History YMMV / TheIliad

3rd Sep '17 12:43:26 PM Peteman
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** There is a famous scene when Andromake suggests that Hector fight from the relative safety of the walls instead, pointing out the she is a stranger in the city and neither she nor their son has anyone else to rely on if Hector dies. He declines, tries to hug his child, but the child is terrified not recognizing his father in the scary helmet. He takes off the helmet, and says something like: "Gods if I have ever pleased you, now hear my prayer: let my son grow up to be a great man so that he people say he is greater than his father." To the modern mind the continuation is a brutal aversion of cuteness, to the Greeks it was probably natural. "And let him come home safely from combat with the bloody armor of his slain enemy and make his mummy glad." Hector does not mention himself in this wish for his son's future. He probably does not expect to live to see it.

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** There is a famous scene when Andromake suggests that Hector fight from the relative safety of the walls instead, pointing out the she is a stranger in the city and neither she nor their son has anyone else to rely on if Hector dies. He declines, tries to hug his child, but the child is terrified not recognizing his father in the scary helmet. He takes off the helmet, and says something like: "Gods if I have ever pleased you, now hear my prayer: let my son grow up to be a great man so that he people say he is greater than his father." To the modern mind the continuation is a brutal an aversion of cuteness, to the Greeks it was probably natural. "And let him come home safely from combat with the bloody armor of his slain enemy and make his mummy glad." Hector does not mention himself in this wish for his son's future. He probably does not expect to live to see it.
28th Aug '17 2:07:54 PM shatterstar
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** Helen needs a hug.

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** Helen needs a hug. An entire war happens because of her decision, as well as the fact that the other Trojan women clearly dislike her (with good reason).



** JerkassWoobie: Achilles, after Patroclus is killed. This is even more prominent if you think they are lovers.

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** JerkassWoobie: Achilles, after Patroclus is killed.killed because of his arrogance. This is even more prominent if you think they are lovers.
28th Aug '17 2:05:47 PM shatterstar
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** Cassandra, especially knowing her final fate in Theatre/TheOresteia.

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** Cassandra, especially knowing her final fate in Theatre/TheOresteia.Theatre/TheOresteia.
** JerkassWoobie: Achilles, after Patroclus is killed. This is even more prominent if you think they are lovers.
5th Aug '17 7:32:22 AM shatterstar
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* HoYay: Achilles and Patroclus. In the book, they're nothing more than really close friends. And yet people have been speculating on them being lovers since ancient times.

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* HoYay: Achilles and Patroclus. In the book, they're nothing more than really close friends. And yet people have been speculating on them being lovers since ancient times. Creator/{{Plato}} apparently thinks so.
4th Aug '17 9:59:01 AM shatterstar
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* EnsembleDarkhorse: Aeneas. Son of Venus and one of the few Trojan survivors of the war, he's a minor hero who only has two major scenes (both of which ends with him being rescued by the Gods). And yet the Romans would write [[Literature/TheAeneid a whole epic about him.]]
** Cassandra, who only has one scene in the book but promptly milks it for all its worth. The fact that she is probably [[TheWoobie the second most sympathetic]] to modern audience after Hector also helps. This reaches to the point that her role is usually expanded either by combine with a lot of the other female characters at Troy, wrote her many more scenes or just outright took the scene or combine the work with another one of its sequels.
* FanPreferredCouple: Helen/Hector. Helen is/was the queen of Sparta (though before [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy the Doric invasion and the setting up of the warrior society people associate with the name]]) and derides Paris for letting Hector do all the fighting. Hector is a CrazyAwesome warrior who [[KnightInShiningArmor treats her courteously]], [[HonorBeforeReason even though he has every right not to]]. Since Helen openly wishes that Paris was more like Hector and Andromache is rather flat as a character, you can see where people are coming from.

