History Headscratchers / LegendsOfTomorrow

* [[JustForPun Or rather]], their {{TimeyWimey|}} VillainBall. So, it turns out the Time Masters have been engineering their own version of YouCantFightFate in order to keep Savage in power. This is because Savage is needed to unite the Earth to prevent the Thanagarians from wiping out everyone. Did it never occur to them that they could manipulate time in order to unite the Earth in ''literally any other way''? Is a borderline OmnicidalManiac the only way that the Earth can fend off the invasion? For that matter, how does Savage keep everyone from revolting; where did he find a large enough group of people willing to kill millions and take over the world; and what makes a depopulated and war-torn but united Earth better suited to fending off alien invasion than a populous and technologically advanced Earth that hasn't been united?

** Flashpoint. Barry's alterations to the timeline could've changed the events Vixen was present for. He accidentally replaced Sara Diggle with John Diggle Jr. when he reset the timeline, so who knows how many alterations could've been made. Alternatively, Mari McCabe still became Vixen. The rules of time travel in the Arrowverse are incredibly inconsistent. Take a look at Eobard Thawne, who's still [[IncrediblyLamePun running around]] in the timeline, even in spite of the fact that he should be erased from existence since his ancestor Eddie Thawne is dead. Maybe Mari still played her role in Arrow, despite the fact that her ancestor and amulet were removed from the timeline.

* Ok, so Sara has moved on from Laurel's death, and with encouragement from her, does not rewrite reality to bring her back, having gotten closure. Sure it's great CharacterDevelopment, but um... what about Quentin, you know, your dad who's buried his daughters about 3 times now, and relapsed into alcoholism because of Laurels death? And Oliver, the guy who started killing again because of Laurel's death and still loves and grieves her? Your mom? Team Arrow? A competent D.A finally maybe? All I'm saying is that while it works, ''just for Sara'', it doesn't mean she's the only person who should get a say. I'm not complaining or anything, I just really need to know ''why'' she at least didn't talk to Quentin or Oliver about it before making her decision.

** Alright, fair enough, but I might not have been clear, I'm just asking why Sara didn't think about whether or not she was the one who should make that decision-yes there were the Reverse-Flashes, but she could've altered things so the Spear would only worked on her, or something. It's not about literally bringing Quentin or anyone else right there at that exact time, I just want to know why she didn't think about her dad or anyone else's say or feelings about the matter before making her decision.
** First off, Quentin doesn't know about the Spear of Destiny, so that's going to be hard to explain. Secondly, their whole mission is basically to destroy the Spear and not use it for any reason. Thirdly, army of Reverse-Flashes beating the living shit out of the Legends, and would flat out kill them all if he could. Can't really discuss it with Quentin or Oliver if Eobard wipes them from existence. She wasn't supposed to be using the Spear of Destiny anyway, and she can't really discuss it with her family when she has an army of murderous speedsters right in front of her. TLDR: There wasn't any time or opportunity to discuss bringing Laurel back with her family.
** In Universe it's because Sara was told that trying to bring Laurel back will just make things worse for everyone, and once she got her closure she decided to believe this, although it's up in the air as to whether or not this is actually true, since there were alterations to the timeline that ended up working out, like Lily Stein. Out of Universe it's because the Arrow staff gets priority in terms of inter series continuity (like how they basically forced forced the Oliver and Felicity wedding hijack in Crisis even though the Flash writers clearly didn't want to do this) and they are adamant that Laurel can never come back.

* When asked what she would want to do with the Loom of Fate, Sara says nothing. Did she forget about her sister? I'm sure the Loom could being her back while avoiding the "doppelganger sickness" with the Black Siren.
** Sara's gained a lot more experience and understanding of the risks and issues involved in changing the past or reality, via time travel, magic, or a combination thereof. She knows that bringing Laurel back is likely to cause unexpected problems, and doesn't want to pull at that thread. Additionally, she's pretty much come to terms with losing her sister (Season 2's vision being her pivotal moment of realisation), so doesn't really feel the desire to bring her back. It's not on her radar, and if it was, she doesn't want to risk it any more.

** That would require him revealing himself as a BadassInCharge. We don't know if the different immortals are aware of each other or each others' organizations. If you're an immortal manipulating the world from the shadows and some people charge into your plans spewing fire, you get out of there and regroup. The Legends showed up on Vandal's home turf, but Damien has nothing to gain from fighting.

** Doylist: CriticalResearchFailure.

* This site lists Steve Blum as the voice of the masked Chronos, which was likely taken from the wiki page for "The Flash" (which is NOT the official Arrowverse wiki, mind you). However, aside from these two sites, I have not been able to find any reliable sources that it is indeed Steve Blum who provides the voice, and in fact all along it may have just been [[spoiler: Dominic Purcell]].

** Nothing on IMDB for the show or Steve Blum. But a handful of articles like [[http://www.movienewsguide.com/legends-tomorrow-spoilers-comebacks-white-canarys-upcoming-swordfight/176925 this one]] do mention it. It's not in the end credits for Episode 9 either. Chronos doesn't really sound like Blum, but he's a versatile voiceover actor.

