t!

Gratuitous Iambic Pentameter

Something in Iambic Pentameter for kicks.

There are various work-arounds in poetry for dealing with words like "pentameter", such as by abbreviating the word (pentam'ter?) or by employing inversion.

However, given the awkwardness of the phrase to incorporate into the meter, seconding Eddie.

Actually, if "pentameter" is stressed PEN-ta-MET-er, I think Eddie's proposal is iambic pentameter, though weakened by the additional unstressed syllable.

edited 3rd Aug '11 7:25:59 PM by BobbyG

Isn't this about speaking in any kind of verse, not just iambic pentameter?

For example, the original Quest For Glory has a giant speaking in some sort of Norse metre. (I want to add the example, but I'd have to find out what the verse is called first.)

edited 4th Aug '11 1:00:47 AM by DoktorvonEurotrash

Eddie's proposal has eleven syllables. And yes, you can mess with the stress, but "iambic pentameter" if pronounced properly has two unstressed syllables in a row, so you can't make iambic pentameter out of it. You could go with "iambical pentameter", but then you've only got two syllables left.

p.s. I don't think Eddie was trying for I.P.; I think he was just proposing a simple, clear title. Which is probably the best plan.

edited 4th Aug '11 2:36:12 AM by Xtifr

Standard Superhero Speak?

Say what?? Oh, you were confused by the first line. No, this has nothing to do with superheroes.

However, now that I look at it, I suspect this was originally intended to be Flowery Elizabethan English. If you actually read the description (instead of merely being impressed by its scansion), I think you'll agree. (Big Hint: Marvel Comics gods do not speak in iambic pentameter, but they do say things like, "what hast thou, my lord?" and "what is thy will?")

If you look at the examples, though, it's clear most people thought this was Gratuitous Pentameter. So there's a conflict. Both Flowery Elizabethan English and Gratuitous Pentameter are valid tropes (and no, the former is not the same as Ye Olde Butcherede Englishe).

Should we split? Remove the examples that aren't about pentameter, since we currently have no place to put them? Or what?

(There's also a number of examples of characters who speak in rhyme or even haiku, and I'm really not sure what should be done with those.)

edited 4th Aug '11 4:00:27 AM by Xtifr

What about Tetrameter? The West Wing example is that.

Also Gratuitous Poetry or Rhythmic Speech Patterns should be a super trope I think. Gratuitous Haiku as well.

edited 4th Aug '11 4:05:41 AM by Raso

I'm pretty sure I've only ever seen this trope used for "characters who speak in rhyme or other forms of verse" (like the Western Oracle in The Never Ending Story. The book, not the movie.). Obviously excluding Elizabethan plays and other media where verse is used as a convention.

& Speaks In Rhyme (or whatever) is definitely a great trope and we should have it. Whether it should be this trope or a supertrope, I'm not sure. If it's a supertrope, then I tend to think this should be limited to pure iambic pentameter, just because that is so common. But Tropes Are Flexible, so I dunno.

But the description of this trope still describes Flowery Elizabethan English, not poetry. Technically, it's not even a self-describing trope. That's a bigger issue, I think.

@ Xtifr: "Iambic pentameter" means 5 iambs, and that can be ignored occasionally (for example, by inversion, which is substituting a trochee in place of an iamb).

But at this point, I think that's off topic. It sounds as though the page has worse problems than the title itself.

edited 4th Aug '11 5:29:23 AM by BobbyG

There are some great suggestions for new names here.

Since the Fast Eddie agreed with a rename, can we skip straight to a Alt title Crowner? Or do we still need a Single Prop?

I would say go for it. (has there been a single objection in the thread?)

Alt Title Crowner Here.

I certainly don't have an objection to a rename, but at this point, I'm not even clear what it is that we're supposed to be naming? The description says one thing, almost all the examples say another. My vote is either for Flowery Elizabethan Language (the description) or Gratuitous Iambic Pentameter (most of the examples), or maybe even Speaks In Rhyme (even more of the examples, but still not all). It all depends on what this trope actually is!

Let's figure out what it is before we start voting on what to call it.

Well, how about a split?

I think a YKTTW super trope of Rhythmic Speech Patterns with this as a subtrope

And a YKTTW of character (Kuno in Ranma) and or works with skits (SNL, Nichijou) trope for those that Gratuitously break into Poetry or Haiku's would work for this. (called Gratuitous Poetry and Gratuitous Haiku redirect.)

Then just rename this with Fast Eddie's suggestion and keep it easy.

edited 4th Aug '11 7:49:43 AM by Raso

That doesn't cover Flowery Elizabethan English, which is what the description actually describes, and is the main thing we need to split off (or dump and send to YKTTW).

Other than that, I'm ok with the suggestion, but it seems like we might be able to get away with just one or two tropes about Talking In Poetry. Maybe one for those that do it incessantly, and one for those who just occasionally break out in fits of poetry?

edited 4th Aug '11 8:01:59 AM by Xtifr

Flowery Elizabethan Language sounds more like Ye Olde Butcherede Englishe to me.

Disregard.

edited 4th Aug '11 8:23:29 AM by EnglishIvy

Yeah its a variation of that I think. It could get a subsection on that page I think.

The main difference is that Flowery Elizabethan English isn't necessarily butchered. Some writers are very careful about their flowery Elizabethan English. Because, The Bard, y'know. And, to a lesser extent, the King James Bible.

Wow, but speaking of Ye Olde Butcherede Englishe, check out this quote from the description there: "If only gods, aliens, or other powerful beings are speaking in Ye Olde Butcherede Englishe, especially if they speak in verse, that's Pardon Me Stewardess, I Speak Iambic Pentameter."

I take that as pretty strong confirmation that this trope never really was about speaking in verse; it was about the whole Shakespearian schtick. Except maybe just involving gods and aliens?? Wow, who comes up with this stuff?

edited 4th Aug '11 9:02:30 AM by Xtifr