History WMG / HomestuckAgentsAndMonarchs

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[[WMG: Jack's death will have something to do with a clock.]]
* There is a sentence in the comic that has to do with this while Aradia talks about the genetic code "t1ck t0ck"- the "tyrant less an arm and an eye." Snowman stabbed Jack's eye out and ripped off his arm.
--> AA: the persisting sounds said to accompany the ultimate demise of the tyrant less an arm and an eye
** This could just as easily be referring to Vriska. Or Marquise Spinneret Mindfang. Or Captain Hook. (Was he missing an eye?) Villainous characters in Homestuck losing an arm and an eye is practically a RunningGag by this point.
*** It's definitely a reference to the troll version of Captain Hook; Pupa Pan apparently is more of a myth than a children's story on Alternia, and has something to do with (may be based on?) Marquise Spinneret Mindfang and the Summoner. Hook is a pirate captain, so an eyepatch wouldn't be out of place, and everyone knows the story of his hand and the clock-bearing crocodile that keeps coming back for (ahem) seconds. Given that {{Call Back}}s are a freqently used narrative device in Homestuck to the point of being (if Doc Scratch is to be believed) a significant plot point, it could also be a reference to any number of other characters, including but not limited to Jack.
* Partially [[Main/{{Jossed}} Jossed]]. Jack's defeat does reflect Captain Hook, in that he loses when the hand with the Black Queen's ring is severed. No clocks are involved, though -- it reflects Hook's ''first'' defeat, not his ''final'' defeat.

[[WMG: Jack's active role in the story is nearing it's end.]]
* At this moment, he's pretty much on his own. The good guys have five God Tiers including one who also has Jack's omnipotence, and a fully prototyped PM, who is more or less his equal in terms of power. It doesn't matter how we look at it, Jack is WAY outclassed.
** A few scenarios seem likely
*** A) A big beatdown involving all the heroes or just PM kicking his ass for all that he's done, ala Make Her Pay pr
*** B) Jack ends up working for English in some fashion. English is identified as the Lord of the Angels and Jack definitely has an angelic vibe. Jack could also become English's host for his attempt to manifest in the Human Universe.
*** C) He will eventually see the threat that Lord English poses and will [[HeelFaceTurn join the fight against English]]. Jack will [[RedemptionEqualsDeath die in the final battle helping to ensure Lord English's destruction]].
*** D) In the middle of the Jack vs. PM showdown, Lord English arrives and [[CurbStompBattle curbstomps them both]], establishing himself as the new BigBad. It wouldn't be the first time a showdown was interrupted by the interference of a third party...
*** E) Jack Noir joins the party!
*** F) After receiving four new prototypings from the alpha teens, Jack becomes a rampaging murder machine again.
*** Very unlikely for him to receive four new prototypings seeing how his ring only allows the four that come with his session.
*** So perhaps when they reset the universe, and sent him to the troll universe, he goes into the human universe's new bilious slick, entered their session, and steals the new ring easily with the power of a first guardian, thus giving him two rings with 4 nodes each, thus giving him 8 nodes...hm...what would happen if someone prototyped a ring?
*** If this were an actual video game, it would either be impossible, or it would probably crash the game.
* [[Main/{{Jossed}} Jossed]]. He's one of the four penultimate bosses, but his fight is almost a sidequest. Jade takes him on alone, uses her connection to Bec to distract him, and PM beats him [[IncrediblyLamePun handily]].
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[[WMG: Every session - or at least the troll's session - of Sburb/Sgrub has the cancer.]]
* Karkat has said that when he gave the children's session the cancer, it manifested itself as Jack Noir. The trolls session itself also had Jack Noir - and it can be assumed that each session before theirs had Jack as well. Even though in their session Jack Noir never grew into the unstoppable juggernaut that he is in the human's session, he is still there (Plus, the unstoppable juggernaut Jack ''did'' catch them eventually). Maybe the trolls session also had the cancer, as well as all the sessions before them, which is what leads to the creation of Sburb itself each time.
** Note that Karkat has said that the cancer is possibly what led to the kid's session being uncompletable. If the trolls session had the cancer, it would be assumed that their session is uncompletable as well, explaining why Bec Noir came and prevented them from claiming the prize and finishing the session.
** Each session is flawed in some way, as there is always a way for English to get into the Universe. In the Alpha-Troll session, English and Doc were not able to, so they couldn't complete the game. In a sense, every session has some form of the Cancer, otherwise it's impossible for a session to win.