* On the show so far, GoneToTheFuture is very much applicable i.e. if a time-traveler jumps into the future, he/she won't encounter a future self but rather be confronted with a world where they disappeared however many years ago. This is what happens to Sara and Ray when they travel to Star City in 2046, and its what happens to Vixen when she travels to 1987. And therein lies the problem. Now that the Legends have extracted Vixen from her natural timeline, doesn't this mess up the timeline of ''Series/Arrow''. After all, if Amaya disappeared in 1942, then she wouldn't have had the child who would eventually become the mother/father of the 2016 Vixen, Mari McCabe, who played a brief but important role on ''Arrow'' last season. And even assuming she had a child before 1942, she took the amulet with her to the future, so it wouldn't be possible for her child or her grandchild to inherit it.

[[folder: Why doesn't professor stein recognize Eobard Thawne]]
* In the flash episode "Rogue air" Firestorm is seen helping Barry defeat the reverse flash. Now Professor Stein was half of firestorm, and would probably have seen everything that happened during the fight. So we can all assume that he would be able to recognize the reverse flash. Which brings the question up, why doesn't doesn't Professor Stein recognize. I mean he doesn't know about zoom and defiantly wouldn't know about Savitar. So when someone mentions the rogue speedster he should be able to remember the reverse flash and tell the rest of the team. And we can't use the excuse of him being old and having bad memory, he is one of the smartest people on the team.

** That might be true, but those other speedsters would be more likely to go after the flash. And besides he could at least say something to the rest of the team about that he thinks there might be a possibility that the reverse flash has returned. Also the distinct red lighting might also be a indication that he could tell the team he thinks its the reverse flash. As all the other speedsters either have blue or yellow lightning.

** First of all, we may not know how much communication there is between Team Arrow and Team Flash (though we can assume a lot, since Caitlin said they loved Laurel and Barry was very visibly upset when he first faced Black Siren, even though Caitlin has never had a scene with Laurel and Barry and her have almost never directly spoken to each other) We know how much the Legends talk to team Arrow and team Flash. They've been in contact with 2016 Team Arrow four times, when they all came back and Sara came to the cave and talked to Quinten and he told her about Laurel (I believe that was like a month later), when Oliver met Nate and Rory at the beginning of the series, when Felicity contacted them to come to help with the Invasion, and when they did come to help with the invasion. And they've contacted Team Flash once, when they helped with the invasion.

** Ok that could be possible, but in the last episode he outright stated that he saw him being erased from existence, now there is no more excuse other than that the season would be shorter if he immediately recognized him. And even if stein knew about zoom, he knew only knew about him traveling through dimensions. While Thawn is the only evil speedster in the arrowverse who can travel through time.

** While it's unlikely any of the Legends would in this specific scenario, only a few of them are opposed to killing on principal, making Stein's fears at first more justified. While even Rip would likely choose not to erase Lily given that she did help stop an alien invasion, Stein almost certainly doesn't want to take the chance. Another thing to consider is that Stein is in many cases ironically the ''most'' hardline of the Legends – if the others find out, he might be afraid ''he'd'' consider it his duty to erase Lily.
** Well lets start with the fact that time travel in the Arrowverse is so heavily plot driven it's not even funny. Erasing her might not undo the victory at her hands especially since it's highly probable that Ray and Stein could have done the same thing. The Legends were chosen specifically because they lead uneventful lives as utterly unbelievable as that is. It mean that none of them would have even played major roles in Flash S2 or Arrow S4 which is all kinds of absurd, it also means none of them ever had kids who mattered. But that was the point, killing the Legends right them wouldn't have caused any ripples. Finally erasing her wouldn't be murder, it would be erasing her. The show tries to make it clear that Cisco (who's brother was actually killed ) and Diggle (Who's daughter was turned into a son) were not being entirely rational about the scenario. I don't think they could be called heroes without having a long talk about the possibility that she could be a huge problem and just given the secrecy and how plots work most likely she will. Also isn't the tag line 'don't call us heroes'?

* Shouldn't the Legends be a bit more concerned about aliens possibly conquering the world? They haven't even mentioned this,and even if only Rip knows,why hasn't he (or Gideon) said anything?

** the Thanagarians are a "local" threat (i.e. they can only affect the Earth at a certain era in time). The Legion, fellow time travelers that can't be confined to one era or confronted when ready is the far bigger threat.
** But the Thanagrians ARE STILL A THREAT,it just seems weird that there's been no MENTION of them thus far...
** They're probably saving them for season 3.
** Nah, season 3's trying to fix time. But honestly ? A. There's been more important stuff going on then to prepare for a future invasion B. It'll probably just be one cool massive crossover with all the Arrowverse to deal with them, better then Invasion! was.

* Back to series 1. Anyone have any idea why the team don't even consider just killing off brainwashed Carter, letting him resurrect, and killing Savage? I'm really hoping there's a better reason than the writers needing PlotArmor for Savage. Is it because they're afraid that their resurrections are linked to him?

