Alternative Voting measure fails in UK referendum

An attempt to change the first past the post system has met with widespread rejection.

Discuss.

Wait, the UK has FPTP voting? Then how do they manage to avoid the two party system?

That article doesn't actually explain what the Alternative Vote is, but generally speaking FPTP annoys the hell out of me, so it's a pity they didn't manage to chuck it.

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.

Damn, I was hoping for a "yes".

Do note that they haven't finished counting yet... although I'm not expecting a miracle or anything.

Some of the "no" arguments annoyed the heck out of me, though. Using Liberal Democrats/Nick Clegg/coalitions as boogiemen? Ugh. "It's complicated"? Like hell it is.

^ Practice. If anyone doesn't know what AV is, Wikipedia to the rescue.

edited 6th May '11 11:30:59 AM by AllanAssiduity

The turn out for the A Vref has been poor, and it is a shame that AV has failed.

A fairer voting reform would have been welcome, also our second ever referendum!

By the powers invested in me by tabloid-reading imbeciles, I pronounce you guilty of paedophilia!

Also: in my home country of Wales, Labour were just one seat off a total majority.

Given that I think they'll form a coalition, I'm wondering just who they'd ally with. The Conservatives? Unlikely. The Liberal Democrats? It's what I would want to see, but probably won't happen. Plaid Cymru? ... yeah, it's probably them.

Actually, the grand loss of Lib Dem seats around the country annoys me a little, given that the Conservatives actually got off pretty well.

... but this is on AV, not what I'm talking about Can we, like, have a British politics thread? We don't have enough of it in this fora...

Aw and I was hoping it would pass. FPTP sucks so much.

I am seriously annoyed that an article can be that long without explaining wtf it's talking about. All it told us was the outcome. Unless you're already plugged in to British politics, there's no way you would've formulated an opinion on the alternative voting measure and why it failed to gain popular support.

Furthermore, I think Guantanamo must be destroyed.

Well yes, that one article was about the outcome. That was the point of it. There are other FAQ articles on the site, and not every single one needs to cover the intricasies of it.

edited 6th May '11 12:34:49 PM by CaissasDeathAngel

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.

I've never had less faith in my country.

Everything is best in moderation.

It's official: AV has failed.

Goddammit.

Not surprised. The Yes campaign was a total shambles, and the No campaign was making a hell of a lot of noise and being as misleading as they possibly could the whole time.

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I'm sad this failed, but only because it was a shitey alternative to an even more shite system.

PR is what we need in this country.

That the treacherous rat bastard Nick Clegg has now lost any lingering credibility he had is a very big consolation though, and the thought of him crying himself to sleep after the day he's had today makes me smile warmly. I'm one of the ex-Lib Dem supporters who will never forgive the man for his callous betrayal of everything he stands for at the altar of Tory greed by the way.

I may not like the Tories, but at least they're honest and stab you from the front. The Scots have removed all Lib-Dem presence on the Scottish mainland today and I'm very very happy about that. These sour grapes taste utterly delicious.

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.

Unfortunately the No campaign's scaremongering and blatant lies seem to have worked.

Beyond that, how Nick Clegg can bear to face his party after this I have no idea. The Lib Dems were butchered whilst the Tories came through relatively unscathed and it's now unfortunately extremely likely we'll see an independent Scotland in a few years. Yesterday was a complete disaster.

I share your contempt for the man but he's brought down the entire Liberal Democrat party down with him.

edited 6th May '11 12:45:44 PM by pagad

With cannon shot and gun blast smash the alien. With laser beam and searing plasma scatter the alien to the stars.

I have to admit, the only reason I wanted *

to vote "yes" was because the "No" campaign was almost entirely lies =/ I'm also hoping that the SNP don't get to have their little dream of an independent Scotland, since I can't see it being a good idea.

Yep he has stained the party's reputation, which has also taken part of the hit for Tory policies

By the powers invested in me by tabloid-reading imbeciles, I pronounce you guilty of paedophilia!

The Tories hardly got a hit at all. David Cameron must be cackling with glee that the public reaction to the government's unpopular actions has almost entirely been brought to bear on the Lib Dems.

With cannon shot and gun blast smash the alien. With laser beam and searing plasma scatter the alien to the stars.

Nooooooo!

...Seriously, FPTP was a horrible, broken system, and IMO, a remotely sensible Government would force the change regardless of public opinion. It's the government's job to govern well, not how the public (think they) want it to be run. Often, these intersect, but when they don't, the public should be ignored.

@Jovian, we didn't, mostly. The two parties are Labour and Conservatives.

edited 6th May '11 1:03:56 PM by Yej

Da Rules excuse all the inaccuracy in the world. Listen to them, not me.

The Tories are in charge. "Remotely sensible" is an alien concept to them.

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.

In that case, may I suggest we put together a Sensible Party for the next election?

Da Rules excuse all the inaccuracy in the world. Listen to them, not me.

Alright, lets calm down.

First of all, why, exactly, was AV a better system than First Past The Post. And "Its fairer" isn't an answer. Why is it fairer. And why is it better?

edited 6th May '11 1:12:45 PM by GameChainsaw

The term "Great Man" is disturbingly interchangeable with "mass murderer" in history books.

Well, that's the last we'll be seeing of electoral reform for the forseeable future. That said, Miliband now has vital ammunition for the next general election. He can promise to be the Prime Minister who will succeed where the Lib Dems failed and introduce full proportional representation. I'm not sure if that's likely, though. Only time will tell.

I voted "Yes" in the referendum, grudgingly. Neither campaign really deserved it; the "Yes" side were somewhat incompetent and the "No" side were a trifle dishonest. The outcome doesn't really bother me; I don't particularly care which system we use.

edited 6th May '11 1:16:13 PM by TheGloomer

It would have brought an end to tactical voting and prevented M Ps from being elected against the wishes of the majority of their constituencies. People could vote for the party they wanted to vote for without having to worry about letting "x" party in.

What he said.

edited 6th May '11 1:18:21 PM by pagad

With cannon shot and gun blast smash the alien. With laser beam and searing plasma scatter the alien to the stars.

In FPTP it's possible to win an election even if 70% of people vote against you.

Say there's 5 candidates. One gets 30%, two others get 25% each, the other two get 10% each.

70% of people didn't vote for the winner.

Under AV, voters rank the candidates, and if no one gets more than 50%, the bottom side is eliminated and the second preferences of voters who put them on top reallocated. If this still doesn't give someone with more than 50%, the next lowest candidate is eliminated and the second preferences of their voters are redistributed, until a winner.

It's innately more fair because it allows degrees in voting. It's still not as good as PR, but it - or anything else - is better than FPTP.

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.

What is PR? Wikipedia says, "permanent revolution", but I don't think you meant that.

edited 6th May '11 1:19:29 PM by Yej

Da Rules excuse all the inaccuracy in the world. Listen to them, not me.

Proportional Representation.

My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.