[[WMG: Jack Noir is not Evil]]

He somehow, perhaps with the fourth prototyping, became aware that he was inhabiting a null session. Everything he has done is [[IDidWhatIHadToDo what he has to do]] to make the kids' session non-null
* Sure doesn't clear him of his blowing up of Prospit and the Battlefield when he had only three prototypes.
** Somewhat Jossed, somewhat true. Although he's not trying to fix the session, he's actually the anthropomorphic form of the 'Cancer' of the kids session, so he can't completely be blamed for his actions.
*** That's just Karkat's theory, not necessarily the unvarnished truth.
*** Regardlesss of his status one way or the other, he ''still'' relishes murdering people.

[[WMG: The Queens and Kings are special.]]
Only they can use the rings or scepters safely. If anyone else attempts, they suffer WithGreatPowerComesGreatInsanity. Like, say Jackspers Noirlecrow. [[http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa281/Jiminiminy/127566327117.gif Why, hello there, Jack!]]
* Jossed apparently. Jack isn't insane. Moreover WV apparently will use the White Ring with no real consequences to his sanity.
** More like PM will.

[[WMG: Jack Noir also inherited feelings for Rose from Jaspers.]]
He hasn't bothered Rose at all or even set foot on the Land of Light and Rain from what we've seen so far. He had no trouble killing John and (Doomed) Dave because the Harlequin doll and Seppukrow had no real feelings for them.
* Apparently {{Jossed}}, at least as far as symbols go, [[http://mspaintadventures.com/?s=6&p=005595 here]].
** The fact that Jack hasn't simply done his typical BAMKATANACHESTSTABDIE or BAMKATANATHROATSLASHDIE maneuver on Rose, which is well within his capabilities, suggests that for whatever reason; he is hesistant to simply kill Rose and is merely acting in self defense when met with her GRIMDARK HORRORTERROR NUKE.
*** He has shown no form of hesitation to murder Rose. What seems to be the case is that because Jaspers was dead for so long, his personality barely transfered. You could argue that Jack loves pranks because he's part jester and that would still be wrong because there's nothing in canon to support it.
*** Whoops Jack's sword there just impaled Rose, guess this one's Jossed!
*** Most likely, Bec's power made his personality more powerful, and/or Jaspers, as an [[CatsAreMean independent-minded cat]], wasn't really all that close to Rose.
*** That doesn't really make sense though; Jaspersprite has consistently shown himself to care a lot for Rose, although he doesn't act that much on it.

[[WMG: Jack's Trophy Binge is the manifestation of what he inherited, personality wise, from Davesprite.]]
Also: "You cannot stay mad at Cal. He is your true friend." (something like that.) And the way he decides the binge was stupid what the hell was he thinking is very similar to the "why do bones have to be so tasty!?" bit.
This leads to my theory that while he has inherited personality traits from all the prototypings, they are completely random.
* Davesprite was the second prototyping, the ring only grants the properties of the first. So neither Davesprite nor Jadesprite will influence him, that's purely his own personality at work.
** Technically the ring only grants the properties of pre-Medium prototypings (hence why both of Rose's prototypings affect the Medium), but otherwise this is correct.
* On the other hand, the trophy binge could be a legacy of Seppucrow - remember, the brainless feathery asshole ended up dead because it was trying to steal Dave's game discs.