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* EnsembleDarkhorse: EnsembleDarkhorse:
**
Aeneas. Son of Venus and one of the few Trojan survivors of the war, he's a minor hero who only has two major scenes (both of which ends with him being rescued by the Gods). And yet the Romans would write [[Literature/TheAeneid a whole epic about him.]]
** Cassandra, who only has one scene in the book but promptly milks it for all its worth. The fact that she is probably [[TheWoobie the second most sympathetic]] to modern audience after Hector also helps. This reaches to the point that her role is usually expanded either by combine with a lot of the other female characters at Troy, wrote her many more scenes or just outright took the scene or / combine the work with another character in one of its sequels.
* FanPreferredCouple: FanPreferredCouple:
**
Helen/Hector. Helen is/was the queen of Sparta (though before [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy the Doric invasion and the setting up of the warrior society people associate with the name]]) and derides Paris for letting Hector do all the fighting. Hector is a CrazyAwesome warrior who [[KnightInShiningArmor treats her courteously]], [[HonorBeforeReason even though he has every right not to]]. Since Helen openly wishes that Paris was more like Hector and Andromache is rather flat as a character, you can see where people are coming from.from.
** Achilles and Patroclus, even from ancient Greek times. Their scenes together are probably one of the most heart-wrenching in the book.
9th Apr '17 5:21:17 PM Varia_Heimt
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** Some believe Achilles and Patroclus to have been not just best friends, but lovers, which may add another dimension to Achilles' behavior after Patroclus' death. This interpretation is mentioned in Plato's ''Literature/{{Symposium}}'', making it OlderThanFeudalism itself.

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** Some believe Achilles and Patroclus to have been not just best friends, but lovers, which may add another dimension to Achilles' behavior after Patroclus' death. This interpretation is mentioned in Plato's ''Literature/{{Symposium}}'', making it OlderThanFeudalism itself.itself, and more recently was the basis for ''Literature/{{SongOfAchilles}}''.
29th Oct '16 7:38:25 PM cdenton
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** What happens if in war a soldier surrenders and begs to be taken as a hostage? Kill him anyway, especially because if you're victorious you'll get to loot his home anyway! This lesson gets spelled out twice by the Greek heroes, even.

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** What happens if in war a soldier surrenders and begs to be taken as a hostage? Kill him anyway, him, especially because if you're victorious you'll get to loot his home anyway! This lesson gets spelled out twice by the Greek heroes, even.
29th Oct '16 7:37:11 PM cdenton
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Added DiffLines:

** What happens if in war a soldier surrenders and begs to be taken as a hostage? Kill him anyway, especially because if you're victorious you'll get to loot his home anyway! This lesson gets spelled out twice by the Greek heroes, even.
28th Oct '16 4:18:19 PM dlchen145
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* FanPreferredCouple: Helen/Hector. Helen is/was the queen of Sparta (though before [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy the Doric invasion and the setting up of the warrior society people associate with the name]]) and derides Paris for letting Hector do all the fighting. Hector is a CrazyAwesome [[{{Badass}} warrior]] who [[KnightInShiningArmor treats her courteously]], [[HonorBeforeReason even though he has every right not to]]. Since Helen openly wishes that Paris was more like Hector and Andromache is rather flat as a character, you can see where people are coming from.

to:

* FanPreferredCouple: Helen/Hector. Helen is/was the queen of Sparta (though before [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy the Doric invasion and the setting up of the warrior society people associate with the name]]) and derides Paris for letting Hector do all the fighting. Hector is a CrazyAwesome [[{{Badass}} warrior]] warrior who [[KnightInShiningArmor treats her courteously]], [[HonorBeforeReason even though he has every right not to]]. Since Helen openly wishes that Paris was more like Hector and Andromache is rather flat as a character, you can see where people are coming from.
18th Oct '16 2:56:31 PM cpslck
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Added DiffLines:

*** In particular, going to the Greek camp alone in the dark to beg Achilles for the body of Hector. "I have endured what no one on earth has ever done before I put my lips to the hands of the man who killed my son."
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.TheIliad