[[folder: Henrys' free skydiving lesson aversion (SPOILERS)]]
* In "Moonshot" Henry blows the cargo bay door to adjust the angle of the waverider, which throws him out and kills him, yet in the previous episode, Jax held on to the railing RIGHT NEXT TO THE LEVER and survived a similar incident blowing out Mental!Firestorm, the reson he knows this would work is because he knew the ship inside out, so surely the same kind of thing would have a chance of making sure Henry survived, my HS is why he didn't at least try that?

* In the Brave New World created by the legion of Doom, cold fusion exists, there is no global warming and some previously endangered species are saved thanks to Eobard Thawne. Even if they aren't heroes, the world seems to be a better place. So yeah, no superheroes and the bad guys had petty revenge on the Legends but still. Trying to get back the real one looks like a bad thing for me. What the point of destroying a better world just because it was created by bad people ? Especially when a failure means the destruction of time itself ...

*** If reality were rewritten thawne and no one else, he wouldnt have treated his employees like slaves, and the world would still be better than the original, sure there would still be no super heroes, but there wouldn't be a need for them. Every negative change to reality was done by the other members of the legion of doom.

* Why exactly did Thawne get Stein to invent and build a machine that could destroy the spear? He both has the spear and knows how to use it, he could just will a machine that could do it into existence at any time. Literally every risk that he is building the machine to protect against would be made impossible if he just used the damn spear and made it so. Making Stein invent and build the machine just gives his partners and the legends time to realize and stop it, and the only reason they even have the ability to do so in the first place is because he outright let them retain it! Why not just use the spear and make everyone who knows about it besides himself not ever want to use it, then destroy it? Why keep his partners around when he can use the spear and has had apparently months of alone time to use it with no one to stop him?

* Why exactly do the legends think that traveling back in time to prevent the legion from getting the spear will work? The spear alters reality itself, including time, so why would the legion have left the past prior to them obtaining the spear intact as it was? Building on that, if this was possible then why would Thawne not immediately realize this flaw in his reality warping, considering he's an experienced time traveler who's traveled through time and made changes more than literally anyone else in the known reality?

** But the spear dictates reality itself. The order of what dictates reality should logically be The Spear > Causality/Time. Even time travel is irrelevant by comparison since the spear remakes the original event itself into whatever the user wants without them having to bother with causality and timelines. Logically, the user should be able to make it so nobody in history ever travels back to it. The only way that anyone could ever go back and change anything is if the user of the Spear did not specifically dictate that it didn't happen, which would be a pretty huge oversight to make for the most experienced time traveler ever, Thawne. Furthermore, since the spear alters reality itself, there's no excuse for Thawne to not have removed the previous timeline entirely and simply retained himself exactly the same, just to eradicate any possible traces that could be a threat. The spear inherently doesn't care about paradoxes, otherwise it couldn't possibly function to begin with. Doomworld itself wouldn't be possible if everything up until the legion getting the spear happened in the Doomworld timeline, since none of the Doomworld legends became legends.

** Stein was not present and it's possible that the color of the lightning simply wasn't a detail any of the other Legends thought to mention. After all it's never brought up that you can ID a speedster by the color of their lightning. The real snag here is not knowing how much communicating Team's Flash, Arrow and the Legends actually have. Clearly word got to Sarah almost immediately that her sister was dead, and while strictly speaking the Legends have almost no excuse for not coming home between every mission it's pretty obvious they aren't doing that. Still Nick just joined, knows Oliver's secret and I'm sure Oliver knows about Eobard. At this point without knowing what Future Barry's message was the fact that it could include some combination of Eobard and Darhk being a team is probably the best assumption as to why Stein hasn't spoken.

** It's also ruled over by Thawne, a petty and cruel man who works his employees like slaves, has super powers and literally nobody to keep him in check, and is prone to fits of murder. It lets Thawne be the hero he's always wanted, at the expense of killing anyone who might challenge and threaten him. By the same token, Darhk is still an evil megalomaniac who rules the city with an iron fist, turned Amaya and Sarah into his personal assassins, and killed all of Team Arrow, for no reason than they stopped him in the normal timeline.

* Season 3 introduces another such issue: because Nora stole Amaya's totem, the timeline eventually changed so Mari never inherited it and became a vigilante without powers. The only issues with this shown in the episode are that she got injured while saving some people from a burning building. But shouldn't this have had a larger impact? After all, in the Arrow season 4 episode "Taken" Mari helps Oliver fight Damien Dahrk, and destroys Dahrks idol just as Dahrk is about to kill Oliver. Now imagine a timeline in which she never had her totem. Dahrk would have won that fight and Oliver would have died.

** Really because keypads didn't exist in her time and there would be no reason for her to have a numeric password. A safe would have a single code not one per member. The Arrowverse has been shown to have some differences with the real world however and it's not impossible that in addition to that the JSA was simply ahead of their time. It wouldn't be the first Justice group to have technology unknown to the rest of the planet.

[[/folder]]