[[WMG: Jack has hidden [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CombatTentacles Combat Tentacles!]] And Lord English is Jack through weird time shit]]
* So why isn't there any influence from Dead!Jaspers+Eldritch Princess after Jack's fourth prototyping? Because he is actually hiding his tentacles in his torso (you know, with his katana), and then he and Gamzee will have an epic battle, until he uses said tentacles to absorb Gamzee, going one-winged angel again. And you know the part where Doc Scratch said he needed to die in order to bring his master into his universe? Yeah, he meant doing a [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FusionDance Fusion Dance]] with Bec Noir Zee in order to BECOME Lord English! Think about it-both LE and Jack/Bec Noir have been referred to as as the Demon, Gamzee and LE are both very selective and prefers killing trolls/universes, one by one, and of course Doc Scratch and LE both have green pool themes, being members of the Felt
** Word of God is that Jack can change aspects of his prototyping and return his tentacles or not; he just prefers not to because they were a pain (also a nuisance for the artists to draw). Also Jack is far too short, can't reach Alternia via any known means, Gamzee is taken down by Karkat, and Doc and Jack's powers are over space, not time like Lord English's. Completely Jossed.
*** Jack is now a teleporter, Gamzee must still be alive for The Critical Moment, Lord English's powers are actually unknown, nobody ever did say he had time powers
*** Taken down =/= killed, and English collected and empowered the Felt who all have Time based powers and can time travel; it stands to reason that his powers are over at least Time.
**** Guys... I think my WMG got just got jossed-[[http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=6&p=005995 spectacularly]]

[[WMG: Jack will never be truly defeated]]
The Trolls and Kids will escape each of their sessions to the new one created by the Scratch, and (future) Jack will be left behind in the Troll's session. Jack is literally unbeatable, and the only hope is to banish him elsewhere (e.g. the troll's session) ... after the Trolls and Kids are gone, Jack will be stuck forever in a rotting incipisphere, with nothing to kill or fight. Perhaps for someone as bloodthirsty as him, it is a FateWorseThanDeath
* Doubtful, as PM now appears to be as powerful as him, and Jade may be even more so.

[[WMG: Who's blood is on Jack's hands when he enters the Troll Session?]]
* Perhaps his own? At the beginning of GrimRose VS Jack, I assumed that the scratch was near, and that it was her blood. That's jossed, and the only one he is hanging around with now is Jade, who he can't harm, and frogs, which he seemingly prefers to step on. (Albeit, his teleport powers mean he could appear to anyone and get bloodstained in no time, but the fact that he is still following Jade is important, I think.) Final point, most bloodstains on jack have been on his sword or chest, where it goes through. What possible situation would mean he needs to kill someone without a sword? Perhaps an injury to him on his hand is the cause.
** It's WV's.

[[WMG: Alpha Courtyard Droll will undergo a HeelFaceTurn.]]
The Droll has been known to be a MinionWithAnFInEvil in all three incarnations and has either made friends or attempted to make friends with the heroes before. Of course, he always remembered his allegiance to Derse in the end...but he has clearly shown misgivings with the new Dersite regime's agenda. Under their "[[Characters/HomestuckTheFeltTwo new management]]", Derse will continue to sink to lows any Derse of a normal session would never sink to, and the guilt will drive CD to helping the considerably nicer Kids defeat his former superiors.

*** D) In the middle of the Jack vs. PM showdown, Lord English arrives and [[curbstomps them both CurbStompBattle]], establishing himself as the new BigBad. It wouldn't be the first time a showdown was interrupted by the interference of a third party...

** Two scenarios seem likely

*** B) Jack ends up working for English in some fashion. English is identified as the Lord of the Angels and Jack definitely has an angelic vibe.

** Most likely, Bec's power made his personality more powerful, and/or Jaspers, as an [[CatsAreMean independent-minded cat]], wasn't really all that close to Rose.